This is an inaccurate statement. The number of illegal immigrants that commit murder is 300% higher then the number of people in the country legally.

The list goes on. You can pick any violent crime, and the percentage committed my illegal immigrants is higher.

Yea, sure, because someone here on vacation is going to be confused with an illegal immigrant. Give me a break.

Ahh I worded that very poorly, I deserved to get slapped back down then =P. What I meant is basically that the vast majority of the illegal immigrants are not bad people, are not murderers and do not commit violent crimes. If your statistic is correct then lets say murders comitted by illegal immigrants are 15 per 100000 capita. That gives a 0.015% of the illegal immigrant population as murderers, and thats making the incorrect assumption that none of them committed murder more than once!

Edit: Last half of my post was actually more likely to cause different arguments than solve them. Removed.

You're entire theory is biased, baseless, and plainly ignorant.

The greater majority of the illegals are working on our farms, roads, yards, etc, allowing us to have far lower costs on these items, especially food. Its been proven in many studies that the net effect on US is positive.

Are there some bad in the bunch, of course, however, there are far more bad citizens that are a much higher concern than the really small number of illegals who are criminals. I live in Arizona which has, arguably, the worst situation with illegal immigration and more crossers die each year by a large number simply crossing the desert than they do committing crimes.

To remove the illegal issue would hurt us massively in dramatically increased produce far more than anything else. I like cheap tomatos and I know damn well no american will pick them in any way that wouldn't more than double their costs.

http://www.newsweek.com/2010/05/14/why-americans-think-wrongly-that-illegal-immigrants-hurt-the-economy.html

http://www.ehow.com/about_5389828_impact-immigration-economy.html

If I search long enough I could find the paper specific to CA where is proved a removal of immigrants would be severly detrimental to their economy.

So you pay more for tomatos.

What's right and what's wrong is not based on how much something cost. The right thing is the right thing. The right thing is to uphold out laws. You want people to be allowed to pic fruit for cheep, fine, change the law. But just picking the laws you feel like upholding because you like them, and not upholding the ones you don't like, is fucked up.

We are suposed to be a country of laws, not men. When you get to chose what laws matter and what don't, why have laws?

This is the real problem and why i sympathize with "illegals"

The gun analogy is so off base, Mafoo. How longs the process to legally own a gun? Not long, right? To stay within that scope its reasonable to say if someone wants a gun they can start the process and have a gun rather quickly.

There is a gray area obviously, but im of th emind that when people dont want a gun on record its not to go to the range or shoot a bird.

I also understand its illegal to cross our border yadayadayada but the fact people have to wait 14 years, if you have a family in a terrible situation im not going to judge someone for not wanting their kids to grow up in that situation and for trying to get the hell out of that situation.

I guess im not a black and white guy and i think more with my heart on these matters than my brain.....some may take that out of context but i feel the root of this issue is the length and process and the fact crime in arizona was at an all time low in 2008 when there was reportedly the highest influx of "illegals" leads me to believe the real issue isnt safety.

The process needs to change, imo. This whole issue is a smokescreen anyway.

Give us your sick, tired and poor.......in 14 years when youll all probably be dead.

Follow EVERY law no matter what the overall issue/circumstance is, right? So you've never jaywalked, went over the speed limit, failed to come to a complete stop, etc, etc?

Laws that are not an attack on someone all have a grey area.

Makeing these people legal and thus 100% awarded US citizen rights would FAR worse for our country than simply keeping the status quo of turning a blind eye on most who are working. You really think the government doesn't know where to find the tens of thousands illegals working on farms and shops around this nation? They simply choose to ignore them because they recognizes its overall benefit for everyone.

Also:

http://www.9500liberty.com/index.html

You don't get to delete this just yet ;)

to be clear, while the number of blacks who commit murder is higher, the real cause of murder is more economic, then it is racial. The number of very poor white people who commit murder is the same as poor black people, and the number of middle class and upper class black people who commit murder is the same as white people.

It just happens they there is a disproportionate number of black people who are poor, so it slants the figures.

How about we approach this differently....

Today the US chooses who they let into there country. They might chose based on criminal record, volume of immigrants, education background, whatever they chose. What your saying, is the US has no right to make that call, that whoever wants to enter the US has a right to be here, and regardless of what the US governments thinks about it, the immigrants are right.

Is that your position?

Great video and it proves my point as well as hits home to me in AZ as to what is probably going to happen if our stupid law isn't reversed back to the perfectly fine way it was prior.