By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Politics Discussion - The strategic brilliance of the Affordable Care Act

famousringo said:
thranx said:
famousringo said:
thranx said:
famousringo said:

When almost all economic growth in developed countries comes from the creation, managment and manipulation of information, cutting back on legal protections for information property rights is a hard sell.


IP laws are for Intelectual Property, not information.


I"m not sure what kind of hair you're trying to split here.

Your post just didnt make sense to me. I was trying to figure it out, and wasn't sure if you meant something else. It still doesnt make sense to me.


IP rights are legal protections put in place to secure the value of information, whether it's a copyrighted print article or a patented technology. With the livelihood of so many people depending on information retaining value, it's a hard political sell to make any move that might devalue information, such as decreasing patent terms.


I guess i just never thought of that kind of stuff as information in that way. Thanks for explaining it.



Around the Network

If it means the 30 odd million uninsured get some sort of healthcare then that's a start but the government needs to do more. Either do what South Korea did and have government issue a basic health insurance plan for everyone or do what the UK did and nationalise healthcare all together and create a sort of NHS but also allow some leeway for private companies to compete. At least, it don't matter if you are in poverty or unemployed, you will still get healthcare, that's the biggest flaw with health care in the United States. People's health is not something you should profit from, it's just wrong.

Most developed countries have some sort of safety net for healthcare, it's about the time the United States followed suit.



Xbox One, PS4 and Switch (+ Many Retro Consoles)

'When the people are being beaten with a stick, they are not much happier if it is called the people's stick'- Mikhail Bakunin

Prediction: Switch will sell better than Wii U Lifetime Sales by Jan 1st 2018

Unconstitutional in my eyes'.



NobleTeam360 said:
Unconstitutional in my eyes'.

So people must suffer unneccesarily from preventable illnesses, just because they are priced out of healthcare that taxes should be paying for anyway, just for what a 300 year old piece of paper says. Disgraceful! It's a wonder America is a developed economy, yet alone the richest country in the world with such backward health care measures. 

Affordable, accessible and good quality healthcare should be a right not a privilege



Xbox One, PS4 and Switch (+ Many Retro Consoles)

'When the people are being beaten with a stick, they are not much happier if it is called the people's stick'- Mikhail Bakunin

Prediction: Switch will sell better than Wii U Lifetime Sales by Jan 1st 2018

Torillian said:
It was really nice timing to find out about one of those preexisting conditions. Really glad that I don't have to worry about going broke from my medical expenses which are probably going to be with me for the rest of my life. Not a chance in hell I could afford a 500 dollar shot every 2 weeks.

@Spurge, My understanding is that rates increase dramatically if you smoke, and some companies are considering doing the same for obesity.

The thing about these costs is that you would actually pay what they charge you. The difference between what is charged and what people pay is incredibly different.



"We'll toss the dice however they fall,
And snuggle the girls be they short or tall,
Then follow young Mat whenever he calls,
To dance with Jak o' the Shadows."

Check out MyAnimeList and my Game Collection. Owner of the 5 millionth post.

Around the Network

i choose freedom over government screwing up yet another thing.

I refuse to comply, so lets go to jail! Not to mention the IRS will be enforcing this anal abortion of a law, and we know how "fair" they are. Brownshirts is all they are.

i support to repeal it!



 

outlawauron said:
Torillian said:
It was really nice timing to find out about one of those preexisting conditions. Really glad that I don't have to worry about going broke from my medical expenses which are probably going to be with me for the rest of my life. Not a chance in hell I could afford a 500 dollar shot every 2 weeks.

@Spurge, My understanding is that rates increase dramatically if you smoke, and some companies are considering doing the same for obesity.

The thing about these costs is that you would actually pay what they charge you. The difference between what is charged and what people pay is incredibly different.


Fair enough, I'm sure there's a mark-up because of insurance, but I don't think I'd be getting them for $2.50 each like I do on insurance if I got them at cost.  I don't know any monoclonal antibodies for research that are that cheap (and that's the only other circumstance in which I've ordered monoclonal antibodies) so I'd take a bet that they'd still cost me 100 bucks per shot even if I was getting the absolute fair price without insurance.

 

Thankfully the drug is still somewhat new so if I don't have insurance the company will actuallly give me the drug for cheap just so I don't become immune to it from not using it, but I presume that's not just out of the goodness of their hearts but in the hopes that I'll get on insurance soon and they can start charging what they were before.   



...

Torillian said:
outlawauron said:
Torillian said:
It was really nice timing to find out about one of those preexisting conditions. Really glad that I don't have to worry about going broke from my medical expenses which are probably going to be with me for the rest of my life. Not a chance in hell I could afford a 500 dollar shot every 2 weeks.

@Spurge, My understanding is that rates increase dramatically if you smoke, and some companies are considering doing the same for obesity.

The thing about these costs is that you would actually pay what they charge you. The difference between what is charged and what people pay is incredibly different.


Fair enough, I'm sure there's a mark-up because of insurance, but I don't think I'd be getting them for $2.50 each like I do on insurance if I got them at cost.  I don't know any monoclonal antibodies for research that are that cheap (and that's the only other circumstance in which I've ordered monoclonal antibodies) so I'd take a bet that they'd still cost me 100 bucks per shot even if I was getting the absolute fair price without insurance.

 

Thankfully the drug is still somewhat new so if I don't have insurance the company will actuallly give me the drug for cheap just so I don't become immune to it from not using it, but I presume that's not just out of the goodness of their hearts but in the hopes that I'll get on insurance soon and they can start charging what they were before.   

There's a markup because of insurance, but the big one is that the hospitals float the cost of people who can't pay or don't have insurance onto those that do. Those who don't have insurance still don't go to free clinics or treatment centers (that's the problem where i live, not sure about the US as a whole) and so it only drives the cost up for those who can pay. People are just crazy if they think hospitals and insurance companies are going to make less money. They will find a way to make it up.



"We'll toss the dice however they fall,
And snuggle the girls be they short or tall,
Then follow young Mat whenever he calls,
To dance with Jak o' the Shadows."

Check out MyAnimeList and my Game Collection. Owner of the 5 millionth post.

Augen said:
Kasz216 said:
Augen said:
Here is my question. Why does it all cost so much? I had a small injury that required 8 stitches. The total cost for 15 minutes to put them in and 10 minutes a week later to take them out came to...$3000! My insurance covered $1700 leaving me to pay $1300 for a random act despite last time went to the doctor was 6 years past.

I see people at the top of hospitals and people providing equipment making great money, often some of the wealthiest people in small towns. The margins on many aspects of visits (even things you do not use) are staggering. Health care has managed to avoid market pressure factors where every other industry took a hit in 2008/2009 health care prices steadily climbed. We are being held hostage because if you don't do business with establishments (that don't compete in any way) you can die.

We pay twice in the US to what comparable other industrialized nations do. Yet the care provided is roughly the same to them. Yet, it seems that the question over and over is "how to pay for this" rather than "why does this cost so much"?

If anyone had insight I'd be genuinely curious.

One issue is... while some hopstials make money.  (Mostly the Universary attached Hospitals)

 

Most actually lose money.  Healthcare costs are a really complicated pain in the ass to sort out, and i could go through everything again, but honestly... noone cares.  It never leads to any discussion.

 

Short answer though?   Insurance, Doctors and Hospitals aren't the probelm... and hardly make any money in regards to the overll price...  Really it's more the high cost and length of Medical School, medicine patents (Pharmesuticals espeically) and a rush for everything to be cutting edge forcing hospitals to get the best equipment everywhere because patients won't go "discount" when their lives or health are at stake and government isn't forcing all hosptials to NOT upgrade like most countries do.  (Waiting until a few changse down the line, when the cost to benefit ratio makes more sense for the government balance sheet.)

 

The best thing we could do for medical costs?  Dial back IP laws a bit.

 

Something NOONE in Washington wants to do.

Thank you for your response, I would be one of those "no ones" interested as I think to solve a problem you have to identify the nature and causes of the problem.

I feel similarily about the cost of tuitions at Universities.   Both of these aspects of our culture have witnessed massive increases in cost over past 30 years and seem like have to hit a breaking point over next 30 years if they continue on.


College University prices going up are pretty easy to identify... and just as hard to fix.

 

1) Just about anyone can get a college loan, to go to college.  Which generally as a society we deem important because we think everyone should have an equal access to education, and we don't want the poor not being able to get into school because they can't pay.

2)   The value of a college education has grown in the general public's eye from

A) College Education.  For smart people.

B) College education, for a lot of good jobs, but there are plenty of union and trade jobs for other people.

C) College Education... mostly needed for a good job, but lots of good trade jobs out there... also service industry middle management.

D) College Edcuation... at this point you practically need one to be hired at an arbys!

 

So basically EVERYONE feels like they have to go to college, even if they did shitty in school.  So everyone is willing to take out a huge loan to go to college, and the government is willing to provide loans to everyone... because they all want people to have equal access to education. 

 

Limited supply+over demand = ridiculious prices... and the fact that the demand says super high because the government will give anybody a loan means prices will keep skyrocketing until they hit a point of where it's near impossible to pay it back even if your a success story.

 

There is little that can be done to really address this.



Kasz216 said:
Augen said:

 

Thank you for your response, I would be one of those "no ones" interested as I think to solve a problem you have to identify the nature and causes of the problem.

I feel similarily about the cost of tuitions at Universities.   Both of these aspects of our culture have witnessed massive increases in cost over past 30 years and seem like have to hit a breaking point over next 30 years if they continue on.


College University prices going up are pretty easy to identify... and just as hard to fix.

 

1) Just about anyone can get a college loan, to go to college.  Which generally as a society we deem important because we think everyone should have an equal access to education, and we don't want the poor not being able to get into school because they can't pay.

2)   The value of a college education has grown in the general public's eye from

A) College Education.  For smart people.

B) College education, for a lot of good jobs, but there are plenty of union and trade jobs for other people.

C) College Education... mostly needed for a good job, but lots of good trade jobs out there... also service industry middle management.

D) College Edcuation... at this point you practically need one to be hired at an arbys!

 

So basically EVERYONE feels like they have to go to college, even if they did shitty in school.  So everyone is willing to take out a huge loan to go to college, and the government is willing to provide loans to everyone... because they all want people to have equal access to education. 

 

Limited supply+over demand = ridiculious prices... and the fact that the demand says super high because the government will give anybody a loan means prices will keep skyrocketing until they hit a point of where it's near impossible to pay it back even if your a success story.

 

There is little that can be done to really address this.

More targeting in high school of where exactly people want to go. More encouragement to get people who would be better for skilled trades into Vo-Tech schools.



Monster Hunter: pissing me off since 2010.