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Forums - PC Discussion - Contoller/Console better for FPS than KB+Mouse/PC?!?

nightsurge on 16 December 2009
Xoj said:
nightsurge said:
Xoj said:
PS3 have keyboard and mouse support.

even UT3 have it

Name 2 PS3 games that support Mouse and Keyboard...  UT3 and..... ?? That's what I thought.

@the guy that uses KB+M on 360.  You got ripped off.  The adapter only costs $75 on eBay.  I've considered doing it, but I can't stand the keyboard for movement.  Controller dominates in that respect.

even kz2 can use it =).

But you didn't answer my question.  That is with the use of an adapter or with third party hardware.  PS3 does not support plug and play keyboard and mouse for their games (except for maybe UT3?).  Your definition of "PS3 have keyboard and mouse support" is exactly the same as it would be on 360 because you can also buy adapters for that as well.

but of course it needs custom one for that.

those are cheap since ps3 support tons of USB and bluetooth periferals.

 


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Xoj on 16 December 2009
nightsurge said:
Xoj said:
nightsurge said:
Xoj said:
PS3 have keyboard and mouse support.

even UT3 have it

Name 2 PS3 games that support Mouse and Keyboard...  UT3 and..... ?? That's what I thought.

@the guy that uses KB+M on 360.  You got ripped off.  The adapter only costs $75 on eBay.  I've considered doing it, but I can't stand the keyboard for movement.  Controller dominates in that respect.

even kz2 can use it =).

But you didn't answer my question.  That is with the use of an adapter or with third party hardware.  PS3 does not support plug and play keyboard and mouse for their games (except for maybe UT3?).  Your definition of "PS3 have keyboard and mouse support" is exactly the same as it would be on 360 because you can also buy adapters for that as well.

but of course it needs custom one for that.

those are cheap since ps3 support tons of USB and bluetooth periferals.

 

IT does.

it's up for the developer to implement it or not.

the sku its there. the console have software support for it, the XMB can be controlled with keyboard and mouse by usb or bluetooth

it's not the same, because the ps3 can use ANY keyboard and mouse via bluetooth. software base it's there

i am talking in chinese?!!?



Kasz216 on 16 December 2009

The very few games that allowed crossplay between console and computer had to give console gamers features like autoaim to even make it fair.

So... yeah.


Assuming equally skilled players at their respective imput devices.... it goes

Controller



radiantshadow92 on 17 December 2009

i know pc/mouse is better than controller, but not in Killzone, killzone 2 is the only fps ive played that feels like it was made for a the controller on a console, besides that mouse is better



nightsurge on 17 December 2009
Xoj said:
nightsurge said:
Xoj said:
nightsurge said:
Xoj said:
PS3 have keyboard and mouse support.

even UT3 have it

Name 2 PS3 games that support Mouse and Keyboard...  UT3 and..... ?? That's what I thought.

@the guy that uses KB+M on 360.  You got ripped off.  The adapter only costs $75 on eBay.  I've considered doing it, but I can't stand the keyboard for movement.  Controller dominates in that respect.

even kz2 can use it =).

But you didn't answer my question.  That is with the use of an adapter or with third party hardware.  PS3 does not support plug and play keyboard and mouse for their games (except for maybe UT3?).  Your definition of "PS3 have keyboard and mouse support" is exactly the same as it would be on 360 because you can also buy adapters for that as well.

but of course it needs custom one for that.

those are cheap since ps3 support tons of USB and bluetooth periferals.

 

IT does.

it's up for the developer to implement it or not.

the sku its there. the console have software support for it, the XMB can be controlled with keyboard and mouse by usb or bluetooth

it's not the same, because the ps3 can use ANY keyboard and mouse via bluetooth. software base it's there

i am talking in chinese?!!?

Exactly.  The same situation on Xbox 360 or any console with USB ports.  The support is easily there, but they won't support it.  It's up to the developers.  The PS3 doesn't support keyboard and mouse for games, the developers of the game have to decide that, or you can use an adapter.

And I promise you the PS3 cannot use any keyboard and mouse.  Only USB keyboards and mice are guaranteed to work as far as I know. 



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CaseyDDR on 22 December 2009
Senlis said:
Mendicate Bias said:
vlad321 said:
Mendicate Bias said:

So you think the only thing that matters is shooting? Thats like saying the only thing that matters in racing is accelerating, your completely ignoring the other 99 percent of what differentiates skilled players from noobs. I'm not asking this with any animosity but have you ever been to a major FPS tournament?

http://www.mlgpro.com/video?play=294158

Can you look at that video and tell me console shooters take no skill or console pro's suck? Their making tens of thousands of dollars playing video games, if console shooters were so noobish any random person could show up with his buddies and win himself $20,000. That never happens though because the skill gap between pro's and your average player is massive.

Well shooting and learning how t not get shot, also timers on the power ups. That's about it. Which adds up to about acceleration, top speed, and handling in racers.

Also I have seen all the videos you have posted, and I will watch this one. I am willing to bet my left manpart that the one you just linked is somehting you either linked beforehand or somethign new, also displaying as a phlegmatic gameplay as all the other ones you linked.

 

Edit: As I said, unimpressively phlegmatic. I'll find a quick pro or semi-pro players in ut2004 to see difference.

Edit2: Here it is, too tired to look for anything in depth, first tournament kind of play:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_B-Sr2HF_wM

That's the actual speed, and honestly there is more strategy than just shooting, as you can see. It just takes a ridiculous amount of skill compared to what you showed me.

P.S. That video is normal, my clan used to play Turbo which is +33% speed.

I can watch that video and see that it takes skill and admit it takes skill. However I can also see that the video I linked to also has players with immense skill but you can't. You can not for whatever reason see that the skill sets required for a 4v4 game with different game mechanics is just as great as for your 1v1. Again like all our previous arguments this boils down to a matter of opinion and were not going to change each others views so I'm done.

I don't agree with Vlad on many things, except for this.  It is true that when everyone is playing using the same controls, it really doesn't matter since everyone is on a level playing field.  However, every time I am forced to play a game on a joystick, I think that it just be better on mouse + keyboard.  This is why:

Joysticks are based on an velocity type system.  In other words, the further you push the stick, the faster the screen moves.  To make a precise move, you have to accelerate the joystick until you have achieved sufficient velocity to reach the position in time (before you get shot) and then you have to release the joystick at just the right time to aim where you want to.  That is a lot to deal with in a heavy fire-fight.  How fast should you turn?  If you turn to fast, you won't aim where you want to.  If you aim too slow, you will get shot too much before your crosshairs meet the enemy.

Mouse and Keyboard is based on a positional type system.  You move the mouse, which corresponds directly to movement on the screen.  Simple, and more efficient use of your braincells.

Does simpler and easier mean more noobish? no.  It just means that you can get to intermediate and expert level faster using the mouse and keyboard. Can you think of any sport where a player makes it harder for himself just because it takes more skill to play that way?  No, you don't.  With the keyboard and mouse, I spend less time thinking about my turning and more time about position, cover, etc.

I think many people who claim the joystick is better are just console guys who either can't afford a gaming PC or don't want to work on them.  I won't fault them for that, but stop whining because of your choice.  Enjoy their other features like ease of use and....ease of use. 

THIS.



The Halo francise is the most overrated bland game to ever hit the console market. It provides a bad name to all FPS that even showed effort at creating an original entertaining plot.

I probably have more ps3 games than you :/ 

Gsquat on 02 January 2010
Reasonable said:
Yes it's better, but let's no go there. Love the "it's tougher with a controller 'cause it's harder to aim" argument. Hugely flawed, but very amusing. Why not wear gloves too? That would really increase the challenge.

I had to create an account just to comment on how awesome this post is. If consoles were plug and play for a mouse and keyboard setup, I'd sell my PC and game on my Xbox. Til then, it's PC... for FPS's anyway.



Mohasus on 02 January 2010

Mouse+keyboard for the win. especially for fast shooters like UT or Team Fortress 2.

I know this thread is about FPS, but while playing Gears of War on 360, I didn't think it would be that better with mouse+keyboard, cuz the game is kinda slow. Then I tried UT3 and it was really hard to aim, I just gave up and played on PC.



youarebadatgames on 02 January 2010
JaggedSac said:
KungKras said:
"At whoever challenged me on my race car analogy. The point I was making was that some sports do make it harder for their athletes to compete because if they make it too easy they reduce the skill gap. This is especially true of sports that requires its participants to use a man made machine like a car, boat, plane or controller."


Your analogy is only correct if you asume that KB+M is lowering the skill ceiling, wich it isn't. If you have seen videos of competitive PC players you should see how fast they can move the aim, yet have such fine-tuned movements. There is no equivalent at all of that skill in competitive console gaming period. The interface is in a whole different league, and so are the players, such skills would be useless with a DA interface, yet DA doesn't add any new skills that aren't required with KB+M.

Of course the speeds are going to be fast.  You are using a mouse.  It is easy to make fast and fine-tuned movements with a mouse.  That is like saying that anyone driving a Ferrari fast around a road course must have more skill than a rally care driver maneuvering around precarious courses at a slower speed.  They are a completely different skill set.  Does one mean more skilled than the other?  That is debatable.

Yes, it's easier to step down from a fast game to a slow game.  I'd be hard pressed to say anyone that played Q3/CPMA/UT had any trouble adjusting to CS, but the number of players going the other way successfully is lower.  This especially goes for any other "skills" like timing and map control.



vlad321 on 02 January 2010
youarebadatgames said:
JaggedSac said:
KungKras said:
"At whoever challenged me on my race car analogy. The point I was making was that some sports do make it harder for their athletes to compete because if they make it too easy they reduce the skill gap. This is especially true of sports that requires its participants to use a man made machine like a car, boat, plane or controller."


Your analogy is only correct if you asume that KB+M is lowering the skill ceiling, wich it isn't. If you have seen videos of competitive PC players you should see how fast they can move the aim, yet have such fine-tuned movements. There is no equivalent at all of that skill in competitive console gaming period. The interface is in a whole different league, and so are the players, such skills would be useless with a DA interface, yet DA doesn't add any new skills that aren't required with KB+M.

Of course the speeds are going to be fast.  You are using a mouse.  It is easy to make fast and fine-tuned movements with a mouse.  That is like saying that anyone driving a Ferrari fast around a road course must have more skill than a rally care driver maneuvering around precarious courses at a slower speed.  They are a completely different skill set.  Does one mean more skilled than the other?  That is debatable.

Yes, it's easier to step down from a fast game to a slow game.  I'd be hard pressed to say anyone that played Q3/CPMA/UT had any trouble adjusting to CS, but the number of players going the other way successfully is lower.  This especially goes for any other "skills" like timing and map control.

I fully agree. Especially people from Q3/UT who are use to hit scan weapons like the rail gun or the shock rifle absolutely dominate in CS with the AWP. Then you have a game like CoD where all the weapons are hit scan weps, with a fast rate of fire, and kill in 3 shots. I mean seriously? As someone said earlier, at least CS players knew heir place on the skill ladder back in the day and didn't try to spin and argue how CS took more skill than Quake and UT. This new generation, sadly, doesn't know enough.



Tag(thx fkusumot) - "Yet again I completely fail to see your point..."

HD vs Wii, PC vs HD: http://www.vgchartz.com/forum/thread.php?id=93374

Why Regenerating Health is a crap game mechanic: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=3986420

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