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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Square Enix is lazier than Nintendo...

Old Rock on 19 January 2010
jarrod said:

Scenario/character is one of DQ's main selling points.

I agree. When I played DQVII (my first DQ), I was really surprised that there were a lot of things happening and it's not even halfway yet.

For me, playing DQ feels like I'm watching an anime/cartoon. It has that episodic feel to it. I've only played DQ IV and VII though, so I don't know if that's entirely true throughout the series 



 

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RageBot on 19 January 2010
jarrod said:
RageBot said:
jarrod said:
RageBot said:
jarrod said:
RageBot said:
Hisiru said:
RageBot said:
jarrod said:
RageBot said:
And Square ARE lazy, they don't make inspired games anymore, where are the days of Xenogears? Chrono Cross? Vagrant Story? The Great Final Fantasies? (6,7,9).

I'd take Dragon Quest over any of them.  Ew Xenogaers. :/

I do miss Matsuno though.  At least Kawazu's been (mostly) delivering still.

DQ is not my cup of tea, I prefer good plot, characters and soundtrack in my RPG, not gameplay (lol :P)

But DQ is more about a good plot, characters and soundtrack than gameplay. Actually, DQ always have a great plot.

I was comparing DQ to Xenogears, if you take the entire DQ franchise combind it will never come close to Xenogears' plot, characters and soundtrack.

lol.  Maybe in terms of convolution and cliche.

Better cliche and convoltuion over nothing amirite? :D

No, I think I'd honestly take nothing.   Dragon Quest became huge in Japan because of the characters and scenario though.  And rightly so.

Nope, they like the gameplay, DQ and FF got big before They had plots of any noteworthy caliber.

So... you've never actually completed a DQ game, have you?

Scenario/character is one of DQ's main selling points.  Hell, that's why Enix got Toriyama to do the designs.  DQ's stories tend to revolve more around universal themes too, more about humanity and spirit, less about angst and Neitzsche.  DQV has probably the best story in an RPG imo, and was lightyears ahead of it's time.  

I can say the same about you and Xenogears, since there is nothing cliche about Xenogears lol :)

If plots and characters were DQ's main selling points than they would've been considered JRPG classics in the west, like Chrono Trigger, Xenogears and Suikoden 2, pepole whould consider them great games today, and by a concensus, in any internet forum, they are not even talked about as "hidden gems" like terranigma.

 



Bet with Dr.A.Peter.Nintendo that Super Mario Galaxy 2 won't sell 15 million copies up to six months after it's release, the winner will get Avatar control for a week and signature control for a month.

jarrod on 19 January 2010
RageBot said:
jarrod said:
RageBot said:
jarrod said:
RageBot said:
jarrod said:
RageBot said:
Hisiru said:
RageBot said:
jarrod said:
RageBot said:
And Square ARE lazy, they don't make inspired games anymore, where are the days of Xenogears? Chrono Cross? Vagrant Story? The Great Final Fantasies? (6,7,9).

I'd take Dragon Quest over any of them.  Ew Xenogaers. :/

I do miss Matsuno though.  At least Kawazu's been (mostly) delivering still.

DQ is not my cup of tea, I prefer good plot, characters and soundtrack in my RPG, not gameplay (lol :P)

But DQ is more about a good plot, characters and soundtrack than gameplay. Actually, DQ always have a great plot.

I was comparing DQ to Xenogears, if you take the entire DQ franchise combind it will never come close to Xenogears' plot, characters and soundtrack.

lol.  Maybe in terms of convolution and cliche.

Better cliche and convoltuion over nothing amirite? :D

No, I think I'd honestly take nothing.   Dragon Quest became huge in Japan because of the characters and scenario though.  And rightly so.

Nope, they like the gameplay, DQ and FF got big before They had plots of any noteworthy caliber.

So... you've never actually completed a DQ game, have you?

Scenario/character is one of DQ's main selling points.  Hell, that's why Enix got Toriyama to do the designs.  DQ's stories tend to revolve more around universal themes too, more about humanity and spirit, less about angst and Neitzsche.  DQV has probably the best story in an RPG imo, and was lightyears ahead of it's time.  

I can say the same about you and Xenogears, since there is nothing cliche about Xenogears lol :)

If plots and characters were DQ's main selling points than they would've been considered JRPG classics in the west, like Chrono Trigger, Xenogears and Suikoden 2, pepole whould consider them great games today, and by a concensus, in any internet forum, they are not even talked about as "hidden gems" like terranigma.

 

Oh, I played and finished Xenogears years ago.  And fuck, it's story was like cliche piled on top of cliche (anmesiac, ancient god, split personality, reincarnation, aliens) each turn making less logical sense than the last... I mean one can only suspend disbelief so far.   Of course the awful translation probably didn't help matters.  Once was enough for me though, and I've also successfully steered clear of it's unholy pedo-bait offspring (Xenosaga).

If Chrono Trigger, Xenogears and Suikoden 2 had plots and characters as good as DQ, I guess they'd sell multiple millions in Japan too.  And wtf @ Terranigma?  You think Ark and the game's story is why it's considered a hidden gem?  Seriously?  Now I'm guessing you haven't played that game either?



RageBot on 19 January 2010

So basically you say that because they didn't sell in Japan they didn't have a good story, and that because DQ sells in Japan it had a good story, yet in no way, shape or form did you prove a reason for why do you think it is the story that sells the game in Japan, while I point to sales of earlier DQ and FF that had shitty stories and sold bucketloads :)

And about cliches - you can't have a story without ones because litereature exists for over 2500 years, you can't make a story where everything is new, Xenogears is known for combining a lot of different ideas, many of which are not cliche, to a massive complete package.

About Terranigma, again, I was talking about Western forums, not Japanese ones.

You really are good at arguments sometimes but you lost this one.

Now try finding a reason for proving that they sold based on stories other than the facts that:
A. You like the stories
B. The games sold a lot in Japan

While overcoming the point that:
C. The games still sold a lot in the earlier games which had shitty plots, while sales of the sereis increased on par with regular market growth.

go go go!



Bet with Dr.A.Peter.Nintendo that Super Mario Galaxy 2 won't sell 15 million copies up to six months after it's release, the winner will get Avatar control for a week and signature control for a month.

Hisiru on 19 January 2010
RageBot said:
jarrod said:
RageBot said:
Hisiru said:
RageBot said:
jarrod said:
RageBot said:
And Square ARE lazy, they don't make inspired games anymore, where are the days of Xenogears? Chrono Cross? Vagrant Story? The Great Final Fantasies? (6,7,9).

I'd take Dragon Quest over any of them.  Ew Xenogaers. :/

I do miss Matsuno though.  At least Kawazu's been (mostly) delivering still.

DQ is not my cup of tea, I prefer good plot, characters and soundtrack in my RPG, not gameplay (lol :P)

But DQ is more about a good plot, characters and soundtrack than gameplay. Actually, DQ always have a great plot.

I was comparing DQ to Xenogears, if you take the entire DQ franchise combind it will never come close to Xenogears' plot, characters and soundtrack.

lol.  Maybe in terms of convolution and cliche.

Better cliche and convoltuion over nothing amirite? :D

Nothing? Are you simply acting like a hater or did you really played a DQ game? I finished Xenogears and to tell you the truth I think that most of the DQ games has much more quality (storyline, characters, storytelling etc) than Xenogears.

-Edit-

Lol, now I wonder if you played Xenogears too because it really has a lot of cliches.

 

"If plots and characters were DQ's main selling points than they would've been considered JRPG classics in the west,"

Now the West will choose which game is good and which is not, huh? DQ is much more appealing to the japanese market and that's why it's not selling here, just like some western games doesn't sell there. Sorry, but it's a bad argument.



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RageBot on 19 January 2010
Hisiru said:
RageBot said:
jarrod said:
RageBot said:
Hisiru said:
RageBot said:
jarrod said:
RageBot said:
And Square ARE lazy, they don't make inspired games anymore, where are the days of Xenogears? Chrono Cross? Vagrant Story? The Great Final Fantasies? (6,7,9).

I'd take Dragon Quest over any of them.  Ew Xenogaers. :/

I do miss Matsuno though.  At least Kawazu's been (mostly) delivering still.

DQ is not my cup of tea, I prefer good plot, characters and soundtrack in my RPG, not gameplay (lol :P)

But DQ is more about a good plot, characters and soundtrack than gameplay. Actually, DQ always have a great plot.

I was comparing DQ to Xenogears, if you take the entire DQ franchise combind it will never come close to Xenogears' plot, characters and soundtrack.

lol.  Maybe in terms of convolution and cliche.

Better cliche and convoltuion over nothing amirite? :D

Nothing? Are you simply acting like a hater or did you really played a DQ game? I finished Xenogears and to tell you the truth I think that most of the DQ games has much more quality (storyline, characters, storytelling etc) than Xenogears.

-Edit-

Lol, now I wonder if you played Xenogears too because it really has a lot of cliches.

 

"If plots and characters were DQ's main selling points than they would've been considered JRPG classics in the west,"

Now the West will choose which game is good and which is not, huh? DQ is much more appealing to the japanese market and that's why it's not selling here, just like some western games doesn't sell there. Sorry, but it's a bad argument.

Read the rest of the thread.



Bet with Dr.A.Peter.Nintendo that Super Mario Galaxy 2 won't sell 15 million copies up to six months after it's release, the winner will get Avatar control for a week and signature control for a month.

Hisiru on 19 January 2010
RageBot said:
Now try finding a reason for proving that they sold based on stories other than the facts that:
A. You like the stories
B. The games sold a lot in Japan

While overcoming the point that:
C. The games still sold a lot in the earlier games which had shitty plots, while sales of the sereis increased on par with regular market growth.

go go go!

The storyline is one of the good points of the series since DQIV (even FF1, FF2 and FF3 has a weak storyline) and it's usually much more appealing to the japanese market, so it's probably one of the main reasons to make this game sell in Japan. With that said, do you have proof or argument to show us that it's not one of the main reasons?

Also, the storytelling in DQIV is one of the most known aspects in the entire series.



RageBot on 19 January 2010
Hisiru said:
RageBot said:
Now try finding a reason for proving that they sold based on stories other than the facts that:
A. You like the stories
B. The games sold a lot in Japan

While overcoming the point that:
C. The games still sold a lot in the earlier games which had shitty plots, while sales of the series increased on par with regular market growth.

go go go!

The storyline is one of the good points of the series since DQIV (even FF1, FF2 and FF3 has a weak storyline) and it's usually much more appealing to the japanese market, so it's probably one of the main reasons to make this game sell in Japan. With that said, do you have proof or argument to show us that it's not one of the main reasons?

Also, the storytelling in DQIV is one of the most known aspects in the entire series.

Also FF.



Bet with Dr.A.Peter.Nintendo that Super Mario Galaxy 2 won't sell 15 million copies up to six months after it's release, the winner will get Avatar control for a week and signature control for a month.

Hisiru on 19 January 2010
RageBot said:
Hisiru said:
RageBot said:
Now try finding a reason for proving that they sold based on stories other than the facts that:
A. You like the stories
B. The games sold a lot in Japan

While overcoming the point that:
C. The games still sold a lot in the earlier games which had shitty plots, while sales of the series increased on par with regular market growth.

go go go!

The storyline is one of the good points of the series since DQIV (even FF1, FF2 and FF3 has a weak storyline) and it's usually much more appealing to the japanese market, so it's probably one of the main reasons to make this game sell in Japan. With that said, do you have proof or argument to show us that it's not one of the main reasons?

Also, the storytelling in DQIV is one of the most known aspects in the entire series.

Also FF.

Obviously, FF and DQ were the main RPG series back in the days! If people wanted to play an RPG what would they buy? If the consumers doesn't have a better option, they will buy DQ and FF! Which doesn't mean that they could survive against games like Chrono Trigger but they survived because the other games are good.

And still, you doesn't have a good argument.



RageBot on 19 January 2010
Hisiru said:
RageBot said:
Hisiru said:
RageBot said:
Now try finding a reason for proving that they sold based on stories other than the facts that:
A. You like the stories
B. The games sold a lot in Japan

While overcoming the point that:
C. The games still sold a lot in the earlier games which had shitty plots, while sales of the series increased on par with regular market growth.

go go go!

The storyline is one of the good points of the series since DQIV (even FF1, FF2 and FF3 has a weak storyline) and it's usually much more appealing to the japanese market, so it's probably one of the main reasons to make this game sell in Japan. With that said, do you have proof or argument to show us that it's not one of the main reasons?

Also, the storytelling in DQIV is one of the most known aspects in the entire series.

Also FF.

Obviously, FF and DQ were the main RPG series back in the days! If people wanted to play an RPG what would they buy? If the consumers doesn't have a better option, they will buy DQ and FF! Which doesn't mean that they could survive against games like Chrono Trigger but they survived because the other games are good.

And still, you doesn't have a good argument.

At least I have one :)

Yours is still "they like the story just cause!".



Bet with Dr.A.Peter.Nintendo that Super Mario Galaxy 2 won't sell 15 million copies up to six months after it's release, the winner will get Avatar control for a week and signature control for a month.