Would you two STOP WITH YOUR STUPID BICKERING.

Well supposedly I started it so I guess I'll stop

I'm not really sure how it would have changed the game.  I suppose we would have known that Hephaestos was not playing as a townie like he said he was.  He got lynched the next day anyway though.  It could have changed how the votes landed on him, but it was never going to be a mafia player anyway.  The only way it could have turned out any better for the town was if both cultist got killed in the bomb.

thank you. Let's reset this whole giant relationship for next game.

I'm just worried that if I have information what I'm supposed to do to convince you.

How about stop quoting the same post multiple times, quoting stuff 5 posts deep ?

Hey cmon Ill be better about that next time. Since starting vgc I've almost never "-snip-"ed a post.

Please don't take any offense to what I am about to say.  Everything could be fixed with just a little experience, so stick around.    It was a fun game, and a total mind fuck (in a good way...I think).  However, I would like to point something out to everyone.

These are the requirements for moderating a game at mafiascum.  It takes a lot of experience to properly balance a game with a lot of players, complicated roles, and multiple factions.  This game was easily the most ambitious I've seen at this site, and it was undertaken by a first-time mod without anyone else taking a look at game balance.  I'm going to encourage new mods, and especially new mods who haven't played much, to carefully read the topics here:

http://mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php?title=Category:How_to_Mod

To start, games are generally 25% to 33% scum.  That means this game probably should have started with something like 5 mafia, or 5 mafia and 1 SK, or 4 mafia - 1 SK - 1 potential cult leader.  Instead the game started 5 mafia, 2 SK, 2 potential cult leader.  So, 7/20 = 35%, with a pretty easy route to 8/20 = 40%, and a great potential for more.

The other complicating factor is the game started with essentially 4 factions.  Multiple factions make the game even more difficult to balance.  More factions are actually better for the town since the scum have a chance to kill each other, but I don't think that makes up for the town only having essentially 12 players to start.

I'm also not sure you realized just how powerful the roles you gave to the mafia were.  Mafia Godfather, mafia framer, and mafia busdriver are all very powerful on their own, but together all in one game is extremely powerful.  That right there might have been balanced for a 5 vs 15 game.  Even then I'm not sure.  Then the possible addition of a bomb that only they know about?  That is two guaranteed non-mafia-faction kills without even giving up someone who was originally on their team.

With so many players, and so many complicated roles, and so many players with multiple roles, even an experienced mod would have trouble balancing this game.  It would be way too difficult to think through all the possible ways the game could play out before the game starts.  So in this case, I think simple would have been better.  You had a lot of ideas, and instead of throwing them all into one game, you could have used one for each of several games.  Remember, simple does not mean boring.  One well executed twist probably would have been better for all.

Also, bigger games are not always better.  These massive games have a real tendency to drag on without much progress on Day One, Day Two, and even Day Three as we saw here.  It also makes things difficult for the players to follow.

Actually, it wasn't that bad a role claim.  It was a mix up of the Inventor, Jack-of-all-Trades, and Skitzo roles.  With all the other crazy roles out there, I believed it. 

I hope you weren't taking about me and my weak-ass one shot ability.    It wouldn't have helped anyway.

There's no way a mafia player would be the last vote either.  They would just let it hang there until some dumb townie comes along.  Didn't you guys see Dtewi prod me into hammering?  I mean, I would have done it anyway, but still.