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Forums - General Discussion - What would be the consequences of Scottish independence?

S____M____C____C on 16 May 2011
RolStoppable said:

I don't know, maybe they would finally have their own national football team? After all, that's the most significant sign of independence.


They already do, unless you're joking.



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Pyro as Bill on 17 May 2011
pizzahut451 said:

If English recognized Kosovo as independent, they sure as hell must recognize Scotland as indepented. But i wouldnt be suprised if they try to pervent it, western politicians are the very definition of double standard and hypocracy


English? Lol.

Here's the main players in the UK government in 1999.

Tony Blair, PM, Scottish.

Gordon Brown, Chancellor of Exchequer (later PM), Scottish.

Robin Cook, Foreign Office, Scottish.

Irving, Lord Chancellor, Scottish.

George Robertson, Defence, Scottish.

Alistair Darling, Chief to Treasury, Scottish.



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Don't Play Stationary 4 ever. Switch!

trashleg on 17 May 2011
Pyro as Bill said:
trashleg said:
Pyro as Bill said:

It's not that I want Scotland out, I just want England to be alone again. Without Scotland and Wales skewing the votes and enacting legislation against Engllish children, England will be governed by the English.

Shame it won't happen and instead Scotland will get even more money that Wales or NI or god forbid England should get and in 20 years we'll have the same thing all over again. 

Had David Davis won the Conservative leadership, Scotland wouldn't be voting on English affairs anymore and eventually that would have led to either the Scottish Parliament or the UK Parliament disappearing.


That's how I feel too...

I DO think that Scotland and England need different governance. Sadly though, modern politics allows little leeway (can't please all the people all the time) which is why we have this devolved government. To do what's right for Scotland without enforcing those laws nation (Britain)-wide. If Salmond is promising a referendum, let him hold it. I've already said i'm not sure where I stand.

I don't think the UK parliament could ever "disappear", don't be ridiculous.
And you've just said
a) that Scotland shouldn't be involved in English voting and
b) that if they weren't involved one of the Parliaments would disappear. How does that work?

Also, bear in mind that Scotland's entire population is roughly equal to that of London.

(When I go to England for trips, I feel like I'm definitely away from home. The Union Jack is everywhere, it doesn't really feel like my flag, don't you think that's strange?) i definitely feel very un-British. Not on purpose though.

I'm not being ridiculous.

If the English and Scottish Parliaments (lets ignore Wales and NI) UNITE to form a UNITED Kingdom, then what happens when one of those partners goes back to it's old Parliament?

It's either an English Parliament plus a Scottish Parliament OR a UNITED (kingdom) Parliament.

Scotland has it's Parliament so now the Union is nearly broken. We just need England to get a Parliament and we're back to 1706. Unfortunately the Tories are THE Unionist party and they'll allow Scottish MPs to get away with voting on legislation that only affects England and Wales just to preserve the Union. Blocking them from doing so, like David Davis wanted, would at some point end either the UK parliament or the Scottish one.

Would you vote for staying in the UK if it meant the Scottish Parliament had to go? Do you agree that it's only fair for England to have a Parliament now that Scotland has one?


I think you misinterpret the purpose of the Scottish Government. The devolved powers are limited (law, policing, education, healthcare) and if anything reduce the pressure on the UK parliament because they no longer have to deal with it. It's a much better idea than straining one government.

I'm pretty content having the Scottish Government really, even if it needs to ultimately comply with UK Government say-so.

THe London Parliament IS the English one, really. Since it represents the English a lot better than it represents the Scottish. I do see your point, though.



Highwaystar101 said: trashleg said that if I didn't pay back the money she leant me, she would come round and break my legs... That's why people call her trashleg, because she trashes the legs of the people she loan sharks money to.
SamuelRSmith on 17 May 2011
trashleg said:
Pyro as Bill said:
trashleg said:
Pyro as Bill said:

It's not that I want Scotland out, I just want England to be alone again. Without Scotland and Wales skewing the votes and enacting legislation against Engllish children, England will be governed by the English.

Shame it won't happen and instead Scotland will get even more money that Wales or NI or god forbid England should get and in 20 years we'll have the same thing all over again.

Had David Davis won the Conservative leadership, Scotland wouldn't be voting on English affairs anymore and eventually that would have led to either the Scottish Parliament or the UK Parliament disappearing.


That's how I feel too...

I DO think that Scotland and England need different governance. Sadly though, modern politics allows little leeway (can't please all the people all the time) which is why we have this devolved government. To do what's right for Scotland without enforcing those laws nation (Britain)-wide. If Salmond is promising a referendum, let him hold it. I've already said i'm not sure where I stand.

I don't think the UK parliament could ever "disappear", don't be ridiculous.
And you've just said
a) that Scotland shouldn't be involved in English voting and
b) that if they weren't involved one of the Parliaments would disappear. How does that work?

Also, bear in mind that Scotland's entire population is roughly equal to that of London.

(When I go to England for trips, I feel like I'm definitely away from home. The Union Jack is everywhere, it doesn't really feel like my flag, don't you think that's strange?) i definitely feel very un-British. Not on purpose though.

I'm not being ridiculous.

If the English and Scottish Parliaments (lets ignore Wales and NI) UNITE to form a UNITED Kingdom, then what happens when one of those partners goes back to it's old Parliament?

It's either an English Parliament plus a Scottish Parliament OR a UNITED (kingdom) Parliament.

Scotland has it's Parliament so now the Union is nearly broken. We just need England to get a Parliament and we're back to 1706. Unfortunately the Tories are THE Unionist party and they'll allow Scottish MPs to get away with voting on legislation that only affects England and Wales just to preserve the Union. Blocking them from doing so, like David Davis wanted, would at some point end either the UK parliament or the Scottish one.

Would you vote for staying in the UK if it meant the Scottish Parliament had to go? Do you agree that it's only fair for England to have a Parliament now that Scotland has one?


I think you misinterpret the purpose of the Scottish Government. The devolved powers are limited (law, policing, education, healthcare) and if anything reduce the pressure on the UK parliament because they no longer have to deal with it. It's a much better idea than straining one government.

I'm pretty content having the Scottish Government really, even if it needs to ultimately comply with UK Government say-so.

THe London Parliament IS the English one, really. Since it represents the English a lot better than it represents the Scottish. I do see your point, though.


The problem is, we have Scottish MPs which vote on areas where Scotland already has devolved powers. This is particularly unfair as Scotland is far more Labour-prone than England, which means on party-line votes, Labour has an unfair advantage over the other parties.



trashleg on 17 May 2011
Pyro as Bill said:
pizzahut451 said:

If English recognized Kosovo as independent, they sure as hell must recognize Scotland as indepented. But i wouldnt be suprised if they try to pervent it, western politicians are the very definition of double standard and hypocracy


English? Lol.

Here's the main players in the UK government in 1999.

Tony Blair, PM, Scottish.

Gordon Brown, Chancellor of Exchequer (later PM), Scottish.

Robin Cook, Foreign Office, Scottish.

Irving, Lord Chancellor, Scottish.

George Robertson, Defence, Scottish.

Alistair Darling, Chief to Treasury, Scottish.


They may be Scottish but their interests are definitely in Britain. Gordon Brown was Scottish once, long, looong ago...



Highwaystar101 said: trashleg said that if I didn't pay back the money she leant me, she would come round and break my legs... That's why people call her trashleg, because she trashes the legs of the people she loan sharks money to.
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Pyro as Bill on 17 May 2011
trashleg said:

I think you misinterpret the purpose of the Scottish Government. The devolved powers are limited (law, policing, education, healthcare) and if anything reduce the pressure on the UK parliament because they no longer have to deal with it. It's a much better idea than straining one government.

I'm pretty content having the Scottish Government really, even if it needs to ultimately comply with UK Government say-so.

THe London Parliament IS the English one, really. Since it represents the English a lot better than it represents the Scottish. I do see your point, though.

Why does the UK/Britain need a Health, Education or Law minister?

They can't decide anything for Scotland/Wales/NI, only England.

This results in Scottish MPs not only voting on legislation that has no effect on them or their constituents but actually becoming Ministers for what are essentially English departments. They have absolutely no right to do so.

Had we had 'English Votes on English Law' (EVoEL), we'd be in the strange position where Gordon Brown as PM, wouldn't have been able to vote on many of his own policies. The Tories could block any of Labour's manifesto whilst passing everything they wanted to. The English First Minister would be more powerful than the UK PM. How long would that last?

EVoEL or an English Parliament will both lead to independence or a federal UK eventually.

http://toque.co.uk/english-parliament-opinion-polls



Nov 2016 - NES outsells PS1 (JP)

Don't Play Stationary 4 ever. Switch!

pizzahut451 on 17 May 2011
Kasz216 said:
pizzahut451 said:

If English recognized Kosovo as independent, they sure as hell must recognize Scotland as indepented. But i wouldnt be suprised if they try to pervent it, western politicians are the very definition of double standard and hypocracy

Uh....  I don't see how the two situations are comprable really.

When was the last time the English sent people into Scotland to murder scots?

Don't see David Cameron or Gordon Brown being tried at the hague for their crimes against Scots.

Hahahahaha, lol, you're funny. Do you listen to everything Faux news and Joe Bidden  tell you? Go educate yourself some more on Kosovo sitauation



Alby_da_Wolf on 17 May 2011

According to reliable researches, including those made by condom producers and essential for their business, without the help of Scotland average penis size in UK would decrease.   

And no, I didn't make it up.   



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Kasz216 on 17 May 2011
pizzahut451 said:
Kasz216 said:
pizzahut451 said:

If English recognized Kosovo as independent, they sure as hell must recognize Scotland as indepented. But i wouldnt be suprised if they try to pervent it, western politicians are the very definition of double standard and hypocracy

Uh....  I don't see how the two situations are comprable really.

When was the last time the English sent people into Scotland to murder scots?

Don't see David Cameron or Gordon Brown being tried at the hague for their crimes against Scots.

Hahahahaha, lol, you're funny. Do you listen to everything Faux news and Joe Bidden  tell you? Go educate yourself some more on Kosovo sitauation

So... you question the Hague then... and the entire international community more or less... outside of serbia.

I think your the one that needs to educate yourself some more.

I don't know how you "fake" hundreds of bodies found in mass graves.



ArcticGabe on 18 May 2011

war