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Forums - Politics Discussion - If medical coverage is not a necessity, what is it?

papamudd said:
Since obama had been in office i pay more for less coverage...

Are you saying this, because it has still been going on, or it didn't happen before Obama got in office?

I believe healthcare costs have been rising for decades now (one example going back to 2002):

http://money.cnn.com/2011/05/11/news/economy/healthcare_costs_family/index.htm



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sales2099 said:
This is why I like living in Canada. Taxed up the ass, but hey, free medical care.


At the cost of time and money the Canadian, along with most other medical systems suffers from poor competition as a result of people not caring about the cost. 

I myself am guilty of this as my insurance provides no incentive for me to look for cheaper medical care and thus the medical industry does not bother competing. 

I had the idea that insurance companies can offer a set rate for certain medical cost and if you shop arround for lower cost you receive a portion of the difference removed from your insurance premiums.



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richardhutnik said:
papamudd said:
Since obama had been in office i pay more for less coverage...

Are you saying this, because it has still been going on, or it didn't happen before Obama got in office?

I believe healthcare costs have been rising for decades now (one example going back to 2002):

http://money.cnn.com/2011/05/11/news/economy/healthcare_costs_family/index.htm

It's unfair to lay the blame for increasing healthcare cost on Obama alone (though he deserves part of the blame) as the lack of competition within the medical industry due to government and insurance systems.

I can't remember the last time I actually looked into the cost of any medical appointments or prodedures I have had because I am provided with no incentive to do so. If i were to receive incentive to shop arround the medical industry would be forced to take notice and compete like any other industry.

What concerns me most is not medical cost from my insurance but the increase in medicar and medicade spending on part of the government leading to increasing budget deficit in turn increased government debt to GDP ratio that is, I believe over 100% at this point and possibly on track to reach the levels seen right after WW2.



This is the Game of Thrones

Where you either win

or you DIE

SlayerRondo said:
sales2099 said:
This is why I like living in Canada. Taxed up the ass, but hey, free medical care.


At the cost of time and money the Canadian, along with most other medical systems suffers from poor competition as a result of people not caring about the cost. 

I myself am guilty of this as my insurance provides no incentive for me to look for cheaper medical care and thus the medical industry does not bother competing. 

I had the idea that insurance companies can offer a set rate for certain medical cost and if you shop arround for lower cost you receive a portion of the difference removed from your insurance premiums.

One of the features of Obamacare is exchanges and markets in states, where people get to buy insurance from a number of providers and they compete.  Apparently the big beef by opponents to Obamacare, besides the madate, is that it isn't a federal marketplace, but a case of each state having their own.  This is a feature of the Heritage Foundation plan, that Obama went with, that is supposed to drive costs now.

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2013-09-17/news/os-obamacare-costs-study-20130917_1_obamacare-insurance-insurance-marketplace-health-care-law



SlayerRondo said:
sales2099 said:
This is why I like living in Canada. Taxed up the ass, but hey, free medical care.

At the cost of time and money the Canadian, along with most other medical systems suffers from poor competition as a result of people not caring about the cost. 

Consider me a stupid British citizen happy to pay into a system that provides care when I (or any member of my family) need it regardless of problem but how is countries having an NHS bad for competition? especially when the idea of competition in healthcare is rediculous to me.

NHS spend what money they can to provide the best service they can and don't worry about if insurance companies 'pay up' or a sick person has the correct type of insurance. If you want to pay more, we have BUPA.

This said, I may be misunderstanding your point.



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sales2099 said:
This is why I like living in Canada. Taxed up the ass, but hey, free medical care.

The US government spends more on healthcare per capita than Canada does: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_the_health_care_systems_in_Canada_and_the_United_States

So it's more that the USA has a horrifically inefficient system than any lack of funding.



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The Fury said:
SlayerRondo said:
sales2099 said:
This is why I like living in Canada. Taxed up the ass, but hey, free medical care.

At the cost of time and money the Canadian, along with most other medical systems suffers from poor competition as a result of people not caring about the cost. 

Consider me a stupid British citizen happy to pay into a system that provides care when I (or any member of my family) need it regardless of problem but how is countries having an NHS bad for competition? especially when the idea of competition in healthcare is rediculous to me.

NHS spend what money they can to provide the best service they can and don't worry about if insurance companies 'pay up' or a sick person has the correct type of insurance. If you want to pay more, we have BUPA.

This said, I may be misunderstanding your point.

In America, you get people arguing that they can make their own deals for health care for themselves directly with doctors, no one really goes without, and also there are emergency rooms.  So, the last resort option people bring up emergency rooms in America.  I actually had one person tell me in a forum, "What are you complaining about?  You can always go to an emergency room!"  Emergency rooms are magical places that apparently don't cost anything to operate and act as a fountain of youth (or something).  And yes I did overstate a bit, to make a point.



Now, I am not saying I enjoy paying $71/week for family coverage but is it true that in countries where you get medical for free you could easily end up waiting weeks or more for something like a MRI, CAT scan or a visit with a Neurologist?



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Kantor said:
sales2099 said:
This is why I like living in Canada. Taxed up the ass, but hey, free medical care.

The US government spends more on healthcare per capita than Canada does: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_the_health_care_systems_in_Canada_and_the_United_States

So it's more that the USA has a horrifically inefficient system than any lack of funding.

The USA gets a fairly poor bang for the buck for its healthcare.  In the political debates, this will often get ignored behind mantras of "America has the best healthcare in the world!", and individuals like Rush Limbaugh who argues that individuals can afford to take out loans the size of the cost of half a SUV to pay for a procedure if needed.  I even seen an argument where the rest of the world needs to be more like the United States, because America is leading in innovation, and the rest of the world gets a free ride on its medical advances.



SlayerRondo said:
richardhutnik said:
papamudd said:
Since obama had been in office i pay more for less coverage...

Are you saying this, because it has still been going on, or it didn't happen before Obama got in office?

I believe healthcare costs have been rising for decades now (one example going back to 2002):

http://money.cnn.com/2011/05/11/news/economy/healthcare_costs_family/index.htm

It's unfair to lay the blame for increasing healthcare cost on Obama alone (though he deserves part of the blame) as the lack of competition within the medical industry due to government and insurance systems.

I can't remember the last time I actually looked into the cost of any medical appointments or prodedures I have had because I am provided with no incentive to do so. If i were to receive incentive to shop arround the medical industry would be forced to take notice and compete like any other industry.

What concerns me most is not medical cost from my insurance but the increase in medicar and medicade spending on part of the government leading to increasing budget deficit in turn increased government debt to GDP ratio that is, I believe over 100% at this point and possibly on track to reach the levels seen right after WW2.

For me, I wouldn't need medicaid if I could actually get a job that provided some health coverage.  I lost all health coverage when I landed a contract job, and the employer rolled out something that would costg over $200 a month that wouldn't even meet the minimum standards Mass. required.  And without medicaid, I would of never been able to get a procedure that enabled me to even me remotely employable.  A clinic i was in didn't pay for anastesia (I had said this above).  Because IBM is insistent on offshoring more and more, it is causing people to be without.  And in an area built on IBM as an employer, the jobs didn't show up.  I am plugging away at my end in may directions to try to change stuff.

There are issues involved here, that need to be addressed.  But it ends up being more of a political football than anything else.