Khuutra said:
The point is that Castlevania was doing the action platformer thing almost two decades before God of War existed. |
That's an even stronger reason to not just copy a modern game like God of War.
Where is the platforming in Lords of Shadows? From what I've seen there's very little of it.
Slimebeast said:
That's an even stronger reason to not just copy a modern game like God of War. Where is the platforming in Lords of Shadows? From what I've seen there's very little of it. |
A big portion of God of War is platforming. God of War belongs to the genre of Castlevania, not the other way around.
I haven't watched videos of this game. THe point is that this is getting back to the roots of Castlevania - a linear adventure where the action focuses on killing monsters and fighting your way through tough levels - rather than the Metroid-style games started with Symphony of the Night.
It's not ripping off God of War. It's a logical progression of the original series in 3D.
so its safe to say it will get the award of: best game that no one played.
Being in 3rd place never felt so good
I'm definitely interested in Lords of Shadow, but it hasn't been a day one buy for me. Now with LBP2 being delayed I might pick this up day one. 
2012 - Top 3 [so far]
#1 #2 #3
Khuutra said:
A big portion of God of War is platforming. God of War belongs to the genre of Castlevania, not the other way around. I haven't watched videos of this game. THe point is that this is getting back to the roots of Castlevania - a linear adventure where the action focuses on killing monsters and fighting your way through tough levels - rather than the Metroid-style games started with Symphony of the Night. It's not ripping off God of War. It's a logical progression of the original series in 3D. |
It appears as a logical progression, but they happened to steal it from God of War.
Most action side scroller Arcade platformers didn't managae to progress into anything. In fact it was hard to transform them into the 3D era and make them work. Prince of Persia, Bionic Commando and Metroid got their respective conversions into 3-D but most Arcade games never made into 3-D.
Castlevania took the God of War concept because it was already there (through Devil May Cry, a new genre invention more than a slow, logical progression). It was easy.
In some way I think it's logical. In some way I don't. Because back when I imagined 3-D conversions of Castlevania-like games such as Ghost and Goblins, Black Tiger, Rastan Saga and Galivan I personally never imagined something like God of War.
| Slimebeast said: It appears as a logical progression, but they happened to steal it from God of War. Most action side scroller Arcade platformers didn't managae to progress into anything. In fact it was hard to transform them into the 3D era and make them work. Prince of Persia, Bionic Commando and Metroid got their respective conversions into 3-D but most Arcade games never made into 3-D. Castlevania took the God of War concept because it was already there (through Devil May Cry, a new genre invention more than a slow, logical progression). It was easy. In some way I think it's logical. In some way I don't. Because back when I imagined 3-D conversions of Castlevania-like games such as Ghost and Goblins, Black Tiger, Rastan Saga and Galivan I personally never imagined something like God of War. |
I'm going to try this one more time, and I'm not goign to get angry, but you are being obtuse enough that I'm beginning to wonder if you are doing it on purpose.
God of War did not invent the concept of an action-oriented platformer. It was preceded, in 3-D, by both Devil May Cry and Ninja Gaiden. Hell, it was preceded by Tomb Raider. And dozens of other games. When you go back into 2-D, it gets even worse - but it was actually preceded by several 3-D Castlevanias, too. Lament of Innocence was a 3-D action platformer Castlevania with giant boss fights and came out years before God of War.
Your understanding of genre norms cannot possibly be this narrow.
It did not rip off God of War. Belonging to the same genre does not mean it ripped off God of War. The director actually addresses that issue in the interview. THey did not rip off God of War any more than they ripped off Shadow of the Colossus (which is also mentioned). All of these elements have existed in Castlevania for more than two decades.
They did not rip off God of War.
Khuutra said:
I'm going to try this one more time, and I'm not goign to get angry, but you are being obtuse enough that I'm beginning to wonder if you are doing it on purpose. God of War did not invent the concept of an action-oriented platformer. It was preceded, in 3-D, by both Devil May Cry and Ninja Gaiden. Hell, it was preceded by Tomb Raider. And dozens of other games. When you go back into 2-D, it gets even worse - but it was actually preceded by several 3-D Castlevanias, too. Lament of Innocence was a 3-D action platformer Castlevania with giant boss fights and came out years before God of War. Your understanding of genre norms cannot possibly be this narrow. It did not rip off God of War. Belonging to the same genre does not mean it ripped off God of War. The director actually addresses that issue in the interview. THey did not rip off God of War any more than they ripped off Shadow of the Colossus (which is also mentioned). All of these elements have existed in Castlevania for more than two decades. They did not rip off God of War. |
Obviously God of War traces its roots to Devil May Cry so the basic concept and genre inventor is Devil May Cry. (and therefore past 3-D castlevanias such as Lament of innocnse are based on Devil May Cry)
But the latest iteration in the hacknslash genre, and by far the most successful one, is God of War and if you watch the videos of Lords of Shadows you will see they carbon copied God of War. Making the giant boss encounters longer and climbier and saying they got inspired by SOTC is only a bad excuse.
| Slimebeast said: Obviously God of War traces its roots to Devil May Cry so the basic concept and genre inventor is Devil May Cry. But the latest iteration in the in the hacknslash genre, and by far the most successful one, is God of War and if you watch the videos of Lords of Shadows you will see they carbon copied God of War. Making the giant boss encounters longer and climbier and saying they got inspired by SOTC is only a bad excuse. |
You are not listening. You are not trying. Your understanding of genre distinction is both stunted and persistent in ways that beggar credit or belief.
http://www.joystiq.com/2010/09/23/david-cox-on-rebooting-castlevania-for-a-new-generation/
| People have compared the game's combat to that of the God of War series. The platforming is similar to Tomb Raider. Some of the boss fights are highly reminiscent of Shadow of the Colossus. Are these reference points that were actively considered throughout development? No, the phenomenon of games is ... In the movie business, people don't go up to Scorsese and say, "Hey, Goodfellas is a lot like Godfather." It's something I find a bit irritating, but I understand why people do it. I think people are inspired by other people's work. I think we should remember that Castlevania was doing many of these things that many of these games are doing 10, 15 years before they were. We've certainly taken inspiration from the original Castlevania. We tried to create an action platformer that people, today's gamers, can understand. I don't think the comparisons are warranted. I think when people play the game properly, get into it, they're going to see they're very different games, hopefully. |
I get the impression that you don't know the first thing about 3-D console action games. Tell me if you don't, if you haven't ever really played any, because right now I imagine you haven't and I wouldn't mind being corrected.
I don't mind changing "ripping off God of War" to "ripping off Devil May Cry" though if that makes it easier to get my point.
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