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Forums - Sales - FFCC: The Crystal Bearers sells 26,000 copies on day 1.

kopstudent89 on 14 November 2009

hmm the one game i'm worried about is samurai warriors, it looks up till now that its gonna do abt 70-80 k first week, which is poor for it. FFCC didnt do well, thats a fact, expectations were much higher. Now next week we have taiko, lets wait and see



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outlawauron on 14 November 2009
jarrod said:
hanafuda said:
'3D Dot Game Heroes just came out, and showed us how a high quality niche game sells on PS3.  Not any better than Wii it turns out.The only real high budget Japanese 3rd party game we've seen on Wii was Monster Hunter 3 and it's outsold everything on the HD consoles so far.'.

Demon's Souls? VC?

Also, FF CC is a high budget JPN 3rd party Wii game.

Demon's Souls isn't 3rd party.  Valkyria Chronicles isn't really niche either (decent budget, big promotion, Sakura Taisen successor).

FFCC is pretty high budget, but it has a host of issues working against and probably would've flopped just as hard regardless of console.

No matter how much promotion a game receives, it's doesn't change what kind of game it is.

Valkyria Chronicles, even in your twisted world where it actually had advertising, will always be a niche game due to game itself.



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hanafuda on 14 November 2009

'No matter how much promotion a game receives, it's doesn't change what kind of game it is.Valkyria Chronicles, even in your twisted world where it actually had advertising, will always be a niche game due to game itself.'.

Precisely.



PSN - hanafuda

Boneitis on 14 November 2009

@ patjuan32
Hah, internet tough guy. Anyhow, I didn't say HD consumers were more prone to buying niche games. I said they're more prone to buying fun games. Fracture sucked and Silent Hill sucked (popularity of Silent Hill is greatly exaggerated). The Darkness was fantastic and it sold considerably better than Homecoming and Fracture. It sold about 700K combined. Sales were modest but a sequel is apparently in the works.

Like I said, Monster Hunter is mega popular franchise in Japan. The Wii has also sold far more than the HD consoles combined in Japan. One game doing amazing in Japan doesn't mean other developers want to take the risk of putting big budget games on the Wii. All I can say is 3rd party developers tend to get better sales on HD consoles world wide. Not always, but more often.

Doesn't matter if the the PS2 was a year early and nothing would have changed if it was a year late. The Playstation brand appealed to the masses due to the success of the PS1. Dreamcast was a year early, had a some very strong titles, yet it was smashed by the PS2 in no time. Sony killed the Playstation brand this gen due to crazy pricing.

Edit: Also, if you consider games like Silent Hill, Fracture, and Darkness niche titles. Aren't games like Left 4 Dead, Borderlands, Bioshock, and many popular XBLA games niche as well? Where do we draw the line on niche?



Boneitis on 14 November 2009
Soriku said:
Boneitis said:

@ patjuan32
Hah, internet tough guy. Anyhow, I didn't say HD consumers were more prone to buying niche games. I said they're more prone to buying fun games. Fracture sucked and Silent Hill sucked (popularity of Silent Hill is greatly exaggerated). The Darkness was fantastic and it sold considerably better than Homecoming and Fracture. It sold about 700K combined. Sales were modest but a sequel is apparently in the works.

Like I said, Monster Hunter is mega popular franchise in Japan. The Wii has also sold far more than the HD consoles combined in Japan. One game doing amazing in Japan doesn't mean other developers want to take the risk of putting big budget games on the Wii. All I can say is 3rd party developers tend to get better sales on HD consoles world wide. Not always, but more often.

Doesn't matter if the the PS2 was a year early and nothing would have changed if it was a year late. The Playstation brand appealed to the masses due to the success of the PS1. Dreamcast was a year early, had a some very strong titles, yet it was smashed by the PS2 in no time. Sony killed the Playstation brand this gen due to crazy pricing.

Edit: Also, if you consider games like Silent Hill, Fracture, and Darkness niche titles. Aren't games like Left 4 Dead, Borderlands, Bioshock, and many other popular XBLA games niche as well? Where do we draw the line on niche?


This doesn't make sense. Wouldn't the success of MH3 prove to third parties that big third party games with big marketing = big sales? All at a lower dev cost too. Many big budget games are already established IPs anyway. This goes for JP third parties though, the HD consoles are more Western SW oriented. But many of those Western third parties tend to mostly make shooters. Epic Mickey for Wii is a big budget Western third party game though, and will no doubt get big marketing.

WW, some third parties get better sales on the HD consoles because those games are either better quality or marketed. At the same time, there's exceptions for the Wii too. Not to mention that due to lower dev costs the bar for success is lower, meaning they can profit more easily.

In my opinion, no. MH3 is a success because for some reason it really appeals to the Japanese audience. Big marketing does not always equate to big sales. The game still has to appeal to consumers. Disagree if you want, but that's how I feel.

Western 3rd parties have had much success with shooters. But frankly almost every genre tends to do better on HD consoles in the West.

You boast about developers being able to profit off low quality and low budget Wii games. Unfortunately, that's why the Wii library has a ton of shovelware. That reduces sales of quality games and deturs developers from bringing great games to the Wii.



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Boneitis on 14 November 2009
Soriku said:
Boneitis said:
Soriku said:
Boneitis said:

@ patjuan32
Hah, internet tough guy. Anyhow, I didn't say HD consumers were more prone to buying niche games. I said they're more prone to buying fun games. Fracture sucked and Silent Hill sucked (popularity of Silent Hill is greatly exaggerated). The Darkness was fantastic and it sold considerably better than Homecoming and Fracture. It sold about 700K combined. Sales were modest but a sequel is apparently in the works.

Like I said, Monster Hunter is mega popular franchise in Japan. The Wii has also sold far more than the HD consoles combined in Japan. One game doing amazing in Japan doesn't mean other developers want to take the risk of putting big budget games on the Wii. All I can say is 3rd party developers tend to get better sales on HD consoles world wide. Not always, but more often.

Doesn't matter if the the PS2 was a year early and nothing would have changed if it was a year late. The Playstation brand appealed to the masses due to the success of the PS1. Dreamcast was a year early, had a some very strong titles, yet it was smashed by the PS2 in no time. Sony killed the Playstation brand this gen due to crazy pricing.

Edit: Also, if you consider games like Silent Hill, Fracture, and Darkness niche titles. Aren't games like Left 4 Dead, Borderlands, Bioshock, and many other popular XBLA games niche as well? Where do we draw the line on niche?


This doesn't make sense. Wouldn't the success of MH3 prove to third parties that big third party games with big marketing = big sales? All at a lower dev cost too. Many big budget games are already established IPs anyway. This goes for JP third parties though, the HD consoles are more Western SW oriented. But many of those Western third parties tend to mostly make shooters. Epic Mickey for Wii is a big budget Western third party game though, and will no doubt get big marketing.

WW, some third parties get better sales on the HD consoles because those games are either better quality or marketed. At the same time, there's exceptions for the Wii too. Not to mention that due to lower dev costs the bar for success is lower, meaning they can profit more easily.

In my opinion, no. MH3 is a success because for some reason it really appeals to the Japanese audience. Big marketing does not always equate to big sales. The game still has to appeal to consumers. Disagree if you want, but that's how I feel.

Western 3rd parties have had much success with shooters. But frankly almost every genre tends to do better on HD consoles in the West.

You boast about developers being able to profit off low quality and low budget Wii games. Unfortunately, that's why the Wii library has a ton of shovelware. That reduces sales of quality games and deturs developers from bringing great games to the Wii.


In the case of big budget JP games on the Wii, they all appeal to Japanese people which means they would sell well on the Wii. In the case of Western games, Epic Mickey on the Wii makes sense because the Wii has a bigger Disney fanbase than the PS3/360. Likewise, the HD consoles have a bigger shooter fanbase.

You're only getting the perception that HD consoles sell games better in the West because, like I said, most of those games are high quality and/or are marketed while not all Wii games are. Regardless, the Wii sells the most total SW in all regions than the HD consoles individually if you look at the charts.

Lower dev costs have made an excuse for third parties to make shovelware, yes, but if you notice a TON of shovelware on the Wii has flopped. Even Ubisoft said their Imagine games don't sell well on the Wii. On the other hand, the Wii's third party situation is getting bigger with more decent/big budget games like Epic Mickey, DQ X, Red Steel 2, Tales of Graces, Arc Rise Fantasia, Fragile, etc.

The HD consoles have a big shooter fanbase. But they also have a big Sports fanbase, WRPG fanbase, Racing fanbase, etc. To only point out shooters as being a success in the West ignores the great sales of other genres.

In regards to the Wii selling the most software. Most of that comes from first party and bundled games. Much of the 3rd party sales come from shovelware and the bargain bin. The Wii bargain bin is typically huge and the titles are priced at about $10 or $15. The HD bargain bin is hardly a bargain and small most of the time. With that said the huge software sales on the Wii aren't the kind of sales that encourage the development of quality games.

You listed a couple of Wii games that are pretty decent quality. But in my opinion it seems like quality is dwindling from 3rd parties. 2009 hasn't been outstanding for the Wii, and 2010 isn't looking much better.



Boneitis on 14 November 2009
Soriku said:

Sports fanbase? Wii Sports or Tiger Woods should say different. WRPG? None on Wii. Racing? MK Wii is the biggest racer of all time.

Most of Wii's sales come from Nintendo or bundled games? Is that why there's been more third party million sellers than Nintendo?

2009 is pretty crappy, but if you think 2010 sucks then you're just batshit insane and this argument isn't even worth my time if you're so blind.

Well you further prove my point first party and bundled games make up the vast majority of Wii software sales. I didn't realize Wii has better golf sales. But Tiger Woods doesn't change the fact that pretty much every other 3rd party sports game does better on HD consoles.

I was just adding up the number of all Nintendo published games on the Wii software sales. The number I have is about 186 million is 1st party and about 167 million is 3rd party (not a perfect system I have). That means well over half of the software for the Wii from 1st party and bundled. I'm excluding Mario & Sonic titles and Nintendo games continue sell in droves. Its just a matter of time before 1st party sales account for 75% of Wii software sales.

I guess I'm batshit insane because I'm not impressed. But hey, its just my feeling. No need to try and change it.



Boneitis on 14 November 2009

@ Soriku

So that's your feelings on Madden. Wanna debate every other sports game?

Your graph doesn't mention how many millions the first party games sell. I gave you proof 1st party makes up most of the software sales. That will continue to happen and grow.



Boneitis on 14 November 2009
Soriku said:
I don't feel like doing this now, but if you add the sales number of Nintendo/Nintendo EAD developed games on the Wii, it's only like ~1/3 of total Wii SW sales.

I don't understand. Are you excluding bundling?



hanafuda on 14 November 2009

Soriku

Is FF CC still on your list of 200K guaranteed big hitters for Japan?



PSN - hanafuda