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Forums - Politics Discussion - SaveJames - Liberal mom forcing her son to act like a girl?

It is not impossible that some crazy parents would do it, as some Vegan parents had done to their babies and toddlers. But in a case like this I would take the instance that parents aren't crazy to force a harsher life on the kid, so most likely the kid liked to dress a girl (and that doesn't even mean the child is gay or trans).



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Pemalite said:
JWeinCom said:

If you really are intelligent, you would recognize the argument from authority fallacy you're using.  It one of the more egregious instances I've seen.  If we test IQs and mine is higher, does that mean you're wrong?

Not to mention intelligence is all relative anyway.
Even a 2 year old infant that recognizes colours and shapes is more intelligent than a goldfish. Or even some Adults.

And being higly intelligent does not mean that we see every information that comes in clearly,most have biases and beliefs that invoke us to turn down our intelligence whenever it fits.

Look at H.P Lovecraft, he was highly intelligent and an ignorant ass at the same time. :p



Immersiveunreality said:

Look at H.P Lovecraft, he was highly intelligent and an ignorant ass at the same time. :p

He was a product of his time and a very sheltered, lonely life. He'll always be one of the greatest writers in history for me regardless.



SanAndreasX said:
the-pi-guy said:
I always wonder why people think that there are many parents who want their children to be transgender when they aren't.

That's something I see more and more on evangelical sites on the discussion of transgender children. They claim children are coming out as transgender because it's cool and trendy to do so. And nobody can convince those people otherwise. 

but I thought gender is a social construct?

does that not mean that the perception of being cool and trendy can cause a change in gender?



sundin13 said:
Torillian said:

For this particular instance, I think this had to do with people believing the parent that is vocal. Luna's mother decided she wanted to keep things private while the father has been out running the christian and conservative news rounds. I understand the mother's choice to try to keep her child from becoming a national point of debate, but having only one side of the story made it so easy for those who wanted to see this as a crazy liberal mother forcing her child to be trans. It takes someone going through court records to find the other side of things and you see that what we heard was only the father and his friends while we missed the testimony of Luna, two therapists, a CPS agent, Luna's twin brother, and the mother herself. 

All that said, I again cannot blame the mother. Near the end of the video in the OP the author talks about how Luna's mom had a twitter account where she would post helpful little tips for parents on all kinds of topics like making sure kids where sun screen in the heat and he would read it from time to time. Before the author posted the video, Luna's mom actually killed this twitter because every post was getting incessantly hammered for the Luna issue by conservatives. The video author talks about how this affected him and he wasn't sure why because seeing the actual abuse hadn't really had such an effect. He came to realize that he had been ascribing this almost saint-like resilience and perfection on the mother, that as long as she could ignore all the hate this was just an internet argument that hadn't affected her life. Seeing her kill the twitter was a reminder that she isn't impervious to this, and while we all debate about these things on forums there are real people on the other side of these issues often times getting hurt. 

To be fair, I'm somewhat hamstringing the discussion to talk about that portion of the video, but I found it poignant and wanted to hear others' thoughts.

Yeah, I made that post about the greater trend before watching the video, not about this specific incident. While it does seem like Munchausen by Proxy was mentioned in the video, it doesn't really seem to make any sense like you said.

I will say that the video was really well made and I highly advise anyone who has heard about this incident to at least watch a bit of it, as it does provide a substantial amount of additional context and show how the prevailing narrative is inaccurate and deceitful.

I feel like there isn't much else for me to say, however, I do think we see by how few posts this thread is getting though that those who do support stories like this aren't really interested in the truth and are just interested in propaganda for the culture war... Thats just my opinion though.

"however, I do think we see by how few posts this thread is getting though that those who do support stories like this aren't really interested in the truth and are just interested in propaganda for the culture war"

what did you expect in terms of discussion from this thread? does this one situation where presumably the little boy wants to be a girl or whatever mean that there isn't a wider problem with how this issue is presented?



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SpokenTruth said:
teamsilent13 said:

I mean you're wrong, but you believe what you want. We have an entire fake news media which lies directly to its audience with the exact opposite of the truth. It's pretty much the opposite. I am a conspiracy theorist of sorts and I have over 145 IQ.

These tend to be mutually exclusive.

you can't seriously be saying that you don't think groups of people ever conspire against other people in secret?



o_O.Q said:

but I thought gender is a social construct?

does that not mean that the perception of being cool and trendy can cause a change in gender?

1.)  Even if that did make any logical sense, it is certainly not what's happening right now.  Being transgender is the opposite of cool.  It's an immense amount of stress, because a lot of people hate people for being transgendered.  

2.)  Even still the latter doesn't follow from the former.  

Gender is a social construct, that doesn't mean a change in the perception of gender would cause people to change their own gender.  

3.)  You still seem to think that people are choosing to be transgender.  No one is doing that.  It doesn't even make any sense.  

o_O.Q said:

you can't seriously be saying that you don't think groups of people ever conspire against other people in secret?

Conspiracies do happen.  

But the people that are so involved in speculating about them, that they call themselves conspiracy theorists are usually lost.  



o_O.Q said:

"however, I do think we see by how few posts this thread is getting though that those who do support stories like this aren't really interested in the truth and are just interested in propaganda for the culture war"

what did you expect in terms of discussion from this thread? does this one situation where presumably the little boy wants to be a girl or whatever mean that there isn't a wider problem with how this issue is presented?

Quite the opposite actually. There very much is a wider problem with how "this issue" is presented. You and I just disagree on what that problem is.



the-pi-guy said:

o_O.Q said:

but I thought gender is a social construct?

does that not mean that the perception of being cool and trendy can cause a change in gender?

1.)  Even if that did make any logical sense, it is certainly not what's happening right now.  Being transgender is the opposite of cool.  It's an immense amount of stress, because a lot of people hate people for being transgendered.  

2.)  Even still the latter doesn't follow from the former.  

Gender is a social construct, that doesn't mean a change in the perception of gender would cause people to change their own gender.  

3.)  You still seem to think that people are choosing to be transgender.  No one is doing that.  It doesn't even make any sense.  

o_O.Q said:

you can't seriously be saying that you don't think groups of people ever conspire against other people in secret?

Conspiracies do happen.  

But the people that are so involved in speculating about them, that they call themselves conspiracy theorists are usually lost.  

"Even if that did make any logical sense"

trust me you aren't the only one having difficulty seeing logical consistency

"Being transgender is the opposite of cool.  It's an immense amount of stress, because a lot of people hate people for being transgendered."

and a lot of people see them as validation for their delusional ideas about equality so in some circles they are venerated

"Even still the latter doesn't follow from the former."

how does it not? if something(in this case gender) is constructed out of our social makeup then how does it not follow?

"Gender is a social construct, that doesn't mean a change in the perception of gender would cause people to change their own gender."

if gender is socially constructed then how could our collective perceptions on gender and obviously as a result our interactions also changing not have an impact?

are trying to argue that our perceptions do not impact significantly on the social makeup of a society?

"You still seem to think that people are choosing to be transgender.  No one is doing that."

how do you explain the people who detransition?

"Conspiracies do happen."

which ones?



sundin13 said:
o_O.Q said:

"however, I do think we see by how few posts this thread is getting though that those who do support stories like this aren't really interested in the truth and are just interested in propaganda for the culture war"

what did you expect in terms of discussion from this thread? does this one situation where presumably the little boy wants to be a girl or whatever mean that there isn't a wider problem with how this issue is presented?

Quite the opposite actually. There very much is a wider problem with how "this issue" is presented. You and I just disagree on what that problem is.

you mean you disagree with my refusal to concede that a man becomes a woman if he identifies as one?