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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Pachter: Slim 360, Natal and 250GB HDD to be bundled for $299

nightsurge said:

Hmm lets see.  You mean that French blog post of past worries about Natal that were never confirmed?  I think I trust the dozens of news stories that have come out since then about the finished Natal product.  The ones claiming perfect body mirroring, no lag issues, etc.

As for your last thing, obviously an Eyetoy with Wiimote would be better than just an EyeToy.  But Natal would be better than both of those.  The EyeToy can only track 2D color changes and what not.  Adding the "wiimote" as you call it (otherwise known as PS Move), lets you track 2 points in 3D space, but direct view of the wands must be available and decent lighting is recommended.  This does have some drawbacks.  For example, if you watch the PS Move commercial showing off the fighting game, the elbows tend to get confused and not match up with the persons movements because nothing other than the 2 hands are tracked.  With Natal the full body would be tracked and mirrored.  Natal can track up to 48 points per person in 3D space and mimic even complex human movements like break dancing.  Add in that Natal can work in complete darkness and I think it is clear which is more appealing and more advanced.  Natal.

Not confimered doesn't mean instantly its wrong. Unless there is good reason to distrust the site, there is no reason to dismiss what it wrote.
Links to the articles saying how good Natal is?

Plus I was explaining Natal and Move through how the non educated buyer and retailers will view it. Either get a movement kit with just a camera, or one with a camera and control. Not to mention Natal is similar to Eyetoy in the sense of no button control.
Also Move doesn't need LoS - look back at the E3 demo. Also at a recent tech demo, the technician (same guy at E3) mentioned how it uses the accelerometer to figure out its location in real time space when its out of the view of the eyetoy.

Also if Natal is so awesome, why did Sony pass up on it & choose Move? Let's not forget which won out of bluray and HD-DVD....



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gekkokamen said:

^outdated? there are articles there from this year. It seems it's from a very reliable source too. And you're trolling saying I'm trolling when I'm not.

What does that eurogamer article have to do with Natal costs? it doesn't mention any cost estimates at all. Stop the nonsense ok??

A lot of those articles were written before we found out that Microsoft had scrapped the idea of having the CPU in camera. Once that went the costs came plummeting down.



"Yet more from Microsoft's Open House conference in New York, which was held yesterday, Robbie Bach telling attendees that the Natal motion controller will start off pricey but get cheaper"

"Relative to Natal, we'll see how the pricing cost works out," the entertainment and devices boss told the great and good of the industry.

"But people should except that it will go through the usual price curve."



@nightsurge

You only read what you wanna like. Look, I've got a name, Robbie Bach PRESIDENT OF ENTERTAINMENT DIVISON, Microsoft, that's the one who said that. You got something to prove it wrong? fine! do it, but don't come here spouting shit about the source.

I'll believe Robbie in the meantime, I guess he knows his own business better than you.



Mazty said:
nightsurge said:

Hmm lets see.  You mean that French blog post of past worries about Natal that were never confirmed?  I think I trust the dozens of news stories that have come out since then about the finished Natal product.  The ones claiming perfect body mirroring, no lag issues, etc.

As for your last thing, obviously an Eyetoy with Wiimote would be better than just an EyeToy.  But Natal would be better than both of those.  The EyeToy can only track 2D color changes and what not.  Adding the "wiimote" as you call it (otherwise known as PS Move), lets you track 2 points in 3D space, but direct view of the wands must be available and decent lighting is recommended.  This does have some drawbacks.  For example, if you watch the PS Move commercial showing off the fighting game, the elbows tend to get confused and not match up with the persons movements because nothing other than the 2 hands are tracked.  With Natal the full body would be tracked and mirrored.  Natal can track up to 48 points per person in 3D space and mimic even complex human movements like break dancing.  Add in that Natal can work in complete darkness and I think it is clear which is more appealing and more advanced.  Natal.

Not confimered doesn't mean instantly its wrong. Unless there is good reason to distrust the site, there is no reason to dismiss what it wrote.
Links to the articles saying how good Natal is?

See my above post with links in it.

Plus I was explaining Natal and Move through how the non educated buyer and retailers will view it. Either get a movement kit with just a camera, or one with a camera and control. Not to mention Natal is similar to Eyetoy in the sense of no button control.
Also Move doesn't need LoS - look back at the E3 demo. Also at a recent tech demo, the technician (same guy at E3) mentioned how it uses the accelerometer to figure out its location in real time space when its out of the view of the eyetoy.

That is true.  My main concern is like with the fighting game.  The characters body on screen didn't match the person's movements, just the hand placement.  There was a very noticeable glitchiness where the elbow kept wanting to hit the person's head before the hand got there

Also if Natal is so awesome, why did Sony pass up on it & choose Move? Let's not forget which won out of bluray and HD-DVD....

They decided they'd rather copy the proven formula of the Wii than try to do something risky and new I guess.  I don't see how that last part even has any relevance to this conversation.  Unless you mean to show me how the inferior product can win based on dev support?  HD-DVD was better in nearly every imagineable way over blu-ray.  Costs of players and discs, their read speeds, capabilities, etc.

 



@Scoobes

the thing is nobody can tell if by the time we get news or rumors or whatever there have been changes all over the place inside a company. This whole conversation is pointless. It'll happen like it'll happen.



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gekkokamen said:
"Yet more from Microsoft's Open House conference in New York, which was held yesterday, Robbie Bach telling attendees that the Natal motion controller will start off pricey but get cheaper"

"Relative to Natal, we'll see how the pricing cost works out," the entertainment and devices boss told the great and good of the industry.

"But people should except that it will go through the usual price curve."



@nightsurge

You only read what you wanna like. Look, I've got a name, Robbie Bach PRESIDENT OF ENTERTAINMENT DIVISON, Microsoft, that's the one who said that. You got something to prove it wrong? fine! do it, but don't come here spouting shit about the source.

I'll believe Robbie in the meantime, I guess he knows his own business better than you.

I don't see a quote where he says it will be expensive; it's hardly odd for person's quotes to be paraphrased wrong

Obviously it's going to be more expensive at launch and then get lower, but unless someone says the word expensive or actually gives a price I think there's more evidence of MS trying to keep the cost low.

 



gekkokamen said:
"Yet more from Microsoft's Open House conference in New York, which was held yesterday, Robbie Bach telling attendees that the Natal motion controller will start off pricey but get cheaper"

"Relative to Natal, we'll see how the pricing cost works out," the entertainment and devices boss told the great and good of the industry.

"But people should except that it will go through the usual price curve."



@nightsurge

You only read what you wanna like. Look, I've got a name, Robbie Bach PRESIDENT OF ENTERTAINMENT DIVISON, Microsoft, that's the one who said that. You got something to prove it wrong? fine! do it, but don't come here spouting shit about the source.

I'll believe Robbie in the meantime, I guess he knows his own business better than you.

Lol, again, irrelevant because of the age of the source.  Lots have changed since then.  Do come back now when you have something more recent and confirmed.

"Pricey" could be $100.  And "get cheaper" could mean within a matter of a few months it will be much cheaper.  Either way, you are only looking at the basic point of entry costs.  To get the full experience you pay one time for Natal, in full, up front.  Probably $100 or less.  For Move you have to buy the basic one player setup (which to get the full experience requires 2 Wands, PS Eye, and one nunchuck), and then even more for however many people you would like to play with at one time.  2 Players at a time is a kind of minimum so thats 4 wands, 2 Nunchucks, and PS Eye for that experience.



@nightsurge

"Unless you mean to show me how the inferior product can win based on dev support? HD-DVD was better in nearly every imagineable way over blu-ray. Costs of players and discs, their read speeds, capabilities, etc."


dude you're nothing but a troll and a blind fanboy, it only took that crap to make you come out of the closet, LOL!



No, it'll be a 120GB Elite bundle with Natal for 299$.



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disolitude said:
Mazty said:
Having been in gamestation yesterday, it looks like retailers are pushing Move way more than Natal. Going to be interesting if this is the case stateside or just US loyalty to US brands.


Nintendo confirmed as US brand? I mean it wins the US market every year.


Obviously Nintendo are American. American companies release daring and innovative products whilst Japanese companies are just waiting in the wings to copy them. *Retro 80s bigotry FTW*

*Not meaning to offend*



Tease.