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Forums - General - Something that has been bothering me about the Fort Hood shooting coverage.

TheRealMafoo said:
Soleron said:
Someone who commits violence in the name of some religion isn't speaking for that religion.

But someone who does a kind act does?

No, they aren't either.

Everyone who acts in the name of religion is acting for themselves alone. They claim to be inspired by religious teaching (for good or bad) but it was them who made the decision by interpreting it using their own judgement.

And I was saying that religion's existence catalyses these irrational acts by its nature of demanding faith. So by perpetuating religion you are causing future people to do these violent acts.



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I may be completely misunderstanding you (I hope I am), but you want to declare war on Afghanistan because a guy shot some people at a military base?



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Kantor said:
I may be completely misunderstanding you (I hope I am), but you want to declare war on Afghanistan because a guy shot some people at a military base?

Yeah, that's pretty far from what he meant. Mafoo is saying that the media is covering this as a crime or an act of terrorism. The problem is that Hasan wasn't suffering from some kind of secondhand post-traumatic stress disorder as some have suggested, nor did he intend to change policy through an act of violence. He proselytized Islam to the soldiers he was supposed to be treating, defended suicide bombings, expressed his desire to cut the necks of non-Muslims, and made a host of other statements, in light of which it's pretty shocking he wasn't discharged from the military. Since Hasan espoused jihad and had been in contact with an al-Qaeda recruiter, there's a strong case to be made that the shootings should be seen as treason rather than the random act of some lone nut.



badgenome said:
Kantor said:
I may be completely misunderstanding you (I hope I am), but you want to declare war on Afghanistan because a guy shot some people at a military base?

Yeah, that's pretty far from what he meant. Mafoo is saying that the media is covering this as a crime or an act of terrorism. The problem is that Hasan wasn't suffering from some kind of secondhand post-traumatic stress disorder as some have suggested, nor did he intend to change policy through an act of violence. He proselytized Islam to the soldiers he was supposed to be treating, defended suicide bombings, expressed his desire to cut the necks of non-Muslims, and made a host of other statements, in light of which it's pretty shocking he wasn't discharged from the military. Since Hasan espoused jihad and had been in contact with an al-Qaeda recruiter, there's a strong case to be made that the shootings should be seen as treason rather than the random act of some lone nut.

Ah, good.

Either way, he should get the death penalty, I think.



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well i suppose but waht he did seemed very very cowardly ,just like i think all the suicicde bombbers are cowards...cant fight by conventional standards so they go the quickest way out while killing lots of innocent people anf going straight to "paradise"



"They will know heghan belongs to the helghast"

"England expects that everyman will do his duty"

"we shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender"

 

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NKAJ said:
well i suppose but waht he did seemed very very cowardly ,just like i think all the suicicde bombbers are cowards...cant fight by conventional standards so they go the quickest way out while killing lots of innocent people anf going straight to "paradise"

Suicide bombing is quite an effetive weapon. I turns a lump of explosives into a very intelligent guided bomb and is usually the best weapon available for many groups.

 

You can try to take on a AC-130 Specter Gunship with an AK-47 and some RPG-7s. You'd fail horribly and everyone will laugh at your stupidity.

 

On to the question of the topic: Similar to how the September 11th attacks were a crime and an act of terrorism so does this also count as an act of terrorism and not war. Al Qaeda nor Majr Hassan are soverign states.



burning_phoneix said:
NKAJ said:
well i suppose but waht he did seemed very very cowardly ,just like i think all the suicicde bombbers are cowards...cant fight by conventional standards so they go the quickest way out while killing lots of innocent people anf going straight to "paradise"

Suicide bombing is quite an effetive weapon. I turns a lump of explosives into a very intelligent guided bomb and is usually the best weapon available for many groups.

 

You can try to take on a AC-130 Specter Gunship with an AK-47 and some RPG-7s. You'd fail horribly and everyone will laugh at your stupidity.

 

On to the question of the topic: Similar to how the September 11th attacks were a crime and an act of terrorism so does this also count as an act of terrorism and not war. Al Qaeda nor Majr Hassan are soverign states.


yeah effective does not mean that is has to be legitimate,i understand if they cant fight in open-pitched battles but suicide bombers?



"They will know heghan belongs to the helghast"

"England expects that everyman will do his duty"

"we shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender"

 

Soleron said:
TheRealMafoo said:
Soleron said:
Someone who commits violence in the name of some religion isn't speaking for that religion.

But someone who does a kind act does?

No, they aren't either.

Everyone who acts in the name of religion is acting for themselves alone. They claim to be inspired by religious teaching (for good or bad) but it was them who made the decision by interpreting it using their own judgement.

And I was saying that religion's existence catalyses these irrational acts by its nature of demanding faith. So by perpetuating religion you are causing future people to do these violent acts.

No offense.  However, that's stupid.  People will find justifications to do what they want no matter what you use. 

Religion is no more responsible for such acts then videogames.



Kasz216 said:
Soleron said:

Everyone who acts in the name of religion is acting for themselves alone. They claim to be inspired by religious teaching (for good or bad) but it was them who made the decision by interpreting it using their own judgement.

And I was saying that religion's existence catalyses these irrational acts by its nature of demanding faith. So by perpetuating religion you are causing future people to do these violent acts.

No offense.  However, that's stupid.  People will find justifications to do what they want no matter what you use. 

Religion is no more responsible for such acts then videogames.

Kasz, however the story behind this horrible unfolds, it is undeniably clear that his religion played a role, whether it was a direct motivation or an assisting justification.

And no, religion isn't harmless. The acts of atrocities committed in Gods' names would exhaust the greatest list makers.



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stof said:
Kasz216 said:
Soleron said:

Everyone who acts in the name of religion is acting for themselves alone. They claim to be inspired by religious teaching (for good or bad) but it was them who made the decision by interpreting it using their own judgement.

And I was saying that religion's existence catalyses these irrational acts by its nature of demanding faith. So by perpetuating religion you are causing future people to do these violent acts.

No offense.  However, that's stupid.  People will find justifications to do what they want no matter what you use. 

Religion is no more responsible for such acts then videogames.

Kasz, however the story behind this horrible unfolds, it is undeniably clear that his religion played a role, whether it was a direct motivation or an assisting justification.

And no, religion isn't harmless. The acts of atrocities committed in Gods' names would exhaust the greatest list makers.

Just like the kids who kill because they kill in videogames?