Ahh - but don't make the mistake:

None of the titles are exclusive. Everything is coming out on DVD, and DVDs play on both BluRay & HD-DVD players.

You aren't restricting choice from consumers - you are just telling them they don't have the option of paying PREMIUM dollars for certain movies. To most consumers - they couldn't care less.

...

Its not until studios release EXCLUSIVE HD-DVD or BluRay movies that things get REAL interesting. But of course, they would have to be insane to do that now - as it would cost them 90% of their revenue (approx).

Even Sony doesn't have the balls to do this with Spiderman 3 - that would make things interesting. (of course their shareholders would kill them - but maybe an exclusivity period of a month might help?)

And the rest of his post makes pretty clear that he didn't really read what I was saying.

He insists on constructing absurd strawmen even after people have carefully explained their positions several times. It should be obvious to everyone that BluRay being 'necessary' doesn't entail games being nonexistent without BluRay, and I personally explained the definition of 'necessary' at work here no fewer than three times in this thread. I thought he was a bit dense or careless, but now it's clear he's trolling, so I think we're safe ignoring anything else.

Well done for what? Being outsold on a weekly basis? There is no flaw with Sony's business model. blu ray is winning at the moment, right? Studio support clearly favors blu ray (Disney, Sony Pictures, 20 Century Fox, and coming soon, Warner Bros.) Maybe you shoud tell these studios that there backing a "flawed" product.

Damned if I know - sorry :(

It was at least one, probably 2 or 3 months ago. In brief, I think the reasons were something like this (might have been related to a battery thread on the new PSP?):

 - better battery life

 - cheaper hardware manufacturing (no drive)

 - ability to create upgraded carts over time (incremental improvements?)

 - much lower seek time

 - requirement for less memory onboard (as each cart *is* memory)

 - faster transfer times of data + lower loading times

 - increased hardware reliability (less moving parts)

 - simpler development process (no background loading routines, etc...)

 - increased reliability of media/drives, better game response (no issue with drives/discs slowing down over time)

...I think this was the general gist of it. If someone can find it (the old thread), post a link please :) 

Oh come on. I'll assume you are being obtuse here.

As I wrote a while back - this isn't an election. Its not like whoever gets to 51% is declared the winner - and its all over.

Its a business - its about money. Last week HD-DVD had, what - 45% of the total HD sale base?

So Toshiba have 45% of the HD weekly market (and around 30% for the year) - and that is a failure?

They have managed to jump in, create a business - and take a significant chunk of the HD movie market share. They have also done the consumer a great service - create competition (something we should ALL be grateful for!) and force prices down.

(Do you consider the PS3 a failure for only having 17% of the next-gen console market? I think not)

This is simple, there will be no EXCLUSIVE HD DVD's. Reason, by the time exclusives are released for a HD player, blu ray will be left. HD DVD will be dead. When 2009 approaches, HD DVD will be dying, blu ray will have complete control over the HD market, and studio support will clearly be in Sony's favor.

Even with cheaper hardware, good software is needed to complement it. What software can push HD DVD to compete with blu ray? Nothing. For every lap in this race, even if its only 10 laps out of 100, blu rays lead increases little by little. And with the pit crew (Studio Support) clearly favoring blu ray, how can it lose. HD DVD will be left in the dust.

I never said that Toshiba would never make money off HD DVD, but to think that this competition will last years and years is unlikely. 30% as of now, but it will continue to drop as both PS3's and blu ray players are sold. 

The PS3 is not a failure, but a complete disappointment sales wise. Apparently more that half of the people on this website think its a failure. But remember, The PS3 has the major IP's that will support it in the future(MGS4, FFXIII, GT5) gaming wise, but can we say the same for HD DVD on the High def market?

I was under the impression Harry Potter, SHreck, and Lord of the rings were all coming to HDDVD. That seems like some software that can push HDDVD to compete. If I am wrong about these titles, let me know.

edit: bourne ultimatum and oceans13 too 

At least Shams has taken the time to actually read my thread's content, as have a coupld of others. At no point have I criticised the next-generation format Blu-Ray (though on a side note, Harvey Birdman is crazy if he thinks its winning a decisive victory anytime soon). What I have said is that including the Blu-Ray player in the PS3 was bad for the console.

This does not for a moment mean that it's inclusion was bad for Blu-Ray, just that it was bad for the console. So far all the player's inclusion has done is force up the price of the console and therefore massively reduce its sales. If anyone had told you the PS3 would have had under 6 million sales at this point BEFORE its price was announed, you would have called them crazy.

My fundamental point is that Blu-Ray has in no substantial way (other than relatively wealthy technophile purchases) assisted the PS3, but it has inhibited it. Also, if Blu-Ray does prevail over HD DVD, it will fall in price drastically, and very few casual consumers will purchase a PS3 as a Blu-Ray player. Better Blu-Ray players will come out, and even if they didn't, all early-adopting technophiles already have their PS3's.

ON the other hand, if Blu-Ray fails it will be catastrophic for the PS3. The player is incompatible with HD DVD, so all games that have already been printed could not be played if Sony switched formats. But if Sony did not switch formats the PS3 would simply be an overpriced console with no tangible benefits over its far cheaper rivals.

The one exception to this is the possibility that Sony could prove Blu-Ray has tangible and inescapable benefits for gaming, but to argue that they have proven this at this point is stupid. People will not pay hundreds of dollars extra to avoid switching disks every ten hours. The PS3's difficult hardware, limited RAM and small userbase are greatly diminishing the developers technical and financial resources, which would have been needed to produce longer games. Even Sony's first party games have so far been SHORTER than last generation. Sony claimed that Heavenly Sword had ten gigabytes of audio, but did it really matter when people like Rocketpig beat the game in 5hrs and 14min???

On top of this, the Blu-Ray player in the PS3 actually has a lower disc read speed than the 360's DVD player. Any claims that developers will now not bother with compression are ridiculous, as any smart developer does this to speed up resources, limit the load on their development servers, and reduce load times when the game is actually being played.

Finally, Leo-j made a snide comment about cd's changing the gaming industry's layout because they had more space but he is fundamentally incorrect. The reason most developers went with the PS1's Cd's rather than the N64's carts is because cd's were substantially cheaper......

DVDS=CHEAPER THAN BLU-RAY DISKS!!!!!