1- I read the shipment difference was 8.5 million at peak. Still it's sold that matters, Initially there was a 5 million gap, Peak 360 gap was 8.1 million, currently 3.9 million, and I didn't check after the adjustment, but I bet before the 360 Slim launch it was even lower (3.5 maybe?).

and what does that have to do with our discussion? 

You compared sold consoles in Septemeber 2009, to shipped consoles in 2010. Thats an unfair comparision, and Squilliam and I both pointed that out.

well because your parents did not everybody else did

my dad follows finance news so he knows all about it and as i'm so into it,he keeps a bit of info too doesn't mean everybody does

Nintendo 64 has ninty name but did everybody knew NES and SNES were from  the same sompany,no they wouldn't know

its simple its like when you seacrh on google for something and find alot of acronyms which we don't know full abreviations on.Its the same when a new product comes in with a new acronym or name

Your 17 right? So you were born in 1993/1994 right? You didn't even exist during the time of NES, and since people don't remember before 3, your memorable lifetime was past the death of the SNES. So I'm just going to ignore this one LOL.

 
Funny you mention the delay in the N64 and the lack of third party support as your reason why the N64 failed, didn't the Wii do the exact same thing and become successful?

again you didn't understand what the other person is trying to say

yes wii also didn't perfect their systems but their competitor made even bigger mistakes with the price way out of line and plus it too had low game support

So then these compeditor mistakes are then bigger factors to the success of the Nintendo product correct? If both Wii and N64 suffered from a lack of 3rd party support, and a delay in release, but Wii managed to be successful, wouldn't the compeditor error be a more deciding factor? I listened, this is my counter arguement..

try to judge different situations differently

my point was the market leader made mistake and other other went through,in Wii and PS3's case both made mistake but SONY's decision to go after blu-ray royalties had them PS3 even more expensive

So this is the bigger factor then?

4- All you did was insult my comment, but didn't provide a counter arguement.

i don't need to most of the times,you prove yourself wrong that i don't have to contribute much.

and i donot insult your comment,your comment is insulting itself

demeaning... Lets keep this garbage out of the debate and start clean.

Also I don't think the arcade will go down to $100, but $130. The difference in price is the hard drive, and just like the cost of the 360, the cost of the hard drive goes down too. It's not necessarily in increments of $100.

that again proves your argument of 360 having a bigger Pricecut than PS3

never said bigger, just equally impactfull

again you first didn't need to start this nonsensicle debate but you did and then you corrected yourself and the extra stuff is necesary that you go about,the opposite person didn't want to debate the first thing you said and still go on about Hard drive..............lol

You said my theory is stupid, and now you critisize me for countering? When do you expect of me, to be submissive of your opinion? Also this comment was actually agreeing with you. You said "MS won't do a bigger pricecut and they can't,they can't make a bigger price cut than $100 which would take 360 4gb to $100 and that wouldn't happen as they would not push that much at this stage" I agree, the arcade will most likely not drop to $100 in the event of a price cut, but if the 360 Elite drops from $300 to $200, the Arcade will probably drop from $200 to $130 or so.

I tried to explain, so you'd understand my point, but I failed. So what do you want me to do? How can I explain my points better to you, but make my comment shorter at the same time?

5- I made mistakes by choice? huh? That wouldn't be a mistake anymore.

yeah it wasn't but yu showed like it was

demeaning..

Okay seriously, stop with the hate, I know our past debates lead to you being banned on these forums, but please debate. Don't return every comment I had with essenially "lies""your bad" or "bias." I want to have a proper debate..

well if you want a proper debate then debate properly which you don't and its not even a debatewhen the opposite person doesn't listen

I do listen, but I think your having difficulties understanding my counter arguements.. They are direct replies to your points, I'll try to make them simpler in the futue.

 
BTW MS buying Kinects was a joke, but if they can afford 3M Kinects with their marketing budget, they must expect the peripheral to sell moderatly well.

expectations and the ability to buy products with their marketing budget have no correlation

again you post alot more than you need to

indication: you could have just said the MS buying kinect was a joke but you went further and beyond

Okay I won't joke with you anymore if it bothers you.

6- So PS3 sales jumping from 150k weekly sales (which it held for months) to 240k weekly sales from Sept 11th to Oct 2nd was for what reason? Unlike Halo which spiked sales for 1 or two weeks, Move holds it up. Console bundles are not limited, and it appeals to a broad audience.

well if you know the adjustments were tracked

VGC just put there as they thought that is where the shipped numbers came by

Nintendo's conference shows an increase in PS3 sales after Move, I think VGChartz analysts are better at predicting sales then both of us, they do this for a living, and we come on this website to read their analys's.

but the shipped numbers were more than VGC numbers even in the previous quarters so PS3 was actually selling well even before

Shipped numbers will always be above sold numbers. How can a distributer sell consoles it doesn't have? I think you meant to explain something else, but your missing something in your sentance.

Two weeks ago I didn't think Move would budge PS3 sales, and I was wrong, just like VGChartz was before the adjustment.

and you are wrong now

cause VGC adjustments are just assumptions.their number and shipped numbers has discrepencies so they adjust in their as they thugh this cause higher shipped numbers but PS3 shipped number were already more than VGC in the previous quarters

ioi itself said that they didn't track the PS3 sales and because of the higher PS3 shipped numbers,they just assumed and entered the number aorund MOVE's release

but that assumption is wrong as they difference in VGC and shipped numbers was from even before MOVE's release

Below

No look at Nintendo's press conference, they have charts showing PS3 sales jumped during Move, I thought that too, that the Move bump as too high, but it wasn't really. Before Move, 360 was outselling the PS3.

MOVE boosted PS3's sales but not to the fact as sown by VGC,they just made adjustmeant on asuumptions

and ninty's press conference didn't show real numbers just charts

Nintendo presented values, go look over the press conference yourself. Also those charts have Y-axis values, and PS3/360/Wii sales were compared for overlapping 2009/2010 periods. It's pretty solid evidence.

before MOVE,PS3 was still outselling the 360.

Not according to VGChartz, and Nintendo's Press Conference.

we just thought that it didn't cause VGC numbers were wrong and when shipped numbers came in and difference showed,to hide it the adjustments were made around to MOVE's release to justify it

but the difference was even in the previous quarter's shipped and VGC results so the the adjustments are right as the whole figures but not as weekly figures showed

I'm going to trust Nintendo's Press Conference and VGChartz numbers over your assumptions. They do this for a living, and we are only their subordinates.

I don't understand that underlined bit, people thought Kinect was a man toy? First of all, whats a man toy, and if your refering to the hardcore audience, exactly what is it about Dance Central and Kinect Adventures that appeals to the hardcore audience??

yes i meant hardcore audience and i didn't say kinect was a man toy but 360 which is the platform on which kinect is being played on

So wouldn't this broaden the audience? I'm sure a lot of casual gamers dunno what a 360 is

Kinect is not an all in one package? huh? It's 1 camera, there is no second peice. Move is not an all in one package, and purchase options can be confusing for that.

sums up your argument,you are just stuck on 360 vs PS3

Thread Topic: When do you think ps3 will outsell 360

enought said

nobody is here talking about MOVE.this is what you do outseide arguments to jsutify your failing arguments and going offtopic

kinect is one itself but it isn't like wii,one on package console afrom the starting

how much ever MS tries to launch it as a new plaform,it will have pre-image because it is to be played on 360

wii is seen as one package of motion gaming,not 360 and kinect

But were not comparing the success of Wii with Kinect, were comparing the console pushing abilities of the PS3 Move to the 360 Kinect, and how that will affect the topic of the thread. Kinect may not be as popular as the Wii, but compared to Move it's a big compeditor.

Also Move is expensive too. Both charge a $100 extra when bundled with a console, the only difference is standalone Kinect costs $150. However the PS3 Move bundles only account for 1 move controller, no navigation controller ($30 extra), and if you play with friends, a second controller is $40? (right?), plus a second navigation controller ($30). So both peripherals are expensive, but Move seems to be pushing a lot of consoles, I don't see why Kinect won't.

you fail again,you will be stcuk with 360 and PS3 all its life won't you?

keep move out of here

Refer to Thread topic. If Move pushes consoles, and so does Kinect, both are factors.

and again MOVE and Eye cost $80

Nope, $90. Move is $50 in the states, and the PS Eye is $40. This is also without a game.

nd it can be played on many of games you are already buying

Yea...okay, but it's still $90.

and the NAV and extra MOVE are your choice

keep trying to make it look more expensive and twist info to prove that point you want to prove but you will fail again and again

My point was Move options add up. You make the arguement that Kinect is expensive, and brush off my counter arguement that Move can cost a lot too. Thats not debating, thats just convincing yourself your right, and ignoring everything else. Add the $30 sub controller to play many Move games, add a second Move controller with a sub controller (Kinect is 2 players remember), and all of a sudden Move costs $170, and with other options it could cost more.

What problems about Kinect are you refering to? and since kinect appeals to a casual audience, I don't think it's appeal will be limited to the 2 month period before christmas 2010.

the casual audience hops on the COOL bandwagon and popular,MS will market it big till chrismas  and it will be popular but will go down once the party season ends and casual makert doesn't follow gaming all year round

 So why did the casual market follow Wii since 2006, 4 consecutive years round? Kinect will not be as big as the Wii, but there is no reason for it to stop selling after christmas, and for next holiday season.

It's going to be pushing consoles all year round.

lmao

you are so optimistic and so supportive of what you want to succeed bu it won't and nowhere near an year round

 demeaning. Saying you disagree is enough, I mean you do critisize me for adding extra commentary and isn't this the same idea, only insulting now?

As for your opinion on Wii, thats your opinion. I know a lot of people who bought a Wii day 1 and still love it. Hardcore gamers might get bored of it, but the vast majority of the Wii audience is not a hardcore gamer.So who knows what they are thinking. I bet a lot of fitness nuts who bought a Wii Fit look at Kinect as a much more efficient exercise machine.

hardcore gamer or not,people get bored of things.they find it COOL and dop on but once it loses coolness,the casual audience goes down

 Again, Wii is still selling well, so is the DS.

What advice do you have for me? Look I don't unsult you, or acuse you of things, I keep to the topic at hand, and all I ask in return is you do the same. I do not want a repeat of your behaviour last time.

keep to the topic at hand................lmao

just look at where the topic has gone while at your hand

So comparing the console pushing abilities of Move to Kinect is off topic, when the topic is console sales....hmmm... and I guess demeaning me isn't?

you go way beyond topic and write walls of text.i have pointed this in this reply itself so learn from it

I have no clue what your talking about in the underlined part at the end. Who told me to keep out of threads, and bringing what up again and again.

i did anddid again in this reply,you go way beond what is neede to be discussed and bring all thig to prove your failing arguments

I don't understand this "you should also consider what others told you to keep out of their threads and disucssing which you bring up again and again"

What right do you have to tell me to keep out of threads, and discuss? I follow forum rules, I beleive the point of forums is to discuss topics.

I also don't understand: "and you don't help any argument and you should know that before telling others"

I should know what, before telling others what? Just because you don't agree with my arguement, or comprehend my points, does not mean I don't contribute. How are you any better then me?

Sorry I don't mean to insult you here, but you really should proof read or something before you post. Just going to underline what I don't understand.

thats what you do,don't understand and even write a wall of tect on it and go beyond the topic at hand

Your sentance didn't make sence. Put that in word, and it will underline it in green and ask you to revise. It's called a sentance fragment. It's your english I'm having trouble with, not your points, thats why I ask you to proof read. I can't read whats Illegible.

I do listen, I debate. I don't take others opinions without supporting evidence and accept it as a garenteed situation.

you do not listen and you do not take other opinion,you just push your's down other throat and want them to believe you

I do not expect you to beleive in what I beleive. I just expect you to accept arguements, instead of brush them off. Your free to your own opinion, just like I am.

Looking at the debate, I think your just having trouble comprehending my comments. Just read over them carefully, when I respond, I am responding to your comments.

PS3 sales have risen because of Move, I listened to your VGChartz numbers are off point, and I replied thats not quite true if you ever see some graphs from Nintendo's Press Conference (which shows PS3 sales jump after the launch of Move). Just because I don't agree, and respond with a counter arguement, doesn't mean I don't listen.

a perfect exmaple you got my point but even the above in this post you went over how they showed increased sales from 15th september,that wasn't necessary

ninty conference reply was enough

but even that doesn't prove my point wrong as ninty didn't show figures just charts

Look over Nintendo's press conference again, they may not have given exact weekly figures as they are hard to track, but graphs have Y-axis values, and Nintendo did state where there console placed with respect to the other two.

advice: go and compare VGC and shipped number for the last few quarters and youn will get know the truth

and if VGC was correct then why did they get the numbers wrong initially and where did the number come after sony's result for the adjustments

VGChartz underestimated Move and poorly hypothesized PS3 console sales post Move. Also some sales come in from new data going back 2 years in regions in the Middle East, Africa, and Asia. The 1 million added PS3 sales were mostly not Move, Move only boosted sales by 60-80k the few weeks since launch.

the answer is what ioi said,they didn't track it.just because the shipped number were high they assumed and made adjustments but the difference betwen VGC and Shipped number was already there in last quarters  and so the final answer

PS3 was already selling well

Move came and boosted those number but not to the amount what we have been shown by VGC

 So Nintendo lied in their press conference too? You know thats a serious crime Nintendo commited then, with severe financial punishments. I doubt Sony or Nintendo Press conference data is false, and VGChartz data is based of that you know.

I don't think you understand because you usually don't come back with a counter arguement, usually you just brush off what I have to say and make a new point.

i always do reply to you and do it individually to your different points

i brush off only when you are stuck on the same thing and never change

its like a kid who say he wants a gift,his mom says its expesive and he will get it later andthe kid replies he want it now.its like he didn't understand what his mom told him.(just an example)

this is what you do never take in what others say and post the same thing and try to prove it in different ways

I only repeat comments if you ignored them without reasoning. You don't throw out valid points in a debate. Also many of your responces, are not responsces to my points, but designed to demean me. 

don't try so hard

I was making the point that the Product reliability and sales cancel each other out.

Basically saying the sales figures are good enough for me with out all the extra bull. If I see that ps3 shipped or sales pass up xbox that will be the determining factor.

AS far as I'm concerned it's going to be a close fight unless kinect starts a casual following.  Which I think out of all the new products is the most likely. I got kinect and it's good for when friends are over and the sh-t works your arse out. I'm in shape and I'm sore after playing harder leves in kinect adventures two days in a row.

*sigh*

Yet what I say is drowned out in this argument.

YLOD was  a problem with PS3 but nowhere near what RROD was.RROD was hell

so you saying that they cancel each other out is either you lying or delusional

yeah its going to be a close fight but you don't have to say^^^^^ to support it as its just not true

and what is the additional Kinect experience you put in your reply,is that to make me believe that Kinect is going to be big,well there are far more things than that will make kinect big.

Help me? Please!! LEMME FREE FROM THIS ARGUEMENT!!