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JRPGfan said:
dharh said:

Was it the outside?  Are we not all living in a simulator?  A movie about machines creating a matrix within a matrix to escape from to give us the illusion that we are freeing ourselves of The Matrix? While us watching the movie are inside of A Matrix?  Blew your mind.

Also.  New doesn't exist anymore.  The entertainment industry is pretty much out of material at this point.

Thats basically the "only" way I can see them makeing sense of it...

Hiku said:
COKTOE said:
I liked the first one in spite of the fact that Neo came back from the dead because of Trinity's wish love. Or is is love wish? They can do whatever they want after that nonsense.

I didn't interpret it as him coming back because Trinity wished it.
The Oracle told Neo that he was in fact not The One. But she also left him with this message:"Being The One is just like being in love. No one can tell you you're in love, you just know it." 
Just like everything in the Matrix, as Morpehous demonstrated to Neo when explaining why he was faster and stronger than him, the limitations on a person is related to what they're able to believe. If his brain thinks he hit the pavement for real, he will start to bleed. Neo didn't fully believe that he was The One, until that moment, because of what The Oracle had told him.

Neo basically has to have powers inside what's known or thought to be the real world, if the dream inside a dream plot is going to work. Neo mentions he can feel the machines in the real world and is somehow tied to them in a non physical manner, even though that shouldn't be possible. This already leaves the door open to the real world just being another level in the Matrix.

It also means each level doesn't play by the same rules. In the base Matrix he can fly and stop bullets, but can't stop other programs or people by just thinking it, where as he can in the real world like with the sentinels. Both levels have different rules. Which would be super important to bringing back Trinity as a 'real' physical person, since it's explained to Neo by Morpheus early on, that if you die in the Matrix, you die in the real world, because "the body cannot live without the mind". This would mean Trinity is dead for good, unless in the thought to be real world level, due to the different rules, you may not be dead for good in whatever the actual real world is, and potentially can be brought back.

This also would leave another massive question. Is the humans vs machines backstory even true? Since the humans are enslaved by the machines in the base Matrix, who is enslaving the machines then in the thought to be real world Matrix?

Something else to ask about the way in which the Matrix trilogy plays out is, is it really the best thing for the humans and did Neo actually make any major choices? The Oracle and Architect tell Neo the problem is choice, but throughout the movie, he's constantly manipulated by the Oracle to do what she wants. He's even manipulated by everyone else who's been manipulated by the Oracle to do what she wants. She just so happens to be a program built by the Architect that's apparently helping the humans now, and even though they say choice is the major problem in the Matrix and why it eventually fails, the Oracle really doesn't allow Neo to make to many big choices. She's constantly manipulating him to go down the path she wants. She tells him things like "knowing you're the one is like knowing you're in love", and "everything that has a beginning has an end", which cause him to make major decisions based on her advice. What he believes in is constantly based on what she tells him, even though some seems useful and true and some seems useless and nonsense. When she tells him, 'I promise, as soon as you're finished eating that cookie, you'll feel right as rain', what happens afterwards is just the opposite.

If it is a Matrix inside a Matrix, I couldn't help but wonder are the machines using and manipulating the humans to get out of the real world Matrix? Maybe the humans haven't actually been given much of a choice all along.

Last edited by EricHiggin - on 21 August 2019