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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Nintendo Fans Vs. Third-Party Developers & Entitlement

oniyide said:
zorg1000 said:
oniyide said:
zorg1000 said:
oniyide said:
zorg1000 said:

 


Really, that's what u got out of what I said? Splatoon & Mario Maker are all Nintendo needed for Wii U? Sometimes I feel like you act ignorant on purpose so u can argue for the sake of argument.

-heavier investment in new ip/new ideas

-strong, focused advertising/marketing

-increased & consistent software output

-more mass market launch price

So no, simply releasing Splatoon/Mario Maker and calling it a day is not what I'm suggesting, I'm stating we need more games that feel new & fresh that are simple yet fun and appeal to multiple demographics.

first off, relax yourself

2nd what are these games? what kind would they be? If it were that simple Ninty would be doing it. Ill agree on the marketing it sucks. How can you have consistent software output without 3rd parties? Ninty has to support two systems? should they just drop one? More studios? that costs money. i dont care how much people think they made on WIi and DS that was years ago, if they had it like that would they be farming out IPs to 3rd parties to make niche 2nd party games? Thats a start but they need more. Are they able to do more?

How will they be able to give a mass market launch price? Unless they pull a Wii and put out old slow HW then the problem of no support returns because the system will be too far behind to get that support. But ill agree to this becasue they clearly cant sell a system for the same price that Sony and MS does.

Your giving "solutions" but you are stopping right there you arent asking how they would arrive at these solutions, sorry if i like to dig a bit deeper.


Like I have stated 100 times before, completely unify the Nintendo ecosystem so that all games are available on all devices. No longer should Nintendo fragment their audience by splitting resources between two or more separate devices. Look at the the support Nintendo platforms have gotten in the last 9 months.

September 20-Disney Infinity: Marvel Super Heroes

September 26-Hyrule Warriors

October 2-Skylanders: Trap Team

October 3-Super Smash Bros. for 3DS

October 12-Pac Man and the Ghostly Adventures 2

October 21-Just Dance 2015

October 24-Fantasy Life

October 24-Bayonetta 2

October 24-Pokemon Art Academy

November 11-Lego Batman 3: Beyond Gotham

November 11-Sonic Boom: Rise of Lyric/Shattered Crystal

November 21-Super Smash Bros. for Wii U

November 21-Pokemon Omega Ruby/Alpha Sapphire

November 25-Persona Q: Shadow of the Labyrinth

December 5-Captain Toad: Treasure Tracker

December 5-NES Remix Pack

February 13-The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask 3D

February 13-Monster Hunter 4 Ultimate

February 18-Pokemon Shuffle

February 20-Kirby and the Rainbow Curse

March 5-Mario vs. Donkey Kong: Tipping Stars

March 13-Codename S.T.E.A.M.

March 20-Mario Party 10

March 20-Fossil Fighter: Frontier

March 31-Story of Seasons

April 2-Boxboy!

April 7-Etrian Mystery Dungeon

April 8-Pokemon Rumble World

April 10-Xenoblade Chronicles 3D

May 5-Devil Survivor 2: Record Breaker

May 12-Attack on Titan: Humanity in Chains

May 14-Stretchmo

May 22-Puzzles & Dragons+Super Mario Bros. Edition

May 29-Splatoon

And a whole bunch of indie & Virtual Console titles, so there is literally never a drought when u combine both sets of hardware. Power is not a major selling feature for Nintendo, so yes they should go with a device that is less powerful than the competitors but this time don't use expensive unnecessary features that raise the cost of hsrdware like 3D screens or Gamepad controllers.

Now that all games are on either device, there is less need to make 2 separate entries of their major franchises meaning the increased output of new ip which in turn means a higher chance of finding the next big craze like Pokémon or Minecraft.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

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captain carot said:
To get the quote tree down. Handhelds are not home consoles! They are called handhelds because they are held in the hand. Some people might call that a mobile gaming device, though even an Xbox One isn't exactly immobile.

It does neither have a built in display nor battery though. Otherwise it would be an Atari Lynx.

Now for the E³ 2005 and 2006 PR babble. That's what it was. If a company is lucky it turns out right. Like Sony PR talk in 1999. Or in 2013. Or MS PR talk in 2005.

I actually have never ever seen a company stand up and say now this is our device/game/car/phone/shoe/piece of junk you just buy because we are so f...ing good in marketing BS and actually it's totally mediocre we dont know if anyone is interested at all but hey, maybe someones gonna buy it. Or not. Lets see.


It wasn't just PR babble, Iwata specifically said they were going to attract a whole new audience to consoles and they did. Having a clear cut strategy and executing it effectively by definition is not luck or an accident.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

oniyide said:
DonFerrari said:


Point taken. But did it suck enough for a 80% less sale on twice as big userbase? Did everyone knew it sucked before hand since most copies sell early on?


IMHO yeah a bit. right before the series got super big. Wii version was selling on par. COD3 Wii was the 2nd best selling one. But that game SUCKED HARRRD! So the next one sells a little less. As teh other systems got more popular so did the series. It always sold best on MS anyway. PS3 version being damn near the same version albeit DLC coming late etc. caught some of the popularity. I think after the first one the damage was done. Plus its a very multiplayer online centric game, so most people want to play with there friends. Most people werent playing on Wii. 

The irony is the Wii versions were actually getting better quality wise over time but still didnt come close to PS360 version. 

People have no issue buying something that might not be the best version, no one is really trying to own like 3 consoles and a PC but it has to be a little difference. The difference between most PS360 multiplats were minute enough that unless you're one of us you arent going to notice. With Wii anyone half blind could see the difference.

It was second but sold a lot less than x360 version even with the difference in userbase.

 

On the subpar version, we have so much claim that graphics don't matter that I started believing.

 

Have sports franchise sold well on Wii before being chopped?



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

Posted elsewhere on here, but I think it pretty much sums up this too regarding Project CARS:

I refuse to believe there is a huge crowd of Sim Racer hungry users just dying for a game on Wii U. It seems far more likely that Nintendo websites sniffed the chance to get a 3rd party game and sent all their users to tick Wii U.
The simple truth is, this would have struggled to muster up tens of thousands of sales on Wii U.

The arguments just don't stack up for me. People are upset because Nintendo users have been denied a chance to play the game now. Yet evidence of previous 3rd party releases shows that there isn't an audience there wanting to play the games on Wii U. It would have been a late port, which is used as justification not to buy a game on Nintendo. It would have been inferior in every way to the other versions, which is used as a justification not to buy a game on Nintendo. Newsflash, if you only have a Wii U, it doesn't matter how gimped or late a port is, it's still the only way you can play that game. So if you really wanted it, you'd still buy it.

Then we're led to believe that SMS have cut off a huge chunk of their potential audience? Pretty much anyone wanting this game would have already had access to it on PC, PS4 or XB1, because this is where the audience for this genre of game lies. As is the case for most other 3rd party titles.

This was the real reason PS3 games sold well despite being inferior to the Xbox 360 versions. They still wanted the game, and didn't have a 360 and so had to "settle" for the inferior version.

Nintendo consoles have a very set audience that buy very specific things. Generally it has a Nintendo logo on it. It's what people buying Nintendo consoles want, and it's what they hand their money over to consume.



RIP Dad 25/11/51 - 13/12/13. You will be missed but never forgotten.

oniyide said:
the late port excuse is silly because games dont stop being good all of a sudden. Bioshock didnt stop being good because it came out a year later on PS3. Its the same game it was before. If you are a single console owner why does it matter that a game came out a year before on a system you dont have anyway?


So why would anyone pay full price for Watch Dogs on Wii U 9 months later when it's in bargain bins everywhere else? It's a valid excuse, just being a good game doesn't offset this it's that kind of thinking that encourages developers to try the things people dislike today like microtransactions, the game was released in the holiday season right next to Smash on top of this as well and people wonder why a version handled by its developer like an illigitimate from out the blue didn't sell. It's as comical as Ubisoft delaying and releasing Rayman next to GTAV, if I was a single platform owner I wouldn't buy it either and opt for Smash.



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Wyrdness said:

So why would anyone pay full price for Watch Dogs on Wii U 9 months later when it's in bargain bins everywhere else? It's a valid excuse, just being a good game doesn't offset this it's that kind of thinking, the game was released in the holiday season right next to Smash on top of this as well and people wonder why a version handled by its developer like an illigitimate from out the blue didn't sell. It's as comical as Ubisoft delaying and releasing Rayman next to GTAV, if I was a single platform owner I wouldn't buy it either and opt for Smash.

So I assume you didn´t/won´t pay full price for kirby(in europe), XBXC, Bravely second and most likely FExSMT. I mean they are late "ports" after all.



      
Yup...RO friggin rocked  
itsFizz said:
Wyrdness said:

So why would anyone pay full price for Watch Dogs on Wii U 9 months later when it's in bargain bins everywhere else? It's a valid excuse, just being a good game doesn't offset this it's that kind of thinking, the game was released in the holiday season right next to Smash on top of this as well and people wonder why a version handled by its developer like an illigitimate from out the blue didn't sell. It's as comical as Ubisoft delaying and releasing Rayman next to GTAV, if I was a single platform owner I wouldn't buy it either and opt for Smash.

So I assume you didn´t/won´t pay full price for kirby(in europe), XBXC, Bravely second and most likely FExSMT. I mean they are late "ports" after all.

Wow, the bargain bin point went completely over your head.



zorg1000 said:
captain carot said:
To get the quote tree down. Handhelds are not home consoles! They are called handhelds because they are held in the hand. Some people might call that a mobile gaming device, though even an Xbox One isn't exactly immobile.

It does neither have a built in display nor battery though. Otherwise it would be an Atari Lynx.

Now for the E³ 2005 and 2006 PR babble. That's what it was. If a company is lucky it turns out right. Like Sony PR talk in 1999. Or in 2013. Or MS PR talk in 2005.

I actually have never ever seen a company stand up and say now this is our device/game/car/phone/shoe/piece of junk you just buy because we are so f...ing good in marketing BS and actually it's totally mediocre we dont know if anyone is interested at all but hey, maybe someones gonna buy it. Or not. Lets see.


It wasn't just PR babble, Iwata specifically said they were going to attract a whole new audience to consoles and they did. Having a clear cut strategy and executing it effectively by definition is not luck or an accident.

It was. And Wii was kind of a last resort option. Basically an overclocked Gamecube with Wiimote instead of controller. The hardware actually shows how desperate Nintendo was at that point. They put everything on the motion control card hoping it would be a hit. Not coming behind with production for a pretty long time actually shows how surprised Nintendo was.

Wii U as a whole shows they haven't really understood that success until this day nor are they able to repeat it easily.



Cream147 said:

Wow, the bargain bin point went completely over your head.

Disclaimer: I´m not somebody who cares that much about a games price...If I want it I buy it

Now I assume all the games I listed were in the bargain bin in Japan and the U.S.A. (in Kirbys case) by the time they released in Europe and/or the U.S.A. (in the case of all games beside kirby). I mean they were released 5 months(kirby), 2 years(original xenoblade. I assume X will release by december? so 9 months) and in bravely´s case most likely another 9 months later (bravely second released in april, so at least another 9 months till it releases ww as defaut took 14 months for Europe and 16 for the U.S.A to release). Anyways my point is "it doesn´t matter if a game comes later" last gen I was a PS3 only gamer and Bioshock is one of my most beloved experiences on it. Yeah full fucking price, 14 months after Xbox...and I never regretted it. You know why? it´s a friggin great game in my opinion. But yeah continue walking whatever kind of path you´ve chosen. In the end it´s your loss to deny yourself such great games


Edit: I shortened the quote tree
EDIT2: You will probably find plenty of grammar errors...I kindly ask you to ignore them



      
Yup...RO friggin rocked  
itsFizz said:
Wyrdness said:

So why would anyone pay full price for Watch Dogs on Wii U 9 months later when it's in bargain bins everywhere else? It's a valid excuse, just being a good game doesn't offset this it's that kind of thinking, the game was released in the holiday season right next to Smash on top of this as well and people wonder why a version handled by its developer like an illigitimate from out the blue didn't sell. It's as comical as Ubisoft delaying and releasing Rayman next to GTAV, if I was a single platform owner I wouldn't buy it either and opt for Smash.

So I assume you didn´t/won´t pay full price for kirby(in europe), XBXC, Bravely second and most likely FExSMT. I mean they are late "ports" after all.


Can't read a post or just plain didn't to rush out an argument?