By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Gaming Discussion - Why PS Move will fail

Smidlee on 24 August 2010
axt113 said:

Move is a terrible decision, listen to Clayton Christensen father of disruption theory had to say on the issue:

 

Rumors indicate that it is planning on following the first approach, sticking a new, motion-sensitive controller onto an existing console. Our perspective is that this is the worst of the three options. 

While this would be the quickest path to market, it has some real risks. Nintendo’s system has been optimized around its controller. Simply sticking a motion-based controller onto an existing system could result in a highly disappointing product. The controller would remain an afterthought, as opposed to an integral part of the product. 

 This generation is different than the past as both Sony and Mircosoft has stated they have no plans releasing a new console anytime soon. Of course Move and Kinect are add-on yet when both has a change of being a success simply because unless Nintendo planning to release new console there isn't much new coming in the near future.

 When PS3 start running around $200 IMO will be the test of how much Move catches on. The biggest problem for Move at the beginning is  the fact PS3 are still $300.



Around the Network
themanwithnoname on 24 August 2010
CGI-Quality said:
Slimebeast said:
M.U.G.E.N said:
Slimebeast said:
Mr Khan said:

First off, Move is primarily not intended to combat Kinect at all. Move is a defensive measure against Nintendo. Move does have the advantage of servicing the existing userbase of its console far more than Kinect does, but the reason is its primarily positioned to give PS3 owners no good reason to buy a Wii (which it may or may not succeed at, since Nintendo's shown that their own motion control is often peripheral to creating killer apps), but the kind of games appearing there are to counter that, which is why we're seeing them push it in to more traditional experiences, or see EA create that exact clone experience of PGA Tour on Wii to PGA Tour here.

That's not how I see it at all. The Sixaxis was Sony's attempt to defend against Nintendo. Move is their desperate attempt to combat Kinect.

Why is it 'desperate"? cuz it was downgraded suddenly to make it affordable? nope that was kinect

cuz it have no games? nope it has more games than kinect..and more veriety too, go check the line up

cuz it doesn't work properly? nope all hands on previews have clealrly said it works the best among the motion controllers out in the market so far..way better than kinect as of now at least

Does it not deliver on what it promised? Nope it does everything it said it would do and does them well..I can't really say the same for kinect as of now

So why? Do explain...I do not comprehend this line of thought of terms used by some of you such as 'rushed product' ...'desperate' . If anyone is bringing out such a product then it would be MS

Desperate doesn't necessaily mean a rushed product. I never said that. I know that Move is accurate, has almost no lag and it does it's thing, but the whole project feels so forced and halfhearted. It feels so "me too". I honestly believe that Sony didn't want to get dragged into a motion control war but they felt forced to. Sony themselves don't believe in Move. 

The Move software lineup is large but, and I mean no disrespect here, it's all a bunch of shovelware. I see no enthusiasm among Sony fans over any Move title (except maybe a tiny little bit for that Sorcery game, but we're talking about a game that will move 250K copies, if even that).

I am not writing this out of fanboyism. There's no damage control or hidden agendas. It's just obvious reading comments from console fans, when you read between the lines. Deep within us we all (the majority) know that Kinect will be a success while we're very sceptical about Move.

Man, where to begin........

a. Move games are shovelware? Killzone 3, HEAVY RAIN, Socom? Shovelware, really?

b. Sony doesn't believe in Move? I'm guessing they sent you a telegram with such info on it.

c. The "majority" of fans don't know didly. If that were the case, ALAN WAKE would be sitting comfortably above HEAVY RAIN in sales and reviews.

d. As people have been saying, it's all speculation at this point, but you took the cake.

Do you plan on calling out Mugen for calling the Kinect lineup shovelware as well? And I do believe he meant the Move only games.



themanwithnoname's law: As an America's sales or NPD thread grows longer, the probabilty of the comment "America = World" [sarcasticly] being made approaches 1.

lostintheodyssey on 24 August 2010
Tanstalas said:
DirtyP2002 said:

Sony is doing a big mistake with the games for the move. They are making hardcore titles move compatible. Did anyone actually ask for this? When you played Killzone 2, did you say to yourself 'Damn, I would love to play this with a device similar to the Wiimote'?

I think this is actually where the move will shine.  If it is 1:1 you will be able to get the aim on someone faster than using an analog stick - IMO.

It's like comparing playing MW2 on a console to a PC, the mouse is much more accurate and fast.

I predict a lot of people using a controller will be dominated by people using move if move is as good as Sony is making it out to be


Another good thing that Sony is doing with some core titles like Socom is they are giving players the option to play games using both control schemes.  That adds replay value someone can beat a game with the controller on their first playthrough and then go back and beat the game using move to see how it's been implemented.  Most kinect titles seem to be kinect only at the moment.



iWarMachine on 24 August 2010
Slimebeast said:
CGI-Quality said:
Slimebeast said:
M.U.G.E.N said:
Slimebeast said:

It's my honest opinion. Except Sorcery. Sorcery seems to be a quality game but it's also small and insignificant. (btw for clarification, I mean the Move-only titles, not Move supported games like Socom, GT5 and Killzone). Can u rank the Move lineup? Name your top 5 or something and we can analise their quality and hype.

To try to increase my credibility a little, I'm a guy who consistently says that Sony will finish this gen ahead of Microsoft and that the PS3 exclusive library is better than Xbox 360 despite me being a big Xbox and Microsoft fanboy.

Face palm!

shovelware? REALLY? You're joking right? I mean you casually ignore games like Socom 4, Echochrome 2, Sorcery (which is btw a full fledged game, I don't understand where you get this small and insignificant  from), The Fight, Heroes on the Move, Time Crisis etc. Compared to the competitions launch line up this is way way way better in turms of quality and heck even quantity.

I can't for the life of me understand why you would use the 'me too' argument against move but not for kinect? it's motion control that came after wii and Eyetoy.

Again why do you think it's FORCED? It's a good hw that works vs kinect that still has a lot to prove for itself. So the ofrced one here is Kinect if we follow your logic.

ANd btw let's not talk about how many copes Sorcery will move (which btw I will quote you on it)....it will move way way way more copies than that...I will even place a bet with you for it...but given how much crow you ate with HR I suggest you don't take the bet

And also saying "I am not writing this out of fanboyism. There's no damage control or hidden agendas." doesn't really make it the truth...just like how saying 'maybe' sony found out about MS and brought out the Move. Because lets face it, one is working great, the other still has many problems to iron out. So if anything MS hand was forced, doesn't matter HOW you try to spin it. Kinect was forced and rushed..it even had to drop the chip and the sw has many issues according to previews such as notciebale lag.

Let's face it here, Move is getting very nice support from 1st party and 3rd party. Kinect line up is fileld with shovelware with lil to no veriety imo...very little support for the hardcore too. Will it sell? yep...will Move be a failure? No way in hell

Socem and those hardcore games that support Move controls along with normal controls, I didn't mean them when I said shovelware. I meant the games that need Move and I clarified it.

"The Fight" is garbage, it got horrible hands-on impressions. "Time Crisis Move", I can't imagine gamers paying for that one when they already have games like Uncharted and God of War 3. "Heroes on the Move, I haven't checked that out thoroughly but I will in a sec.

You are missing the point. It doesn't matter that Kinect has some technical issues such as lag. Wii had them too in the beginning but it didn't prevent them from selling to casuals.

When people have tried Kinect they walk away with a smile on their face, while comments from people who experienced Move usually are "it was kinda neat".

Sorcery is a quality title and even some people on this forum will appreciate it. But don't come tell me it's an important game. No disrespect to Harry Potter but Sorcery is kinda like Harry Potter.

You are right, I'm very cautious about bets after my Heavy Rain bet.

Would you please link us to those claims about The Fight? And since you've yet to use it, I'm not sure how you could peg it as "garbage". Kinect has been getting some pretty awful previews too, is it garbage?

I think this is your lowest slimebeast. I've seen some pretty ridiculous posts from you in the past, but I'm truly shocked right now.

The first hands-on preview of The Fight that came up on Google:

"Like all of the games that we played during this Beta event, The Fight: Lights Out isn't the finished article, but it's hard to see just how they can improve the game apart from starting from scratch. Move will have a great boxing game one day, but this isn’t going to be it."
http://gaming.hexus.net/content/item.php?item=25767

Kinect has had some so and so previews, yes I know, but obviously that will happen when it's such a non-hardcore device. But that's not the point. It doesn't matter if we, hardcore gamers, prefer classic controllers over motion controls, or that we feel stupid jumping in front of a dance game. The point is casuals will love Kinect and that's what I mean when I say that we all know this deep within us.

This is my lowest? It must be pretty damn low then.

Sorry but I didn't know this was controversial. I honestly thought most gamers including Sony fans weren't enthusiastic about Move.

Gaming Hexus?

Check out the IGN preview

http://ps3.ign.com/articles/111/1113980p1.html

"The Fight can transform from a clever example of what PlayStation Move is capable of into a must-have game for Sony's motion controller."



I'm Back! - Proud owner of the best doomed handheld of all time!

IMU1808 on 24 August 2010
M.U.G.E.N said:
Slimebeast said:
Mr Khan said:

First off, Move is primarily not intended to combat Kinect at all. Move is a defensive measure against Nintendo. Move does have the advantage of servicing the existing userbase of its console far more than Kinect does, but the reason is its primarily positioned to give PS3 owners no good reason to buy a Wii (which it may or may not succeed at, since Nintendo's shown that their own motion control is often peripheral to creating killer apps), but the kind of games appearing there are to counter that, which is why we're seeing them push it in to more traditional experiences, or see EA create that exact clone experience of PGA Tour on Wii to PGA Tour here.

That's not how I see it at all. The Sixaxis was Sony's attempt to defend against Nintendo. Move is their desperate attempt to combat Kinect.

Why is it 'desperate"? cuz it was downgraded suddenly to make it affordable? nope that was kinect

cuz it have no games? nope it has more games than kinect..and more veriety too, go check the line up

cuz it doesn't work properly? nope all hands on previews have clealrly said it works the best among the motion controllers out in the market so far..way better than kinect as of now at least

Does it not deliver on what it promised? Nope it does everything it said it would do and does them well..I can't really say the same for kinect as of now

So why? Do explain...I do not comprehend this line of thought of terms used by some of you such as 'rushed product' ...'desperate' . If anyone is bringing out such a product then it would be MS


Not only is everything you said true... but Move was revealed with fully functional near one to one tech demo's the day RIGHT AFTER Natal was revealed. How SONY scraped all of that together in one night is beyond me...



Around the Network
axt113 on 24 August 2010
Smidlee said:
axt113 said:

Move is a terrible decision, listen to Clayton Christensen father of disruption theory had to say on the issue:

 

Rumors indicate that it is planning on following the first approach, sticking a new, motion-sensitive controller onto an existing console. Our perspective is that this is the worst of the three options. 

While this would be the quickest path to market, it has some real risks. Nintendo’s system has been optimized around its controller. Simply sticking a motion-based controller onto an existing system could result in a highly disappointing product. The controller would remain an afterthought, as opposed to an integral part of the product. 

 This generation is different than the past as both Sony and Mircosoft has stated they have no plans releasing a new console anytime soon. Of course Move and Kinect are add-on yet when both has a change of being a success simply because unless Nintendo planning to release new console there isn't much new coming in the near future.

 When PS3 start running around $200 IMO will be the test of how much Move catches on. The biggest problem for Move at the beginning is  the fact PS3 are still $300.


It won't matter, because a few things will happen, people will say, they can't get Wii sports or wii fit on move or Kinect, they'll say its just a more expensive copy, and they'll say that the games on Move and Kinect aren't as good as the ones on Wii (No Wii games)



Rumors indicate that it is planning on following the first approach, sticking a new, motion-sensitive controller onto an existing console. Our perspective is that this is the worst of the three options.

-Clayton Christensen back in 2007 already knew Move would be a bad idea

IMU1808 on 24 August 2010
Slimebeast said:
M.U.G.E.N said:
Slimebeast said:
Mr Khan said:

First off, Move is primarily not intended to combat Kinect at all. Move is a defensive measure against Nintendo. Move does have the advantage of servicing the existing userbase of its console far more than Kinect does, but the reason is its primarily positioned to give PS3 owners no good reason to buy a Wii (which it may or may not succeed at, since Nintendo's shown that their own motion control is often peripheral to creating killer apps), but the kind of games appearing there are to counter that, which is why we're seeing them push it in to more traditional experiences, or see EA create that exact clone experience of PGA Tour on Wii to PGA Tour here.

That's not how I see it at all. The Sixaxis was Sony's attempt to defend against Nintendo. Move is their desperate attempt to combat Kinect.

Why is it 'desperate"? cuz it was downgraded suddenly to make it affordable? nope that was kinect

cuz it have no games? nope it has more games than kinect..and more veriety too, go check the line up

cuz it doesn't work properly? nope all hands on previews have clealrly said it works the best among the motion controllers out in the market so far..way better than kinect as of now at least

Does it not deliver on what it promised? Nope it does everything it said it would do and does them well..I can't really say the same for kinect as of now

So why? Do explain...I do not comprehend this line of thought of terms used by some of you such as 'rushed product' ...'desperate' . If anyone is bringing out such a product then it would be MS

Desperate doesn't necessaily mean a rushed product. I never said that. I know that Move is accurate, has almost no lag and it does it's thing, but the whole project feels so forced and halfhearted. It feels so "me too". I honestly believe that Sony didn't want to get dragged into a motion control war but they felt forced to. Sony themselves don't believe in Move. 

The Move software lineup is large but, and I mean no disrespect here, it's all a bunch of shovelware. I see no enthusiasm among Sony fans over any Move title (except maybe a tiny little bit for that Sorcery game, but we're talking about a game that will move 250K copies, if even that).

I am not writing this out of fanboyism. There's no damage control or hidden agendas. It's just obvious reading comments from console fans, when you read between the lines. Deep within us we all (the majority) know that Kinect will be a success while we're very sceptical about Move.


Lol... reminds me of what you said about Heavy Rain and Alan Wake. 

ANYWAY: I go to the SONY forums and out of 7 active threads, one's about a MOVE game.

I go to the MS forum and out of 7 active threads... I see one about Natal hardware. Another about some comment from MS on NATAL increasing the systems life span. BOTH are about Natal NEWS. Nothing about games. That Move game thread is atleast focusing on a game and the motion control aspects of that game. 

Where's the enthusiasm for Natal games?



IMU1808 on 24 August 2010
Severance said:
Severance said:

Can some of the 360 guys explain me how Move is an answer to kinect when we heard about "PS Motion" almost half a year before we heard rumors about "Project Natal" ? and then they were announced with only one day in between? are you guys saying that Sony made Move in just one day just because they're scared shitless of the mighty kinect?

besides not to mention how the idea of the "PS Wand" dates back to 2004 or something?

some of you guys are just oblivious on common sense.


my posts always get ignored.

i'm i too harsh on my use of words?


Your avatar doesn't look like it's yelling load enough. Believe me, go really cute, really ugly, really sexy, or really angry. It helps.



Rpruett on 24 August 2010
IMU1808 said:
Slimebeast said:
M.U.G.E.N said:
Slimebeast said:
Mr Khan said:

First off, Move is primarily not intended to combat Kinect at all. Move is a defensive measure against Nintendo. Move does have the advantage of servicing the existing userbase of its console far more than Kinect does, but the reason is its primarily positioned to give PS3 owners no good reason to buy a Wii (which it may or may not succeed at, since Nintendo's shown that their own motion control is often peripheral to creating killer apps), but the kind of games appearing there are to counter that, which is why we're seeing them push it in to more traditional experiences, or see EA create that exact clone experience of PGA Tour on Wii to PGA Tour here.

That's not how I see it at all. The Sixaxis was Sony's attempt to defend against Nintendo. Move is their desperate attempt to combat Kinect.

Why is it 'desperate"? cuz it was downgraded suddenly to make it affordable? nope that was kinect

cuz it have no games? nope it has more games than kinect..and more veriety too, go check the line up

cuz it doesn't work properly? nope all hands on previews have clealrly said it works the best among the motion controllers out in the market so far..way better than kinect as of now at least

Does it not deliver on what it promised? Nope it does everything it said it would do and does them well..I can't really say the same for kinect as of now

So why? Do explain...I do not comprehend this line of thought of terms used by some of you such as 'rushed product' ...'desperate' . If anyone is bringing out such a product then it would be MS

Desperate doesn't necessaily mean a rushed product. I never said that. I know that Move is accurate, has almost no lag and it does it's thing, but the whole project feels so forced and halfhearted. It feels so "me too". I honestly believe that Sony didn't want to get dragged into a motion control war but they felt forced to. Sony themselves don't believe in Move. 

The Move software lineup is large but, and I mean no disrespect here, it's all a bunch of shovelware. I see no enthusiasm among Sony fans over any Move title (except maybe a tiny little bit for that Sorcery game, but we're talking about a game that will move 250K copies, if even that).

I am not writing this out of fanboyism. There's no damage control or hidden agendas. It's just obvious reading comments from console fans, when you read between the lines. Deep within us we all (the majority) know that Kinect will be a success while we're very sceptical about Move.


Where's the enthusiasm for Natal games?


I have said this for awhile,  I don't believe the Natal / Kinect hype for one second.  Everytime you turn around it seems features that were promised, rumored, mentioned won't be available or can't be done.  Questions are cropping up everywhere. 

Kinect IMHO is a rotten apple that consumers will soon find out.  It's software lineup keeps getting brushed off as "Oh casuals will enjoy this or enjoy that".  Really?  You think Casuals will enjoy a product that isn't responsive, fails to feel intuitive and generally doesn't simulate an activity well? (IE: Bowling?).  

Casuals IMO are a lot smarter than that portrayal. 



IMU1808 on 24 August 2010
gekkokamen said:
CGI-Quality said:
Mr Khan said:

First off, Move is primarily not intended to combat Kinect at all. Move is a defensive measure against Nintendo. Move does have the advantage of servicing the existing userbase of its console far more than Kinect does, but the reason is its primarily positioned to give PS3 owners no good reason to buy a Wii (which it may or may not succeed at, since Nintendo's shown that their own motion control is often peripheral to creating killer apps), but the kind of games appearing there are to counter that, which is why we're seeing them push it in to more traditional experiences, or see EA create that exact clone experience of PGA Tour on Wii to PGA Tour here.

 

Kinect, however, is clearly built to reach out. It's Microsoft's attempt at under-cutting Nintendo in terms of disruption (okay, you've got the simple controller, we'll do one lower and cut it out entirely. Their main problem is if the experience is executed smoothly enough to actually disrupt). If either of them are bound to succeed, it'll be Kinect that moves consoles, but Move that has a higher attach rate among existing users, and it's Kinect that's actively meant to steal sales away from Nintendo, while Move is Sony's attempt at *preventing* Nintendo from stealing sales from them

Really agree with much of this.


Hmmm well, I do think Sony is also trying to reach out, not just "preventing"...preventing what exactly? Right now the PS3 and Wii don't share that much in demographics, it's not like the average Wii *buyer* (videogame noob 1.0) is torn between choices *so much* (right now). Sony with the PS Move wants these potential buyers to look at another appealing option, so they are in fact reaching out to a new demographic.


The Wii caters to a different market much more than the PS3. The Wii has a strong focus on something they want and the PS3 doesn't have. That's exactly his point. The Wii, at the moment, offers something that PS3 doesn't, or atleast not as well as the Wii. SONY's always been pushing the PS3 as the "Come to for everything" system that fits into any entertainment center for "anyone". That why, like they're doing with the move and what they've always tried to do; they're looking at games for every taste instead of focusing too heavily on casuals like NATAL. Having a Wii like option gives current PS3 owners less of a reason to get a Wii. While I don't fully agree with him as I do believe SONY is DEFINITELY trying to attract some new customers, I can't deny that he raises a pretty interesting perspective to look at.