By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Papa Phil: "Xbox has to mean quality games"

Tagged games:

I believe Killer Instinct is being celebrated just because it is only on Xbox (and PC). The game is too basic and vastly better fighters have been released this generation. It benefited from being released early, nostalgia and being one of the few exclusives Xbox One has. It's an easy to pick up and fun to play fighter, like most fighters, but nothing special. 

As for Phil's statements, saying "I've heard it all before" is tempting but there have been many actions taken lately by MS to make me believe they're gearing up for a bang in terms of next-gen exclusive content.



Around the Network

Sounds like the usual MS PR talk.



Azzanation said:

400 is a big library however the whole Xbox only has Halo, Gears, and Forza saying is a poor judgement in what the console actually offers. Yes they are MS's biggest games however to excuse games like Killer Instinct and Ori just to name a couple is sort of disrespectful to the system.

I wasn't excusing them, even including them doesn't change my original point... That Microsoft is lacking substantial quantity of exclusive titles.
Plus they are missing some genre's in their exclusive lineup... But so is Sony and Nintendo for that matter, especially on the Turn-based and real-time strategy fronts.

Exclusives have been an Achilles heel of the Xbox from about half way through the Xbox 360 generation.

Azzanation said:

Killer Instinct is a game that's been heavily supported from day one back in 2013 and only recently has stopped with 3 Expansion Packs. Its been Xboxs best revival game. Its that good of a game that there is a high chance of it becoming a future staple to the Xbox brand. Fingers crossed for its future sequel being just as good as the 1st game. Also KI being on PC makes no difference since Halo, Gears and Forza are also on PC. It should be included in the discussion when talking about Xboxs Pillar games especially this gen. KI has carried the X1 and deserves credit from day one.

Killer Instinct is a great game, but I would prefer they did things a bit differently and drop the season stuff, it only just creates confusion for consumers when it comes to purchase time... But I digress, it's still an amazingly solid title with a ton of charm, they captured the original SNES feel perfectly, which is a hard task considering that the game wasn't done by the original developers, shit was even made by several different developers. - So props to Microsoft for managing that title well.

I feel that Killer Instinct could be bigger in the eSports arena if they handle the I.P. right.

The fact that Halo, Gears and Forza are also on PC just means they can't be regarded as true platform exclusives either... Not that I am complaining, I think it's a good thing if they end up on Steam, I prefer the PC.

Azzanation said:

400 is a big library however the whole Xbox only has Halo, Gears, and Forza saying is a poor judgement in what the console actually offers. Yes they are MS's biggest games however to excuse games like Killer Instinct and Ori just to name a couple is sort of disrespectful to the system.

Microsoft's "exclusives" (Loose term, they don't really exist anymore...) like Recore, Sunset Overdrive, Ori, Killer Instinct, Quantum Break, Cuphead and so on were great, they weren't ground breaking, they were available on other devices... Microsoft just hasn't been able to smash it out of the park like Sony has been able to do with say... Horizon or Spiderman. -They certainly haven't been able to throw out the sheer volume of exclusives either.

That doesn't mean the games are terrible, far from it... And it is criticisms like these that Microsoft takes note of and puts an effort in to improve, hence why they are building up their studio portfolio for next gen... And us, the consumer wins because of it.

Azzanation said:

This gen, the X1s best game series have been..

Ori and the Blind Forest (2 Games)

Killer Instinct (3 Expansions)

Halo (2 Games)

Gears Of War (2 Games)

Forza Motorsport (3 Games)

Forza Horizon (3 Games)

That's a lot of support for those games in 1 generation and we should be adding another 3 IPs to the typical Halo, Gears and Forza saying. KI, Ori and Horizon have earnt there place this gen and next gen shouldn't be any different. 

They are all on PC, except Halo 5, Forza Motorsport 5, 6 and Forza Horizon 2.

Those franchises (Forza, Gears and Halo) tends to be a good money spinner for Microsoft, so it makes sense they would keep pushing those franchises... And for good reason, they are solid franchises in their own right.

DonFerrari said:

About best looking console game on 7th gen I would still grant that title to either Killzone or TLOU.

Battlefield 4 is probably the best technical showpiece of the 7th gen as it was a massive multi-platform title that pushed Frostbite to the limits on 7th gen, the deferred renderer truly looked great when it debuted with Battlefield 3 with all it's effects, my jaw had to be picked up off the ground several times back then.

Killzone, The Last of Us, Uncharted, Halo 4 are great technical showpieces as well, no doubt about it, but I felt Battlefield took a larger technical leap.

LurkerJ said:

I believe Killer Instinct is being celebrated just because it is only on Xbox (and PC). The game is too basic and vastly better fighters have been released this generation. It benefited from being released early, nostalgia and being one of the few exclusives Xbox One has. It's an easy to pick up and fun to play fighter, like most fighters, but nothing special. 

Killer Instinct was "basic" on the Super Nintendo as well, it didn't really do anything novel that other fighters didn't do.

The difference is the package in it's entirety, the sound cues, the visual cues, the music, the atmosphere, the characters, the controls... The entire shebang.
The initial reviews were pretty mixed because of how bare-bones the game was on the Xbox One release, but considering those largest complaints have pretty much been rectified now...

The same goes for a game like Donkey Kong Country on the SNES... As a platformer it didn't really do anything new or novel that hadn't been done in a platformer before, but it's entire package as a whole had a ton of charm and fantastic visual and audio cues which propelled that game as one of the Super Nintendo's best selling and most highly praised games of all time.

LurkerJ said:

As for Phil's statements, saying "I've heard it all before" is tempting but there have been many actions taken lately by MS to make me believe they're gearing up for a bang in terms of next-gen exclusive content.

Actions speak louder than words.



--::{PC Gaming Master Race}::--

Pemalite said:
Azzanation said:

400 is a big library however the whole Xbox only has Halo, Gears, and Forza saying is a poor judgement in what the console actually offers. Yes they are MS's biggest games however to excuse games like Killer Instinct and Ori just to name a couple is sort of disrespectful to the system.

I wasn't excusing them, even including them doesn't change my original point... That Microsoft is lacking substantial quantity of exclusive titles.
Plus they are missing some genre's in their exclusive lineup... But so is Sony and Nintendo for that matter, especially on the Turn-based and real-time strategy fronts.

Exclusives have been an Achilles heel of the Xbox from about half way through the Xbox 360 generation.

Azzanation said:

Killer Instinct is a game that's been heavily supported from day one back in 2013 and only recently has stopped with 3 Expansion Packs. Its been Xboxs best revival game. Its that good of a game that there is a high chance of it becoming a future staple to the Xbox brand. Fingers crossed for its future sequel being just as good as the 1st game. Also KI being on PC makes no difference since Halo, Gears and Forza are also on PC. It should be included in the discussion when talking about Xboxs Pillar games especially this gen. KI has carried the X1 and deserves credit from day one.

Killer Instinct is a great game, but I would prefer they did things a bit differently and drop the season stuff, it only just creates confusion for consumers when it comes to purchase time... But I digress, it's still an amazingly solid title with a ton of charm, they captured the original SNES feel perfectly, which is a hard task considering that the game wasn't done by the original developers, shit was even made by several different developers. - So props to Microsoft for managing that title well.

I feel that Killer Instinct could be bigger in the eSports arena if they handle the I.P. right.

The fact that Halo, Gears and Forza are also on PC just means they can't be regarded as true platform exclusives either... Not that I am complaining, I think it's a good thing if they end up on Steam, I prefer the PC.

Azzanation said:

400 is a big library however the whole Xbox only has Halo, Gears, and Forza saying is a poor judgement in what the console actually offers. Yes they are MS's biggest games however to excuse games like Killer Instinct and Ori just to name a couple is sort of disrespectful to the system.

Microsoft's "exclusives" (Loose term, they don't really exist anymore...) like Recore, Sunset Overdrive, Ori, Killer Instinct, Quantum Break, Cuphead and so on were great, they weren't ground breaking, they were available on other devices... Microsoft just hasn't been able to smash it out of the park like Sony has been able to do with say... Horizon or Spiderman. -They certainly haven't been able to throw out the sheer volume of exclusives either.

That doesn't mean the games are terrible, far from it... And it is criticisms like these that Microsoft takes note of and puts an effort in to improve, hence why they are building up their studio portfolio for next gen... And us, the consumer wins because of it.

Azzanation said:

This gen, the X1s best game series have been..

Ori and the Blind Forest (2 Games)

Killer Instinct (3 Expansions)

Halo (2 Games)

Gears Of War (2 Games)

Forza Motorsport (3 Games)

Forza Horizon (3 Games)

That's a lot of support for those games in 1 generation and we should be adding another 3 IPs to the typical Halo, Gears and Forza saying. KI, Ori and Horizon have earnt there place this gen and next gen shouldn't be any different. 

They are all on PC, except Halo 5, Forza Motorsport 5, 6 and Forza Horizon 2.

Those franchises (Forza, Gears and Halo) tends to be a good money spinner for Microsoft, so it makes sense they would keep pushing those franchises... And for good reason, they are solid franchises in their own right.

DonFerrari said:

About best looking console game on 7th gen I would still grant that title to either Killzone or TLOU.

Battlefield 4 is probably the best technical showpiece of the 7th gen as it was a massive multi-platform title that pushed Frostbite to the limits on 7th gen, the deferred renderer truly looked great when it debuted with Battlefield 3 with all it's effects, my jaw had to be picked up off the ground several times back then.

Killzone, The Last of Us, Uncharted, Halo 4 are great technical showpieces as well, no doubt about it, but I felt Battlefield took a larger technical leap.

LurkerJ said:

I believe Killer Instinct is being celebrated just because it is only on Xbox (and PC). The game is too basic and vastly better fighters have been released this generation. It benefited from being released early, nostalgia and being one of the few exclusives Xbox One has. It's an easy to pick up and fun to play fighter, like most fighters, but nothing special. 

Killer Instinct was "basic" on the Super Nintendo as well, it didn't really do anything novel that other fighters didn't do.

The difference is the package in it's entirety, the sound cues, the visual cues, the music, the atmosphere, the characters, the controls... The entire shebang.
The initial reviews were pretty mixed because of how bare-bones the game was on the Xbox One release, but considering those largest complaints have pretty much been rectified now...

The same goes for a game like Donkey Kong Country on the SNES... As a platformer it didn't really do anything new or novel that hadn't been done in a platformer before, but it's entire package as a whole had a ton of charm and fantastic visual and audio cues which propelled that game as one of the Super Nintendo's best selling and most highly praised games of all time.

LurkerJ said:

As for Phil's statements, saying "I've heard it all before" is tempting but there have been many actions taken lately by MS to make me believe they're gearing up for a bang in terms of next-gen exclusive content.

Actions speak louder than words.

I understood you were talking about the best presentations. Not the best multiplatform technical achievements. But nothing really important as we both would agree that the games listed were among the best and it would be a matter of taste of details to determine who would stand above all.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

Echo_Djinn said:
If Xbox doesn't start taking notes from Japanese game design (Persona, Nier, Nioh, most Nintendo games) or Indie PC design (Factorio, Outward, A Hat in Time), then I can't see myself ever moving to Xbox. These developers are putting out such fantastic, innovative games, while Xbox just churns out the exact same stuff year after year.

You don't need an xbox to get their exclusives anymore. If you have a PC, you're good. Just letting you know in case you already have a good enough PC. You don't have to get an Xbox because they are bringing Xbox to you.



Around the Network

Honestly, i'm glad that interviewer bluntly interviewed Phil, because he needed to have an honest heart to heart with a reporter who wasn't going to kiss up to him. Lets hope those games are good.



DonFerrari said:

Even Phill Spencer agrees that the first party content of Xbox have been of lower quality, but some users on VGC won't accept it.

Plus I hate GAAS, and Phill basically showed they will double down on it, and "SP games are dead"

Well, there are two key flaws in your post.

First, GAAS can also apply to single player. The newest Ass Creed games for example, have big GAAS elements but offer huge, quality SP experiences. Forza Horizon is a prime example of GAAS but you can play through all of the amazing content in SP. 

Lastly, this idea that SP games are “dead” to MS is just a false narrative. Do you really think they went out and bought a slew of studios known for quality SP games just to make all of them jump ship to multiplayer? Please. Also, as big as MS has embraced GAAS, almost all of their games are still perfectly good SP games. Plus Papa Phil confirmed on twitter yesterday that those studios are going to be making more SP games. I’m sure you know his Twitter. 



LudicrousSpeed said:
DonFerrari said:

Even Phill Spencer agrees that the first party content of Xbox have been of lower quality, but some users on VGC won't accept it.

Plus I hate GAAS, and Phill basically showed they will double down on it, and "SP games are dead"

Well, there are two key flaws in your post.

First, GAAS can also apply to single player. The newest Ass Creed games for example, have big GAAS elements but offer huge, quality SP experiences. Forza Horizon is a prime example of GAAS but you can play through all of the amazing content in SP. 

Lastly, this idea that SP games are “dead” to MS is just a false narrative. Do you really think they went out and bought a slew of studios known for quality SP games just to make all of them jump ship to multiplayer? Please. Also, as big as MS has embraced GAAS, almost all of their games are still perfectly good SP games. Plus Papa Phil confirmed on twitter yesterday that those studios are going to be making more SP games. I’m sure you know his Twitter. 

I don't use Twitter.

But I'm pretty sure we had threads in the recent past with posts from MS themselves claiming SP was dead.

And sorry, but putting GAAS into SP is a no go for me. I want my game to be complete when I start and that after I finish it within couple of weeks I'm good. The story needs to be self-contained.

At least you didn't say Phil is lying when he say the quality of MS output have been lower than it should.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari said:
LudicrousSpeed said:

Well, there are two key flaws in your post.

First, GAAS can also apply to single player. The newest Ass Creed games for example, have big GAAS elements but offer huge, quality SP experiences. Forza Horizon is a prime example of GAAS but you can play through all of the amazing content in SP. 

Lastly, this idea that SP games are “dead” to MS is just a false narrative. Do you really think they went out and bought a slew of studios known for quality SP games just to make all of them jump ship to multiplayer? Please. Also, as big as MS has embraced GAAS, almost all of their games are still perfectly good SP games. Plus Papa Phil confirmed on twitter yesterday that those studios are going to be making more SP games. I’m sure you know his Twitter. 

I don't use Twitter.

But I'm pretty sure we had threads in the recent past with posts from MS themselves claiming SP was dead.

And sorry, but putting GAAS into SP is a no go for me. I want my game to be complete when I start and that after I finish it within couple of weeks I'm good. The story needs to be self-contained.

At least you didn't say Phil is lying when he say the quality of MS output have been lower than it should.

Nah, any thread you might have maybe potentially seen here with news that Microsoft thinks “SP is dead” is as much of fake news as your post. They haven’t said that. 

Your own personal opinions on SP and GAAS doesn’t change reality. You can have GAAS and still be SP. Games that are SP and have GAAS elements sell tens of millions every single year. Also the stories here are self contained. They are complete games. 

I don’t even know how to decipher that last part. 



LudicrousSpeed said:
DonFerrari said:

I don't use Twitter.

But I'm pretty sure we had threads in the recent past with posts from MS themselves claiming SP was dead.

And sorry, but putting GAAS into SP is a no go for me. I want my game to be complete when I start and that after I finish it within couple of weeks I'm good. The story needs to be self-contained.

At least you didn't say Phil is lying when he say the quality of MS output have been lower than it should.

Nah, any thread you might have maybe potentially seen here with news that Microsoft thinks “SP is dead” is as much of fake news as your post. They haven’t said that. 

Your own personal opinions on SP and GAAS doesn’t change reality. You can have GAAS and still be SP. Games that are SP and have GAAS elements sell tens of millions every single year. Also the stories here are self contained. They are complete games. 

I don’t even know how to decipher that last part. 

Sure sure, much fakenews... must be the reason for the plenty of SP is dead memes and comments on several threads here.

https://gearnuke.com/microsoft-difficult-to-make-triple-a-game/

Perhaps this MS person is lying?

Well if you can't decipher perhaps we should ask it a different way. Dos Xbox means guality games?



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."