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Forums - Sony Discussion - Valve wants PS3 to open like a Mac not closed like a Gamecube.

RockMan10 on 20 May 2010

I dont really think Sony is trying to push out 3rd party developers at all..

Of course Sony 1st party are going to try to make the best games on the system, they are making exclusive PS3, if you wanna make money you have to do that..

This doesn't mean that 3rd parties will fail, look at red dead redemption, grand theft auto, call of duty, metal gear solid, etc.... Valve is just lame. They really want to say "we want an environment where we can half-ass our games and still sell them."



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Ssenkahdavic on 20 May 2010
Kasz216 said:
Ssenkahdavic said:
Kasz216 said:
thismeintiel said:
TheNoobHolocaust said:
Kasz216 said:
gurglesletch said:
I refuse to play a valve game until it is on PS3.

That's like refusing to eat a hot dog until it's been dropped on the floor. 

No offense to PS3 or consoles in general, but valve games are built around the community in ways that make them last much longer and make them much better games.

I can kind of see what you mean by this, PS3 has yet to have a game that starts a community and makes the game last longer, but that doesn't excuse Valve for not trying to make one, you should always try, sometimes you fail, but you just get back up and try again.

You're completely right.  *cough* LBP *cough* MNR *cough*  Damn cold. 

Your comparing LBP and MNR to the kinds of things that can be made with mod tools?  Really?

It's not even remotely comparable.

What you can do with these games is "revolutionary" as far as consoles go, but the PC is so far ahead there is no comparison.

Complete GAMES being 100% changed (Full remodel, brand  new story, new triggers, new characters, new everything)


Just off the top of my head:

Silly amounts of Mods for Neverwinter Nights, Torchlight and hell Warcraft 3.  Fucking custom WC3 games have become their OWN retailish games!

Yeah... that was my point...

Just backing ya up with a few examples of mod goodness.



 

  

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Kasz216 on 20 May 2010
Ssenkahdavic said:
Kasz216 said:
Ssenkahdavic said:
Kasz216 said:
thismeintiel said:
TheNoobHolocaust said:
Kasz216 said:
gurglesletch said:
I refuse to play a valve game until it is on PS3.

That's like refusing to eat a hot dog until it's been dropped on the floor. 

No offense to PS3 or consoles in general, but valve games are built around the community in ways that make them last much longer and make them much better games.

I can kind of see what you mean by this, PS3 has yet to have a game that starts a community and makes the game last longer, but that doesn't excuse Valve for not trying to make one, you should always try, sometimes you fail, but you just get back up and try again.

You're completely right.  *cough* LBP *cough* MNR *cough*  Damn cold. 

Your comparing LBP and MNR to the kinds of things that can be made with mod tools?  Really?

It's not even remotely comparable.

What you can do with these games is "revolutionary" as far as consoles go, but the PC is so far ahead there is no comparison.

Complete GAMES being 100% changed (Full remodel, brand  new story, new triggers, new characters, new everything)


Just off the top of my head:

Silly amounts of Mods for Neverwinter Nights, Torchlight and hell Warcraft 3.  Fucking custom WC3 games have become their OWN retailish games!

Yeah... that was my point...

Just backing ya up with a few examples of mod goodness.

Ah, I mean when you just look at valve.  Without modders.... Portal, TF2 and Counterstrike would of never existed... 3 of their big properties.

Mod tools basically give willing developers a free talent search... and even just free ideas if nobody is quite talented enough.  There are solutions and ideas that the main team doesn't come up with that modders do, and it turns out to be awesome.

Civilization shows this by adding in user created scenarios... tons of PC games do it and it's their big strength.

 

It's why Borderlands just doesn't hold up for me, not mods.  It's a console game on PC when we should be aiming for PC games on consoles... where no only can you make levels, but you can make... WHATEVER you want with the engine.



Deneidez on 20 May 2010

When quality developer meets community with no quality...

Seriously games on PC and MAC has to be games that last more than few years. On consoles its other way around. Games shouldn't last long. They should have no replay value and they should be easy to learn and master. People consume them like fast food or movies.

For me whole thing is like quality over quantity. I hate those 'fast food' games. They give me nothing.



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A203D on 20 May 2010
Kasz216 said:
BMaker11 said:
What does this even mean??

PS3 has to many gatekeeper functions on who can develop and sell products and what kind of functions said products can have.

Basically, it makes sense to port to Apple because they can do things like Steam cloud and give free updates.

Basically valve LOVES modders and actually building relationships with their fans... etc.  They're all about bringing people in, getting ideas from their fans and collborating with them to make things better.

 

True they can't do that on 360 either... however it takes no effort to port to 360.  It does make a lot of sense.


Seriously... LISTEN to the interview and you'll understand.

You may actually learn something, it's a very telling and good interview about game development.

Hmmm, they dont explain this in the interview. and they only use derogetory comments for the PS3 not the 360. its fair enough that you've explained that these guys are talking sense. but you cant deny their attitude is against the PS3 for reasons unknown to us, they should be attacking the other consoles as well if their impartial, which in my opinion they dont seem to be.



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FF_Fanatic on 20 May 2010
Kennyheart said:

Half-Life and Portal developer Valve would like to see Sony’s PlayStation 3 console become “more open like a mac” rather than “more closed like a Gamecube”, explained company CEO Gabe Newell in a recent interview with 5BY5.

“Platform investments, like the Mac, are difficult because you have to be aware of what direction that platform is moving. We need to target platforms that do a better job of looking like where we want to be in a few years,” Newell explained.

“We would love to see the PS3 be more open like a Mac than more closed like a Gamecube. It makes it easier to justify those investments if that were the case.”

Valve has always been known for their generally negative attitude towards PS3. If I’m reading this correctly, PS3 isn’t where Valve wants to be in a few years… wherever that may be. Odd, since Valve recently stated that it was “sure down the road“, they’ll develop for the Sony platform.

http://scrawlfx.com/2010/05/valve-wants-ps3-open-like-a-mac-not-closed-like-a-gamecube

obviously they must not know about the engine sony has made for the ps3 then lol, valve keeps on making excuses, which basically are all lies



FantasySky on 20 May 2010
Kynes said:

I think he's talking about the first-third party ecosystem. Apple doesn't make games, Sony is trying to have the best games of the platform as 1st party, a la Nintendo. If Sony competes fierly with their 3rd parties, it makes harder for those third parties to have profits in their platform.

 

Edit: There is a big niche in the Mac platform, and with more PC like Macs, it's easier to cross develop. Valve only wants to earn money, and I'm sure that the cost/benefit ratio is bigger in Mac than in PS3.

i kinda agree with this. sony are battleing to become the best developer out there. on the basis of the reveiws there first party games hav been getting at the moment atleast they are an awefull lot better than either nintendo or microsoft in the 1st party arena the problem is though that they are acting too much like a ryno. there beating of all there competiters but no one wants to go near



Scoobes on 20 May 2010
A203D said:
Kennyheart said:

 

Half-Life and Portal developer Valve would like to see Sony’s PlayStation 3 console become “more open like a mac” rather than “more closed like a Gamecube”, explained company CEO Gabe Newell in a recent interview with 5BY5.

“Platform investments, like the Mac, are difficult because you have to be aware of what direction that platform is moving. We need to target platforms that do a better job of looking like where we want to be in a few years,” Newell explained.

“We would love to see the PS3 be more open like a Mac than more closed like a Gamecube. It makes it easier to justify those investments if that were the case.”

Valve has always been known for their generally negative attitude towards PS3. If I’m reading this correctly, PS3 isn’t where Valve wants to be in a few years… wherever that may be. Odd, since Valve recently stated that it was “sure down the road“, they’ll develop for the Sony platform.

http://scrawlfx.com/2010/05/valve-wants-ps3-open-like-a-mac-not-closed-like-a-gamecube

I've only had the pleasure of recently hearing about Valves derogetory attitude to PS3. no offense to the 360 fans around here, but Sony have always endorsed the 10 year lifecycle of their consoles. especailly with PS3, which has blu ray, upcoming 3D etc. microsoft have only recently done this with natal, but even then the 360 has never been seen as a 10 year console.

so to me its obvious where Sony want their console in 10 years and M$ have never been clear until recenly about where they want their console to be. in my opinion they've actully insulted M$ who they clearly support.

just out of interest does valve carry any weight in the gaming community, i mean half-life is really old and i've never heard of portal until now??

Yes, yes they do. They're one of the top PC developers at present and are essentially a platform holder in Steam (They make a small amount off of every sale on Steam). They've made plenty of games and all of them have been quality critically, in sales and in the community:

  • Half-Life
  • Half-Life 2
  • Half-Life 2 Ep 1
  • Half-Life 2 Ep 2
  • Left 4 Dead
  • Portal
  • Team Fortress 2
  • Counterstrike: Source
  • Left 4 Dead 2
  • Day of Defeat: Source
  • Ricochet



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Scoobes on 20 May 2010
Ssenkahdavic said:
Kasz216 said:
thismeintiel said:
TheNoobHolocaust said:
Kasz216 said:
gurglesletch said:
I refuse to play a valve game until it is on PS3.

That's like refusing to eat a hot dog until it's been dropped on the floor. 

No offense to PS3 or consoles in general, but valve games are built around the community in ways that make them last much longer and make them much better games.

I can kind of see what you mean by this, PS3 has yet to have a game that starts a community and makes the game last longer, but that doesn't excuse Valve for not trying to make one, you should always try, sometimes you fail, but you just get back up and try again.

You're completely right.  *cough* LBP *cough* MNR *cough*  Damn cold. 

Your comparing LBP and MNR to the kinds of things that can be made with mod tools?  Really?

It's not even remotely comparable.

What you can do with these games is "revolutionary" as far as consoles go, but the PC is so far ahead there is no comparison.

Complete GAMES being 100% changed (Full remodel, brand  new story, new triggers, new characters, new everything)


Just off the top of my head:

Silly amounts of Mods for Neverwinter Nights, Torchlight and hell Warcraft 3.  Fucking custom WC3 games have become their OWN retailish games!

To be fair to Sony they did support proper mods on Unreal Tournament 3. If it really came down to it Valve could release a Steam tool that could convert mods to work on the PS3 like Epic did. Of course, they'd have to properly port the Source engine first.

Still, the possibility is there.




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Kasz216 on 20 May 2010
Scoobes said:
Ssenkahdavic said:
Kasz216 said:
thismeintiel said:
TheNoobHolocaust said:
Kasz216 said:
gurglesletch said:
I refuse to play a valve game until it is on PS3.

That's like refusing to eat a hot dog until it's been dropped on the floor. 

No offense to PS3 or consoles in general, but valve games are built around the community in ways that make them last much longer and make them much better games.

I can kind of see what you mean by this, PS3 has yet to have a game that starts a community and makes the game last longer, but that doesn't excuse Valve for not trying to make one, you should always try, sometimes you fail, but you just get back up and try again.

You're completely right.  *cough* LBP *cough* MNR *cough*  Damn cold. 

Your comparing LBP and MNR to the kinds of things that can be made with mod tools?  Really?

It's not even remotely comparable.

What you can do with these games is "revolutionary" as far as consoles go, but the PC is so far ahead there is no comparison.

Complete GAMES being 100% changed (Full remodel, brand  new story, new triggers, new characters, new everything)


Just off the top of my head:

Silly amounts of Mods for Neverwinter Nights, Torchlight and hell Warcraft 3.  Fucking custom WC3 games have become their OWN retailish games!

To be fair to Sony they did support proper mods on Unreal Tournament 3. If it really came down to it Valve could release a Steam tool that could convert mods to work on the PS3 like Epic did. Of course, they'd have to properly port the Source engine first.

Still, the possibility is there.

If i recall correctly though, you needed a PC for the modding.  Additionally Sony's internet system is MUCH more structed and controlled then Mac or PC.