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Forums - General - The UK 2010 Election Thread- Who will/would get your vote?

 

The UK 2010 Election Thread- Who will/would get your vote?

Conservative - David Cameron 19 32.20%
 
Labour - Gordon Brown 11 18.64%
 
Liberal Democrats - Nick Clegg 22 37.29%
 
Other Party (Green/UKIP/Etc) 5 8.47%
 
Undecided 2 3.39%
 
Total:59
SciFiBoy on 21 April 2010
FootballFan said:
SciFiBoy said:
FootballFan said:
The NHS is excellent. but, under stupid government imposed rules it is now a laughing stock in some regions.

For example, in my region a friend of mine needed a drug to restore some sort of deficiency he has. However, in my regional zone the NHS has decided this drug is too expensive to provide him with. Consequently, forcing him to go private.

Heres the catch. If he lived in Lincolnshire or Lancashire he would have been given this drug on the NHS because they elected to include it in their funding. Talk about a ridiculous scheme!

ideally the government should increase NHS funding and also redirect funds from things like the riddiculous over payment of managers (many of which may not even be needed anyway)

If I was in charge I would hit the millionaire bankers a lot harder with taxes. In addition, transfer the pay increases from the higest earning managers in the NHS to the lowest paid nurses. The NHS needs much much more funding but I don't quite know where the source of that could come from.....

Ideally the government would legalise many drugs. Charging obscence prices and profiting massivly from taxation. Only the rich would be able to consume these goods and the NHS would be placed under less strain as they wouldn't be as popular as they are know! 

sounds good to me



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tombi123 on 21 April 2010
Slimebeast said:
tombi123 said:
Kasz216 said:
SciFiBoy said:
Kasz216 said:
I would probably vote Liberal Democrats. I feel like the Authortarian levels of Britain are at a scary high level.

I mean stuff we complain about in the patriot act is stuff that happens in the UK all the time.

Conservative is a close second though based on the "Key issues" i've read between the two so far. I'll keep you up to date on my "non" vote.


Also, what's up with the health care saying "It's for the people who need it not who can pay."?

I mean, you guys have universal healthcare. Is there some rampant discrimination against the poor? I mean, I know if your poor your MUCH more likely to die of random diseases in the UK but I thought that was just due to the fact that the poor usually have a worse lifestyle.

hmm?

I think the NHS should always be a priority for the goverment, all the main parties support it.

 

They are saying it in a way that makes it sound like NHS discriminates against the poor.  Both Conservative and Liberal Democrats say "Healthcare should be about who needs it not who could pay."

This would be analgous to someone saying "Black people should be allowed to vote" in the US.  Black people already can vote... and have been able to for a while... why are you bringing this up?  Are there black people who can't vote?"

I think it might have something to do with some cancer cures that aren't offered by the NHS because they are expensive so you have to go private which the poor can't afford to do. Not completely sure though. 

Liberal Democrat. Before someone accuses me of jumping on the band wagon, I was going to vote for them before the live debate.

I call BS.

Not cures that was the wrong word. Treatment or drugs.



FootballFan on 21 April 2010
Kasz216 said:
FootballFan said:
SciFiBoy said:
FootballFan said:
The NHS is excellent. but, under stupid government imposed rules it is now a laughing stock in some regions.

For example, in my region a friend of mine needed a drug to restore some sort of deficiency he has. However, in my regional zone the NHS has decided this drug is too expensive to provide him with. Consequently, forcing him to go private.

Heres the catch. If he lived in Lincolnshire or Lancashire he would have been given this drug on the NHS because they elected to include it in their funding. Talk about a ridiculous scheme!

ideally the government should increase NHS funding and also redirect funds from things like the riddiculous over payment of managers (many of which may not even be needed anyway)

If I was in charge I would hit the millionaire bankers a lot harder with taxes. In addition, transfer the pay increases from the higest earning managers in the NHS to the lowest paid nurses. The NHS needs much much more funding but I don't quite know where the source of that could come from.....

Ideally the government would legalise many drugs. Charging obscence prices and profiting massivly from taxation. Only the rich would be able to consume these goods and the NHS would be placed under less strain as they wouldn't be as popular as they are know! 

Well the problem with massivly taxing drugs is that if they end up more expensive then street value by a significant amount... you won't get rid of the black market and most people will buy from the black market.

Functionally, all you end up doing is making it so it is harder to catch people with illegal drugs since they can just claim they purchased them legally.

 


Wouldn't it just make the drugs into a tabacco situation? As far as I'm aware despite large taxes on those there isn't a black market. Alcohol is also smashed a long with petrol, seems like an easy way to generate funds.



Kantor on 21 April 2010
Slimebeast said:
If I was a British citizen I'd vote for the BNP. I love the UK.

I love it too. Which is exactly why I hate the BNP.

It is a racist party which discriminates based on skin colour. The real British Nationalists are UKIP, but they're a one trick pony, as illustrated by the fact that Lord Pearson wasn't familiar with his own manifesto. They'd leave Europe, then say "Oh shit, what do we do now?"

Leaving Europe isn't the answer, anyway. We just need to stop rolling over whenever Brussels tell us to.



(Former) Lead Moderator and (Eternal) VGC Detective

Slimebeast on 21 April 2010

Oh com'on you guys are giving misinformation of your own health care system!

It's the same here in Sweden, our health care regions have rights to deny patients many expensive medicines if there exists cheaper alternatives. Exactly the same thing as FootBall fan described about his friend. It's very common here, and nothing controversial.



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Slimebeast on 21 April 2010
tombi123 said:
Slimebeast said:
tombi123 said:
Kasz216 said:
SciFiBoy said:
Kasz216 said:
I would probably vote Liberal Democrats. I feel like the Authortarian levels of Britain are at a scary high level.

I mean stuff we complain about in the patriot act is stuff that happens in the UK all the time.

Conservative is a close second though based on the "Key issues" i've read between the two so far. I'll keep you up to date on my "non" vote.


Also, what's up with the health care saying "It's for the people who need it not who can pay."?

I mean, you guys have universal healthcare. Is there some rampant discrimination against the poor? I mean, I know if your poor your MUCH more likely to die of random diseases in the UK but I thought that was just due to the fact that the poor usually have a worse lifestyle.

hmm?

I think the NHS should always be a priority for the goverment, all the main parties support it.

 

They are saying it in a way that makes it sound like NHS discriminates against the poor.  Both Conservative and Liberal Democrats say "Healthcare should be about who needs it not who could pay."

This would be analgous to someone saying "Black people should be allowed to vote" in the US.  Black people already can vote... and have been able to for a while... why are you bringing this up?  Are there black people who can't vote?"

I think it might have something to do with some cancer cures that aren't offered by the NHS because they are expensive so you have to go private which the poor can't afford to do. Not completely sure though. 

Liberal Democrat. Before someone accuses me of jumping on the band wagon, I was going to vote for them before the live debate.

I call BS.

Not cures that was the wrong word. Treatment or drugs.

Yes, happened in Sweden a couple of times too and media blew it up. New treatments against cancer, different brands of chemo therapy, come out all the time. Hospitals dont offer all of them. They only buy it if the price versus effect ratio is reasonable.

Same in the UK. No controversy. Doesn't say anything about the quality of your health care system.



FootballFan on 21 April 2010
Kantor said:
Slimebeast said:
If I was a British citizen I'd vote for the BNP. I love the UK.

I love it too. Which is exactly why I hate the BNP.

It is a racist party which discriminates based on skin colour. The real British Nationalists are UKIP, but they're a one trick pony, as illustrated by the fact that Lord Pearson wasn't familiar with his own manifesto. They'd leave Europe, then say "Oh shit, what do we do now?"

Leaving Europe isn't the answer, anyway. We just need to stop rolling over whenever Brussels tell us to.


Not completly true.

There are many British Sikh/Hindu members of the BNP apparently 5 a day have been joining. Granted, they are only joining because they share the same hatred of Islam as Nick Griffin but they are probably more connected with being Anti Islam than racist now. The Youtube preview I posted near the top shows one of their non white candidates.



Kantor on 21 April 2010
FootballFan said:
SciFiBoy said:
FootballFan said:
The NHS is excellent. but, under stupid government imposed rules it is now a laughing stock in some regions.

For example, in my region a friend of mine needed a drug to restore some sort of deficiency he has. However, in my regional zone the NHS has decided this drug is too expensive to provide him with. Consequently, forcing him to go private.

Heres the catch. If he lived in Lincolnshire or Lancashire he would have been given this drug on the NHS because they elected to include it in their funding. Talk about a ridiculous scheme!

ideally the government should increase NHS funding and also redirect funds from things like the riddiculous over payment of managers (many of which may not even be needed anyway)

If I was in charge I would hit the millionaire bankers a lot harder with taxes. In addition, transfer the pay increases from the higest earning managers in the NHS to the lowest paid nurses. The NHS needs much much more funding but I don't quite know where the source of that could come from.....

Ideally the government would legalise many drugs. Charging obscence prices and profiting massivly from taxation. Only the rich would be able to consume these goods and the NHS would be placed under less strain as they wouldn't be as popular as they are know! 

This is where we need to be careful. It's very easy to say "Oh, tax the rich people, they're all spoiled and they don't need it"

But what about the rich people who have worked their arses off to become rich? People who started with nothing, and slogged to get to where they are now? Does the government really have the right to take away half of their money, and give part of it to people who are completely unwilling to work, and thus are poor? Yes, some people work hard and are poor. And yes, they should get help. But if you're not going to work, you don't deserve a penny from the government, which in turn would come from the people who work for a living.

I'm not criticising the NHS or anything, nor am I criticising progressive taxation. I just think that we need a healthy dose of capitalism, like Thatcher gave us in the 1980s. David Cameron won't give us that, but it would be a step.



(Former) Lead Moderator and (Eternal) VGC Detective

Kantor on 21 April 2010
FootballFan said:
Kantor said:
Slimebeast said:
If I was a British citizen I'd vote for the BNP. I love the UK.

I love it too. Which is exactly why I hate the BNP.

It is a racist party which discriminates based on skin colour. The real British Nationalists are UKIP, but they're a one trick pony, as illustrated by the fact that Lord Pearson wasn't familiar with his own manifesto. They'd leave Europe, then say "Oh shit, what do we do now?"

Leaving Europe isn't the answer, anyway. We just need to stop rolling over whenever Brussels tell us to.


Not completly true.

There are many British Sikh/Hindu members of the BNP apparently 5 a day have been joining. Granted, they are only joining because they share the same hatred of Islam as Nick Griffin but they are probably more connected with being Anti Islam than racist now. The Youtube preview I posted near the top shows one of their non white candidates.

Whatever they are "connected with", they want the UK to be 99% white or more. Oh sorry, not white, indigenous British, whatever the hell that means.

To be honest, if they got into power by some weird twist of fate, they'd probably kick that guy out of the party. Not that it matters, they're the sixth most popular party in the UK, for heaven's sake.



(Former) Lead Moderator and (Eternal) VGC Detective

Kasz216 on 21 April 2010
FootballFan said:
Kasz216 said:
FootballFan said:
SciFiBoy said:
FootballFan said:
The NHS is excellent. but, under stupid government imposed rules it is now a laughing stock in some regions.

For example, in my region a friend of mine needed a drug to restore some sort of deficiency he has. However, in my regional zone the NHS has decided this drug is too expensive to provide him with. Consequently, forcing him to go private.

Heres the catch. If he lived in Lincolnshire or Lancashire he would have been given this drug on the NHS because they elected to include it in their funding. Talk about a ridiculous scheme!

ideally the government should increase NHS funding and also redirect funds from things like the riddiculous over payment of managers (many of which may not even be needed anyway)

If I was in charge I would hit the millionaire bankers a lot harder with taxes. In addition, transfer the pay increases from the higest earning managers in the NHS to the lowest paid nurses. The NHS needs much much more funding but I don't quite know where the source of that could come from.....

Ideally the government would legalise many drugs. Charging obscence prices and profiting massivly from taxation. Only the rich would be able to consume these goods and the NHS would be placed under less strain as they wouldn't be as popular as they are know! 

Well the problem with massivly taxing drugs is that if they end up more expensive then street value by a significant amount... you won't get rid of the black market and most people will buy from the black market.

Functionally, all you end up doing is making it so it is harder to catch people with illegal drugs since they can just claim they purchased them legally.

 


Wouldn't it just make the drugs into a tabacco situation? As far as I'm aware despite large taxes on those there isn't a black market. Alcohol is also smashed a long with petrol, seems like an easy way to generate funds.

Apparently 27% of Ciggarretes and 68% of do it yourself tobacco are bought on the Black Market.  (In the UK.)

Additionally there really aren't too many tobacco plantations in third world countries... unlike these drugs which are everywhere... so less people trying to smuggle.

Additionally, Cigarrettes require a lot more manufacturing then other drugs as people are used to the Cigarette method rather then other drugs which are needle and pipe based and therefore don't require manufacturing.


Other drugs would likely be worse then the 68% "do it yourself" due to the prevelence of illegal drug production in third world countries.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/sep/06/cigarette-smuggling-uk-organised-crime

Is an interesting article.