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Forums - Sales Discussion - Worldwide Hardware Numbers UP for week of Black Friday

CGI-Quality said:
Avinash_Tyagi said:
^If MS gets aggressive next year with price cuts, what does Sony really have left to combat? Do they really want to engage in a price war with MS which they can't really afford?

I don't think Sony needs to worry about a price war at this point, particularly considering how well they've just done while being $100 more expensive than the 360. They need to focus on games sales and profitability. Fortunatley, given their recent marketing trends, they are probably on the right track to do just that.


By the end of the next fiscal year perhaps, but that assumes they maintain sales and profit margins, if MS cuts aggressively, and regaisn the momentum, those projections likely go out the window

 

Predictions:Sales of Wii Fit will surpass the combined sales of the Grand Theft Auto franchiseLifetime sales of Wii will surpass the combined sales of the entire Playstation family of consoles by 12/31/2015 Wii hardware sales will surpass the total hardware sales of the PS2 by 12/31/2010 Wii will have 50% marketshare or more by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  It was a little over 48% only)Wii will surpass 45 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  Nintendo Financials showed it fell slightly short of 45 million shipped by end of 2008)Wii will surpass 80 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2009 (I was wrong!! Wii didn't even get to 70 Million)

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And on top of all that... it really doesnt matter since they will profit anyways.



Carl2291 said:
Avinash_Tyagi said:
^If MS gets aggressive next year with price cuts, what does Sony really have left to combat? Do they really want to engage in a price war with MS which they can't really afford?

MS are profiting. They wont be cutting the price in any hurry, and will likely leave the cut for when Natal launches.

Until that time, Sony have big momentum, despite being $100 more expensive.

And then again, who knows what Sony have in store for Q3/Q4 2010? We know MS have Natal, Halo, Fable.. Etc. We have no idea at all what Sony have planned.


Elite and Slim are same price. MS may be profiting, but that means they have more ability to price cut, MS is exactly the company you would expect to try and do something to put the squeeze on Sony.

 

Predictions:Sales of Wii Fit will surpass the combined sales of the Grand Theft Auto franchiseLifetime sales of Wii will surpass the combined sales of the entire Playstation family of consoles by 12/31/2015 Wii hardware sales will surpass the total hardware sales of the PS2 by 12/31/2010 Wii will have 50% marketshare or more by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  It was a little over 48% only)Wii will surpass 45 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  Nintendo Financials showed it fell slightly short of 45 million shipped by end of 2008)Wii will surpass 80 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2009 (I was wrong!! Wii didn't even get to 70 Million)

kowenicki said:
@palminio

Totally agree. ONLY Ninty have pshown textbook commerciality this gen.

Sony are the worst of the three. God know how much they have spent/lost this last few weeks. Advertising through the roof and selling a loss making concole in bumper bundles to get market share.

I dont blame them, they had no choice... but its hardly textbook commercial sense.

Well theres a much bigger picture which includes BD penetration, software sales of increased install base, PSN sales of increased install base, mindshare of consumers to continue seling more to spurn the aforementioned avenues, brand recognition and acknowledgement across many avenues tied to the Sony name.

Just because we come in weekly to discuss and melt down or have wet dreams over numbers doesnt mean actually business operate on a weekly basis in terms of success and failure.

Whether Sony has made the correct decisions we wont know until next march financially. Good thing this is a numbers site and a sales thread not a profit thread so it doesnt fucking matter anayways, eh?

 



CGI-Quality said:
NJ5 said:
CGI-Quality said:

The interesting thing is, did you have to bring up profit in the first place? Why did the issue have to be mentioned. It just seems like you're upset over the numbers, and the reception towards the numbers, which I don't understand at all. And the person you quoted isn't a one-sided, biased person. So again, your approach was uncalled for.

Actually profits and other business stuff were brought on the table as soon as someone said Sony did textbook moves. Most or all people in the thread have recognized that Sony's sales results are good, but that doesn't mean the process to get there was good, which is far from being a textbook case.

No one even mentioned profits before someone praised Sony for its strategy.

 

The person who said that though wasn't talking about profits at all. What Sony has just done was well executed, whether one wants to admit that or not. That's what he was getting at, it was understood, and shouldn't have had a big deal made out of it.

It's hard to talk about this though with people who have an admitted bias. Zucas doesn't have that, and his point was clear (and made sense), which is why I have defended it.


How was it well executed? They lost money, and they still came in well behind the Wii

 

Predictions:Sales of Wii Fit will surpass the combined sales of the Grand Theft Auto franchiseLifetime sales of Wii will surpass the combined sales of the entire Playstation family of consoles by 12/31/2015 Wii hardware sales will surpass the total hardware sales of the PS2 by 12/31/2010 Wii will have 50% marketshare or more by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  It was a little over 48% only)Wii will surpass 45 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  Nintendo Financials showed it fell slightly short of 45 million shipped by end of 2008)Wii will surpass 80 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2009 (I was wrong!! Wii didn't even get to 70 Million)

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CGI-Quality said:
NJ5 said:
CGI-Quality said:

The interesting thing is, did you have to bring up profit in the first place? Why did the issue have to be mentioned. It just seems like you're upset over the numbers, and the reception towards the numbers, which I don't understand at all. And the person you quoted isn't a one-sided, biased person. So again, your approach was uncalled for.

Actually profits and other business stuff were brought on the table as soon as someone said Sony did textbook moves. Most or all people in the thread have recognized that Sony's sales results are good, but that doesn't mean the process to get there was good, which is far from being a textbook case.

No one even mentioned profits before someone praised Sony for its strategy.

 

The person who said that though wasn't talking about profits at all. What Sony has just done was well executed, whether one wants to admit that or not. That's what he was getting at, it was understood, and shouldn't have had a big deal made out of it.

It's hard to talk about this though with people who have an admitted bias. Zucas doesn't have that, and his point was clear (and made sense), which is why I have defended it.

I just went back and realized I misread Zucas's post (actually I didn't reply directly to him, but to someone who mentioned the financial reports).

Having said that, I just realized that I don't agree with Zucas. He said it was an achievement of marketing and advertising, I happen to think that this sales success was not primarily due to those two things.

 



My Mario Kart Wii friend code: 2707-1866-0957

Avinash_Tyagi said:
letsdance said:
kowenicki said:
@palminio

Totally agree. ONLY Ninty have pshown textbook commerciality this gen.

Sony are the worst of the three. God know how much they have spent/lost this last few weeks. Advertising through the roof and selling a loss making concole in bumper bundles to get market share.

I dont blame them, they had no choice... but its hardly textbook commercial sense.


ol. sony will make a profit this quarter.

Not according to Sony

 

http://kotaku.com/5408318/sony-outlines-gaming-turnaround-sees-ps3-profitability-in-2011

 

Sony's gaming division should start seeing profitability by the tail end of their 2010 fiscal year through cost reduction and "operational efficiencies", Sony Chief Executive Howard Stringer told a gathering of press and analysts today. 

Let me tell you that a budget is much more complicated than green and red numbers, ie. there are write-offs from previous acquirements(production facilities, game studios, development kits, internal networks,..) spread over the time these aquirements are used in the production/development and often the companies with multiple products put all these write-offs on one product, though it in theory should have been differentiated.

Another thing is the income, in this case the Blu-Ray royalties, HD-TV sales and 3D push factors aren't included in the PS3 budget, but they are there and Sony is aware of the value.

The same goes with MS, they too can put these expenses on other products to make their let's say Zune seem less flop like.

Differentiating these things is as said too complex, thus comments like "selling a loss" (from a person who can't stand bad English :o) only becomes more ignorant the more one learn about how business is conducted.

Heck chances are that most PS3 have had different production costs due to different hardware suppliers(just look at 360 drives) and being made on different factories where the employees are paid different fluctuating salaries. EDIT: a bigger production might even mean a lower production price per unit.


In the end of the day, the best way to judge is to look at the company and it's nature, does it have a history of expanding(razor thin margins) and how is its support to the product?



CGI-Quality said:
letsdance said:
And on top of all that... it really doesnt matter since they will profit anyways.

Well of course they will, it's the most important thing for them at this point.


Not until 2013 as a company http://www.joystiq.com/2009/11/19/sony-pushes-profitability-goal-back-to-2013/

 

Predictions:Sales of Wii Fit will surpass the combined sales of the Grand Theft Auto franchiseLifetime sales of Wii will surpass the combined sales of the entire Playstation family of consoles by 12/31/2015 Wii hardware sales will surpass the total hardware sales of the PS2 by 12/31/2010 Wii will have 50% marketshare or more by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  It was a little over 48% only)Wii will surpass 45 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  Nintendo Financials showed it fell slightly short of 45 million shipped by end of 2008)Wii will surpass 80 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2009 (I was wrong!! Wii didn't even get to 70 Million)

CGI-Quality said:
NJ5 said:
CGI-Quality said:

The interesting thing is, did you have to bring up profit in the first place? Why did the issue have to be mentioned. It just seems like you're upset over the numbers, and the reception towards the numbers, which I don't understand at all. And the person you quoted isn't a one-sided, biased person. So again, your approach was uncalled for.

Actually profits and other business stuff were brought on the table as soon as someone said Sony did textbook moves. Most or all people in the thread have recognized that Sony's sales results are good, but that doesn't mean the process to get there was good, which is far from being a textbook case.

No one even mentioned profits before someone praised Sony for its strategy.

 

The person who said that though wasn't talking about profits at all. What Sony has just done was well executed, whether one wants to admit that or not. That's what he was getting at, it was understood, and shouldn't have had a big deal made out of it.

It's hard to talk about this though with people who have an admitted bias. Zucas doesn't have that, and his point was clear (and made sense), which is why I have defended it.

CGI, generaly I agree with you. But in this case, I think you're the one being bias. It's simple: it has been told that Sony made textbook moves, others should take notes. Another user just said he didn't agree, and explained why (and that's why profitability came to discussion). I believe it's a logical way of discussion, better than saying it wasn't a textbook move and not explaining why.

Am I seeing it the wrong way?



     

 

CGI-Quality said:
letsdance said:
And on top of all that... it really doesnt matter since they will profit anyways.

Well of course they will, it's the most important thing for them at this point.


I'd actually argue they'll profit more with their stragety then they would with the tyhings everyone else is suggesting. They made a very marginal profit last year this quarter but they are now losing a shit load less and selling gangbusters HW with having AC2 and MW2 with all the other SW they'll be selling from selling all those HW they are now with their stragety.