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Forums - General Discussion - Ed Milliband is the new leader of the UK Labour Party

Munkeh111 said:

I can't claim to know much about politics, but Ed Miliband just seems unelectable. There is quite a lot about him that says to me that he won't be PM, he just doesn't seem right. I think this will just leave the Tories with a nice large majority in the next election, despite the hatred of the cuts (which I don't think go far enough anyway) because he is not the kind of candidate who is going to take voters from the Tories


he doesnt actually need to take voters from the Tories actually, 35% of the electorate didnt vote at the last election, plus the Lib Dems are on 13% atm in some polls, by getting more people to vote and just taking Lib Dem votes would get him pretty close, floating voters are always a factor to boot, no reason they wouldnt switch to him from Cameron if all they care about is presentation.



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Homer_Simpson said:
Munkeh111 said:

I can't claim to know much about politics, but Ed Miliband just seems unelectable. There is quite a lot about him that says to me that he won't be PM, he just doesn't seem right. I think this will just leave the Tories with a nice large majority in the next election, despite the hatred of the cuts (which I don't think go far enough anyway) because he is not the kind of candidate who is going to take voters from the Tories


he doesnt actually need to take voters from the Tories actually, 35% of the electorate didnt vote at the last election, plus the Lib Dems are on 13% atm in some polls, by getting more people to vote and just taking Lib Dem votes would get him pretty close, floating voters are always a factor to boot, no reason they wouldnt switch to him from Cameron if all they care about is presentation.

The lower the voter turn out the more likely a Conservative/Tory government will win the election. Young people and lower classes do not vote as frequently as engaged upper educated aristocrats who always vote for the Tories.



Homer_Simpson said:
Kantor said:
Homer_Simpson said:

Harold Wilson was a very good PM imo, only PM since WW2 who is better is Attlee.

*coughThatchercough*

Yeah, yeah, I know, everyone hates Thatcher and yet bizzarely voted her in three times and repeatedly vote for her as one of the best PMs of the 20th century.

Interestingly, despite my clear hatred for the Labour Party, I would agree with you that Attlee was brilliant. He was from the age of a Labour Party that knew what the hell it was doing. I would put him below only Churchill and Thatcher for best PMs since WWII (if we can count Churchill's leadership during the war which, despite your Toryphobia, I hope you can acknowledge as brilliant and inspirational).

Churchill was a great war leader, but he was not a good PM (in general terms)

Attlee's government created the welfare state after WW2 had devastated the UK, and whilst we had little money and lots of debt, it is probably the greatest achievement of the UK since WW2 was won in fact. 

Thatcher was a vile creature, she raped and pillaged the state and the working class, the UK is still suffering from the mass inequality that she created.

Wilson was good because he stopped us from going to Vietnam with the yanks and his government gave people more social freedoms and civil liberties. 

Attlee did, however, fight the Greek Civil War despite an economic crisis. He was perhaps too determined to fight Communism. But yes, the setup of the welfare state and NHS was a high point for the Labour Party and for Britain, and the inevitable abuse and rape of the welfare state was a low point for both. Every brilliant scheme will have those who try to take advantage of it.

Thatcher... now call me elitist, but what she did was right. She gave the working class a good kick up the arse and told them to stop going on strike every week, she kept inflation extremely low during a financial crisis, unemployment was high but that was hardly her fault, she stood up to the imperialists in Europe, she crushed the trade unions, she won the Falklands War, and poll tax wasn't a brilliant idea but wasn't as bad as all Labour supporters make it out to be. It was basically Council Tax, just less socialist in nature.

If it wasn't for Thatcher's ruthless free market capitalism, Gordon would have destroyed this country long ago. Or perhaps he never would have come to power. Thatcher was an alternative to a far-left, disorganised and confused Labour party, and kept control of the country and made it prosper during some of the most difficult times since the Second World War. Then, as now, too many years of Labour had made the country weak and lazy, and it needed a good punch from the Conservative Party to get it up and working again. Cameron isn't providing that punch, but he can't, because the problems left by New Labour go beyond the broken mentality of the people.



(Former) Lead Moderator and (Eternal) VGC Detective

Homer_Simpson said:
Munkeh111 said:

I can't claim to know much about politics, but Ed Miliband just seems unelectable. There is quite a lot about him that says to me that he won't be PM, he just doesn't seem right. I think this will just leave the Tories with a nice large majority in the next election, despite the hatred of the cuts (which I don't think go far enough anyway) because he is not the kind of candidate who is going to take voters from the Tories


he doesnt actually need to take voters from the Tories actually, 35% of the electorate didnt vote at the last election, plus the Lib Dems are on 13% atm in some polls, by getting more people to vote and just taking Lib Dem votes would get him pretty close, floating voters are always a factor to boot, no reason they wouldnt switch to him from Cameron if all they care about is presentation.

From personal experience (anecdotal evidence, I know), Lib Dem supporters despise the Labour Party and everyone in it. They hated Gordon Brown, so they'll probably hate Ed Miliband. We'll have to wait for the first polls to see. And when low-earner wages start to increase, Lib Dem support will slowly begin to rise again, though they will still lose seats in 2015.



(Former) Lead Moderator and (Eternal) VGC Detective

Kantor said:
Homer_Simpson said:
Munkeh111 said:

I can't claim to know much about politics, but Ed Miliband just seems unelectable. There is quite a lot about him that says to me that he won't be PM, he just doesn't seem right. I think this will just leave the Tories with a nice large majority in the next election, despite the hatred of the cuts (which I don't think go far enough anyway) because he is not the kind of candidate who is going to take voters from the Tories


he doesnt actually need to take voters from the Tories actually, 35% of the electorate didnt vote at the last election, plus the Lib Dems are on 13% atm in some polls, by getting more people to vote and just taking Lib Dem votes would get him pretty close, floating voters are always a factor to boot, no reason they wouldnt switch to him from Cameron if all they care about is presentation.

From personal experience (anecdotal evidence, I know), Lib Dem supporters despise the Labour Party and everyone in it. They hated Gordon Brown, so they'll probably hate Ed Miliband. We'll have to wait for the first polls to see. And when low-earner wages start to increase, Lib Dem support will slowly begin to rise again, though they will still lose seats in 2015.

most Lib Dem voters I know hate the Tories much more than they dislike Labour...

and low wages rising? I will believe that when I see it, inequality and social mobility in the UK are devastated by Thatcher, Majour, Blair and Browns economic policies which were decidedly Right Wing, not Left at all.

the Lib Dems will do well to get 40 seats at the next election imo



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Kantor said:
Homer_Simpson said:
Kantor said:
Homer_Simpson said:

Harold Wilson was a very good PM imo, only PM since WW2 who is better is Attlee.

*coughThatchercough*

Yeah, yeah, I know, everyone hates Thatcher and yet bizzarely voted her in three times and repeatedly vote for her as one of the best PMs of the 20th century.

Interestingly, despite my clear hatred for the Labour Party, I would agree with you that Attlee was brilliant. He was from the age of a Labour Party that knew what the hell it was doing. I would put him below only Churchill and Thatcher for best PMs since WWII (if we can count Churchill's leadership during the war which, despite your Toryphobia, I hope you can acknowledge as brilliant and inspirational).

Churchill was a great war leader, but he was not a good PM (in general terms)

Attlee's government created the welfare state after WW2 had devastated the UK, and whilst we had little money and lots of debt, it is probably the greatest achievement of the UK since WW2 was won in fact. 

Thatcher was a vile creature, she raped and pillaged the state and the working class, the UK is still suffering from the mass inequality that she created.

Wilson was good because he stopped us from going to Vietnam with the yanks and his government gave people more social freedoms and civil liberties. 

Attlee did, however, fight the Greek Civil War despite an economic crisis. He was perhaps too determined to fight Communism. But yes, the setup of the welfare state and NHS was a high point for the Labour Party and for Britain, and the inevitable abuse and rape of the welfare state was a low point for both. Every brilliant scheme will have those who try to take advantage of it.

Thatcher... now call me elitist, but what she did was right. She gave the working class a good kick up the arse and told them to stop going on strike every week, she kept inflation extremely low during a financial crisis, unemployment was high but that was hardly her fault, she stood up to the imperialists in Europe, she crushed the trade unions, she won the Falklands War, and poll tax wasn't a brilliant idea but wasn't as bad as all Labour supporters make it out to be. It was basically Council Tax, just less socialist in nature.

If it wasn't for Thatcher's ruthless free market capitalism, Gordon would have destroyed this country long ago. Or perhaps he never would have come to power. Thatcher was an alternative to a far-left, disorganised and confused Labour party, and kept control of the country and made it prosper during some of the most difficult times since the Second World War. Then, as now, too many years of Labour had made the country weak and lazy, and it needed a good punch from the Conservative Party to get it up and working again. Cameron isn't providing that punch, but he can't, because the problems left by New Labour go beyond the broken mentality of the people.

you are quite obviously elitist and out of touch with both normal people and what Left Wing politics actually is.



Homer_Simpson said:
Kantor said:
Homer_Simpson said:
Munkeh111 said:

I can't claim to know much about politics, but Ed Miliband just seems unelectable. There is quite a lot about him that says to me that he won't be PM, he just doesn't seem right. I think this will just leave the Tories with a nice large majority in the next election, despite the hatred of the cuts (which I don't think go far enough anyway) because he is not the kind of candidate who is going to take voters from the Tories


he doesnt actually need to take voters from the Tories actually, 35% of the electorate didnt vote at the last election, plus the Lib Dems are on 13% atm in some polls, by getting more people to vote and just taking Lib Dem votes would get him pretty close, floating voters are always a factor to boot, no reason they wouldnt switch to him from Cameron if all they care about is presentation.

From personal experience (anecdotal evidence, I know), Lib Dem supporters despise the Labour Party and everyone in it. They hated Gordon Brown, so they'll probably hate Ed Miliband. We'll have to wait for the first polls to see. And when low-earner wages start to increase, Lib Dem support will slowly begin to rise again, though they will still lose seats in 2015.

most Lib Dem voters I know hate the Tories much more than they dislike Labour...

and low wages rising? I will believe that when I see it, inequality and social mobility in the UK are devastated by Thatcher, Majour, Blair and Browns economic policies which were decidedly Right Wing, not Left at all.

the Lib Dems will do well to get 40 seats at the next election imo

Thatcher had to do what she did, Major just continued what Thatcher did, Blair implemented the national minimum wage, and Brown, though he stupidly got rid of the 10% starting rate, did murder all of the super-rich with 50p tax. I figured he didn't go further left because of his delightful New Labour Chancellor. I wish Darling was Labour leader, for no other reason than that he's adorable and completely harmless.



(Former) Lead Moderator and (Eternal) VGC Detective

Kantor said:
Homer_Simpson said:
Kantor said:
Homer_Simpson said:
Munkeh111 said:

I can't claim to know much about politics, but Ed Miliband just seems unelectable. There is quite a lot about him that says to me that he won't be PM, he just doesn't seem right. I think this will just leave the Tories with a nice large majority in the next election, despite the hatred of the cuts (which I don't think go far enough anyway) because he is not the kind of candidate who is going to take voters from the Tories


he doesnt actually need to take voters from the Tories actually, 35% of the electorate didnt vote at the last election, plus the Lib Dems are on 13% atm in some polls, by getting more people to vote and just taking Lib Dem votes would get him pretty close, floating voters are always a factor to boot, no reason they wouldnt switch to him from Cameron if all they care about is presentation.

From personal experience (anecdotal evidence, I know), Lib Dem supporters despise the Labour Party and everyone in it. They hated Gordon Brown, so they'll probably hate Ed Miliband. We'll have to wait for the first polls to see. And when low-earner wages start to increase, Lib Dem support will slowly begin to rise again, though they will still lose seats in 2015.

most Lib Dem voters I know hate the Tories much more than they dislike Labour...

and low wages rising? I will believe that when I see it, inequality and social mobility in the UK are devastated by Thatcher, Majour, Blair and Browns economic policies which were decidedly Right Wing, not Left at all.

the Lib Dems will do well to get 40 seats at the next election imo

Thatcher had to do what she did, Major just continued what Thatcher did, Blair implemented the national minimum wage, and Brown, though he stupidly got rid of the 10% starting rate, did murder all of the super-rich with 50p tax. I figured he didn't go further left because of his delightful New Labour Chancellor. I wish Darling was Labour leader, for no other reason than that he's adorable and completely harmless.

I would like more politicians like that... or maybe more like Boris Johnson



Kantor said:

Thatcher had to do what she did, Major just continued what Thatcher did, Blair implemented the national minimum wage, and Brown, though he stupidly got rid of the 10% starting rate, did murder all of the super-rich with 50p tax. I figured he didn't go further left because of his delightful New Labour Chancellor. I wish Darling was Labour leader, for no other reason than that he's adorable and completely harmless.


no, she didnt, nor did Major, they chose to do it to make them and there elitist chums richer at the expense of the workers.

the NMW is absurdly low anyway, so it was almost a cop out from Blair, Brown was stupid to scrap the 10p tax rate, and his 50p rate was at too high a level (£150k) and not permanent



Munkeh111 said:
Kantor said:
Homer_Simpson said:
Kantor said:
Homer_Simpson said:
Munkeh111 said:

I can't claim to know much about politics, but Ed Miliband just seems unelectable. There is quite a lot about him that says to me that he won't be PM, he just doesn't seem right. I think this will just leave the Tories with a nice large majority in the next election, despite the hatred of the cuts (which I don't think go far enough anyway) because he is not the kind of candidate who is going to take voters from the Tories


he doesnt actually need to take voters from the Tories actually, 35% of the electorate didnt vote at the last election, plus the Lib Dems are on 13% atm in some polls, by getting more people to vote and just taking Lib Dem votes would get him pretty close, floating voters are always a factor to boot, no reason they wouldnt switch to him from Cameron if all they care about is presentation.

From personal experience (anecdotal evidence, I know), Lib Dem supporters despise the Labour Party and everyone in it. They hated Gordon Brown, so they'll probably hate Ed Miliband. We'll have to wait for the first polls to see. And when low-earner wages start to increase, Lib Dem support will slowly begin to rise again, though they will still lose seats in 2015.

most Lib Dem voters I know hate the Tories much more than they dislike Labour...

and low wages rising? I will believe that when I see it, inequality and social mobility in the UK are devastated by Thatcher, Majour, Blair and Browns economic policies which were decidedly Right Wing, not Left at all.

the Lib Dems will do well to get 40 seats at the next election imo

Thatcher had to do what she did, Major just continued what Thatcher did, Blair implemented the national minimum wage, and Brown, though he stupidly got rid of the 10% starting rate, did murder all of the super-rich with 50p tax. I figured he didn't go further left because of his delightful New Labour Chancellor. I wish Darling was Labour leader, for no other reason than that he's adorable and completely harmless.

I would like more politicians like that... or maybe more like Boris Johnson


fuck me, you clearly do not know anything about politics if you think Boris Johnson is good, even his own party hate him.