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Forums - Politics Discussion - Israel 70 years celebration & US opens embassy in Jerusalem, lethal clashes erupt

Eagle367 said:
Mr Puggsly said:

Nose? Is that some sort of anti-semitic joke?

I would never argue Israel's actions aren't questionable. I would simply argue the middle east is a god awful place, where the worst religion reigns supreme, and the Jews are arguably the most civil people there.

That's how I look at the entire situation and just say, "meh."

Then you my friend need more research. I would argue the best nation in the middle East is Oman. Look at them they don't support Iran or Saudi Arabia, they don't support any terrorists and don't get into any of the stupid politics. They don't have the blood of innocent Palestinians on their hands. Also you rally should visit the place before dissing it, it's not as barbaric as you Anke it out to be. Anyways give me any reasons why the Jews of Israel are better than the Muslims of Oman? Don't you dare say democracy though since democracy isn't objectively better you can get a trump from democracy and you can get a really good leader from other methods as well. Anyways Oman>>>>>>>>>>Israel.

Oman sounds lovely. I mean any country where being gay is illegal is reflective of a very evolved society. Seems to be a country with a lot of human rights issues, but whatever. I'm not arguing Israel is perfect.

No, democracy is better than monarchy. Trump won't be president forever and he has limited power, that's the opposite of what Oman appears to have.



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CartBlanche said:
numberwang said:

 

This headline is so wrong in many levels. A clash is a fight between 2 armed forces. Hopefully they are evenly matched. What you have in Palestine is a massacre❗️The Israeli side has snipers and tear gas, the Palestinians have sticks and stones. Not one Israeli soldier or citizen has been killed due to the one sided nature of the massacre going on right now. All this happening on occupied, stolen, land❗️It would be like your neighbour moving your fence boundary to steal your land and when you go, unarmed, to protest about them stealing your land, they shoot you and your family and the other neighbours do NOTHING to help you or the police(US government).

This kind of rhetoric goes both ways. If Hamas shoots rockets or sends suicide bombers they are labeled as some form of people's army with legitimate use of force in a war. If they get shot, they become civilians.

Last edited by numberwang - on 17 May 2018

Kalkano said:
deskpro2k3 said:

you know that statement is bs right? the UN is what gave the okay for Israel to be there in the first place.

When was that?  What year is it, now?

This shouldn't be difficult to figure out.

I find it kind of ironic that in my city an organization in my city also asked for an investigation and they got nailed down by some as being anti semetic/Jews haters etc, if people looked further they would have found that it's an Jewish organisation with Jewish leaders (d'uh) that are getting tired of what is going on in Israel and not doing an investigation would litterally also hurt them






numberwang said:

This kind of rhetoric goes both ways. If Hamas shoots rockets or sends suicide bombers they are labeled as some form of people's army with legitimate use of force in a war. If they get shot, they become civilians.

Since the border has gone up, there have been no suicide bombing in Israel. Even though the people in Palestine are patrolled on all sides and Israel doesn't allow (literally) anything in or out without their approval, you'll notice that somehow magically rockets get through to "Hamas" the moment peace talks are on the table. So the people who are suffering the most, in what is effectively an intern/POW camp want more suffering by stopping any negotiations?!?!?! Very co-incidental and convenient isn't it? Then Israel steals more land and the cycle continues.



Kyuu said:  
Mr Puggsly said:

Oman sounds lovely. I mean any country where being gay is illegal is reflective of a very evolved society. Seems to be a country with a lot of human rights issues, but whatever. I'm not arguing Israel is perfect.

No, democracy is better than monarchy. Trump won't be president forever and he has limited power, that's the opposite of what Oman appears to have.

Haha, what a primitive way to judge a society. By your silly logic, Iraq and Iran are "more evolved" societies than Oman because the former's government is now a democracy and the latter permits sex reassignment surgeries if said conditions are met (Yes, transgenders are a recognized community in Iran!! Can you believe it?!) And for your information, Oman's Sultan is largely believed to be homosexual himself yet the same people who claim it ADORE him. I'm not excusing Oman's restrictive laws against gays, I'm just saying there is a whole lot more to take into account before you estimate where said societies morally stand.

As for Palestine... If largely savage or ignorant nations like WW2 Japan and Nazi Germany are allowed the chance to evolve morally, then any nation barring no exceptions deserves this chance as well. This goes both for Palestinians and Israelis.

If you genuinely want to learn about Palestinians and Israelis. I advise checking out Corey's channel:

https://www.youtube.com/user/coreygilshuster

But of course the odds are you're not interested. You made up your mind a long long time ago that Palestinians and Muslims are barbaric and that Israel, who is a "gay-supporting democracy" can't possibly be fucked up in regards to different and arguably bigger issues.

Hehe, its Oman that's primitive. What I mentioned is a reminder Islamic societies are primitive and plagued with problems.

Again, I never claimed Israel is a perfect society. But ideal scenario for most in that region of the world is the Jews simply die or go away. So the people of Israel weren't put in a good situation to being with.

I will actually take a look at the YouTube channel you shared. I will subscribe and watch videos later. I'm partial to western societies though and have disdain for Islam run countries though, so I guess I have bias to begin with.



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This is an example of the stupidity of the right, and how Trump and the Israeli right are completely out of touch with the reality of the situation in the region. Anyone with half a brain could see what was going to happen. Unfortunately, the US and Israel are run by halfwits.

Complete disaster and failure.

Last edited by Jumpin - on 19 May 2018

I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

The land grab/stealing continues - https://www.reuters.com/article/us-israel-palestinians-settlements/israel-plans-2500-new-settler-homes-in-west-bank-defense-minister-idUSKCN1IP0T6



EnricoPallazzo said:
Eagle367 said:

 Anyways Oman>>>>>>>>>>Israel.

Just curious, really... can I bring a bible when entering Oman? Can I preach another religion than Islam? IS there free press there, can I drink alcohol or access porn websites? Can I vote for president, watch any movie I want, preach for communism?

I'm not teasing, just wanted to know if there is a really free country in middle east. I would be surprised.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christianity_in_Oman

So in order 

Yes 

kinda and kinda not: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_religion_in_Oman

yes in privacy: http://www.expat.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=459233

"Bringing prescription drugs without a valid prescription is banned. So are the carrying of any psychotic substances (obvious) ! Drinking alcohol in public is banned. So is seen drunk in public places. Pork is banned, but are sold at select outlets and under proper specifications. Serving cooked pork in restaurants in banned. VoIP is banned. Pornography is banned. Prostitution is banned. 

In short, anything which is considered to be abusive, offensive, obscene, immoral or promoting misleading or fraudulent information and illegal material are all banned.

All expatriates must realise and understand that they are in a foreign country. And they must do well to completely abide by the local laws, rules and regulations. Anyone getting on the wrong side of the law are bound to get penalised and punished, if caught."

Yes : One example cimena in oman: https://oman.voxcinemas.com

Not the leader but the lower assembly:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consultative_Assembly_(Oman)

No i don't think so, but do not know.

The thing is though Oman doesn't enter unnecessary wars and doesn't go off killing other groups of people like Israel does to Palestine. It stays clear of almost all conflict and doesn't take sides between Saudi Arabia and Iran and as far as I know is not influenced by either Russia or US. It's like an oasis in a middle east filled with conflict and it's not a false sense of peace like israel either where people are ding, starving and suffering on the other side of a wall at the borders. They have managed to stay clear of the radar of terrorists, news, etc alike. Oman is not perfect by any means and it's not a democracy in actuality but it's citizens are happy, there's no religious in fighting or out fighting, and it doesn't take part in petty conflicts. Religions might be a bit regulated but there are christains, hindus and others that can practice their religion.It's not ideal or the best place on earth but it stands mountains above other middle eastern nations including israel, saudi arabia, UAE, Qatar, Kuwait, etc. And all these countries are not as bad as the media makes them out to be. Only by visiting them will you see the reality. same goes for Pakistan in South Asia. It is a democracy and the leaders are voted but I think Oman is better than Pakistan. Any country that murders innocent people on it's borders at a continuos rate is not that good of a country in my opinion. 



Just a guy who doesn't want to be bored. Also

Kyuu said:
EnricoPallazzo said:

Just curious, really... can I bring a bible when entering Oman? Can I preach another religion than Islam? IS there free press there, can I drink alcohol or access porn websites? Can I vote for president, watch any movie I want, preach for communism?

I'm not teasing, just wanted to know if there is a really free country in middle east. I would be surprised.

How many countries have Oman invaded or occupied since their establishment and how many people have they killed? How many houses have they demolished and wars they instigated? You see.. every country/nation have its ups and downs. Israel for example is a paranoid and lunatic warmongering state. The exact opposite of Oman.

I don't know about the specifics of Oman, but I do know that drinking alcohol at home is legally permitted for non-Muslims. The country has its own set of laws that doesn't allow some of the things you enjoy and take for granted in your free western country, especially if you are a Muslim (Non-Muslims are privileged in Oman). You do however get something else that some might consider priceless. Omanis are quite literally the kindest people I've had the honor to interact with; they're bright and incredibly friendly. You just don't feel an iota of the passive aggressive hostility which plagues parts of the western world, free and perfect as it may otherwise be. This thread for instance reeks of dislike towards victims, and shamelessly expresses support and sympathy to downright murderers at the hour of the murder. To say nothing of the toxic lies, misleading information, prejudices, and unwillingness to listen. You don't get that in Oman. Omanis are inherently friendly and also great listeners.

Sadly though, not even Oman could save Avicii.

Mr Puggsly said:

Oman sounds lovely. I mean any country where being gay is illegal is reflective of a very evolved society. Seems to be a country with a lot of human rights issues, but whatever. I'm not arguing Israel is perfect.

No, democracy is better than monarchy. Trump won't be president forever and he has limited power, that's the opposite of what Oman appears to have.

Haha, what a primitive way to judge a society. By your silly logic, Iraq and Iran are "more evolved" societies than Oman because the former's government is now a democracy and the latter permits sex reassignment surgeries if said conditions are met (Yes, transgenders are a recognized community in Iran!! Can you believe it?!) And for your information, Oman's Sultan is largely believed to be homosexual himself yet the same people who claim it ADORE him. I'm not excusing Oman's restrictive laws against gays, I'm just saying there is a whole lot more to take into account before you estimate where said societies morally stand.

As for Palestine... If largely savage or ignorant nations like WW2 Japan and Nazi Germany are allowed the chance to evolve morally, then any nation barring no exceptions deserves this chance as well. This goes both for Palestinians and Israelis.

If you genuinely want to learn about Palestinians and Israelis. I advise checking out Corey's channel:

https://www.youtube.com/user/coreygilshuster

But of course the odds are you're not interested. You made up your mind a long long time ago that Palestinians and Muslims are barbaric and that Israel, who is a "gay-supporting democracy" can't possibly be fucked up in regards to different and arguably bigger issues.

Well  said. I never stated Oman is perfect and the best in the world. I only said it's a lot better than a war mongering, conflict causing, innocent murdering nation in israel which is true



Just a guy who doesn't want to be bored. Also

Mr Puggsly said:
Kyuu said:  

Haha, what a primitive way to judge a society. By your silly logic, Iraq and Iran are "more evolved" societies than Oman because the former's government is now a democracy and the latter permits sex reassignment surgeries if said conditions are met (Yes, transgenders are a recognized community in Iran!! Can you believe it?!) And for your information, Oman's Sultan is largely believed to be homosexual himself yet the same people who claim it ADORE him. I'm not excusing Oman's restrictive laws against gays, I'm just saying there is a whole lot more to take into account before you estimate where said societies morally stand.

As for Palestine... If largely savage or ignorant nations like WW2 Japan and Nazi Germany are allowed the chance to evolve morally, then any nation barring no exceptions deserves this chance as well. This goes both for Palestinians and Israelis.

If you genuinely want to learn about Palestinians and Israelis. I advise checking out Corey's channel:

https://www.youtube.com/user/coreygilshuster

But of course the odds are you're not interested. You made up your mind a long long time ago that Palestinians and Muslims are barbaric and that Israel, who is a "gay-supporting democracy" can't possibly be fucked up in regards to different and arguably bigger issues.

Hehe, its Oman that's primitive. What I mentioned is a reminder Islamic societies are primitive and plagued with problems.

Again, I never claimed Israel is a perfect society. But ideal scenario for most in that region of the world is the Jews simply die or go away. So the people of Israel weren't put in a good situation to being with.

I will actually take a look at the YouTube channel you shared. I will subscribe and watch videos later. I'm partial to western societies though and have disdain for Islam run countries though, so I guess I have bias to begin with.

Answer the question: How many innocents has oman killed in another country? How many wars waged? Why is oman primitive just because it doesn't follow the western method of government? Oman is not a murderous monster who constantly breaks international law and wants all Palestinians dead. Go to Oman to see for yourself and send then to Palestine and then to Israel. They don't even follow the treaty and constantly make illegal settlements. They are pushing Palestinians into more and more of a crammed corner and building walls to segregate them.

Israel:

http://www.effedieffe.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=63404https://www.haaretz.com/polopoly_fs/1.5678788.1515433506!/image/1018316866.jpg" width="609" height="343">

 

"Barbaric" Oman:

https://www.expatwoman.com/oman/guide/faqs/churches-in-oman

https://shriradhemaa.blogspot.com/2014/01/when-sultan-of-oman-protected-sri.html

https://www.meforum.org/articles/2017/oman-the-middle-east-s-most-surprising-country

Last edited by Eagle367 - on 11 June 2018

Just a guy who doesn't want to be bored. Also