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Forums - Nintendo - What if Nintendo never launched the Wii?...(article).

The thing you guys are ignoring is that the author admitted that the market would still grow with a Gamecube 2, just not to the extent that it has. I agree that the market would've grown regardless, but definitely not to the same extent that it has.

You don't see geezers and middle-aged women playing Playstation 3 and Xbox 360, and they didn't play much PS2, Xbox, or Gamecube either. Although I personally don't see them as true market growth (there is no guarantee they'll keep buying games and future consoles), they are customers that the industry wouldn't have otherwise received.



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First of all, the original XBox sold 24 million consoles, compared to 22 million for the Gamecube, so I'm not sure how the Gamecube was only "slightly competitive" with the XBox. PS2 maybe, but the GC and XBox were neck and neck.

Second of all, I don't think an HD Zelda would have had people any more excited than Twilight Princess. It would have been a fantastic game, but upping the resolution doesn't really make it any better.

As for the conclusion, he's basically saying the same thing Miyamoto said - that if Nintendo had attempted to go for the same market as the PS360, the competition might have killed one of them. I suppose it would not have been awful if Nintendo was relegated to software only, but I, for one, am happy that such a fantastic game company is succeeding.



sorc,
He does mention it, but my original idea is slightly different because of the subtlety in tone.

His statement of it still growing is only a footnote within the total idea that the market would have seen a lot less expansion. His idea is geared towards the industry not being in as good a shape without the wii.

My thought is geared more towards the idea that the industry would be fine without the wii.
The tone is different. From my standpoint, it would be a good reason to say, "the wii wasn't necessary", whereas from the OP's standpoint it is a good lead-in to saying, "the wii is necessary".



theprof00 said:
you guys are defining things the way you would like them to be defined in order to prove your point.

Puffy, you're talking about sales, and darius, you're saying the same thing.
The industry is based on revenue, not on profits.
It is based on how much people spend, how much is tied up in the industry. Sure there would be less sales, but the market would be bigger.
You do have a very good point, both of you, but my statement is 100% accurate. You're looking at the idea tangentially.

This contradicts itself. The size of the market is based on how many customers their are. That's why people always talk about Nintebdo "expanding the market," they're drawing in more customers. How can the market be bigger if thier are less customers?



"Pier was a chef, a gifted and respected chef who made millions selling his dishes to the residents of New York City and Boston, he even had a famous jingle playing in those cities that everyone knew by heart. He also had a restaurant in Los Angeles, but not expecting LA to have such a massive population he only used his name on that restaurant and left it to his least capable and cheapest chefs. While his New York restaurant sold kobe beef for $100 and his Boston restaurant sold lobster for $50, his LA restaurant sold cheap hotdogs for $30. Initially these hot dogs sold fairly well because residents of los angeles were starving for good food and hoped that the famous name would denote a high quality, but most were disappointed with what they ate. Seeing the success of his cheap hot dogs in LA, Pier thought "why bother giving Los Angeles quality meats when I can oversell them on cheap hotdogs forever, and since I don't care about the product anyways, why bother advertising them? So Pier continued to only sell cheap hotdogs in LA and was surprised to see that they no longer sold. Pier's conclusion? Residents of Los Angeles don't like food."

"The so-called "hardcore" gamer is a marketing brainwashed, innovation shunting, self-righteous idiot who pays videogame makers far too much money than what is delivered."

Sorcery said:
The thing you guys are ignoring is that the author admitted that the market would still grow with a Gamecube 2, just not to the extent that it has. I agree that the market would've grown regardless, but definitely not to the same extent that it has.

You don't see geezers and middle-aged women playing Playstation 3 and Xbox 360, and they didn't play much PS2, Xbox, or Gamecube either. Although I personally don't see them as true market growth (there is no guarantee they'll keep buying games and future consoles), they are customers that the industry wouldn't have otherwise received.

I think we can count on geezers and middle-aged women more than many "hardcore" gamers, who say they'll "find another hobby" if motion control takes over console gaming (which appears to be happening).

Fact is, there is no guarantee anyone will keep buying certain products. It's like how most World of Warcraft fans will not settle for the other competing MMO's, and stick with WoW exclusively - that doesn't mean it hasn't grown the MMO market.



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Let's just see, then. If Nintendo had literally made another GameCube, with similar sell-through timing. GameCube, at this point from launch, was at ~16 million, which is itself about 38 million less than Wii, and would put total to-date sales for this generation at 63 million. Of course, this would not be the case, as we could assume that of those 38-million nonbuyers, if we decide that half of Wii's non-matching-Gamecube audience is expanded audience, we could add another 19 million in who bought either a 360 or PS3, putting this generation to date at 82 million

 

Still well behind what actually happened, but is it behind last generation? 17 million Xbox, 16 million GC, and 66 million PS2, so 89 million.

 

So i guess it still would have shrunk, but it's still rather wooly math.



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griffinA said:
theprof00 said:
you guys are defining things the way you would like them to be defined in order to prove your point.

Puffy, you're talking about sales, and darius, you're saying the same thing.
The industry is based on revenue, not on profits.
It is based on how much people spend, how much is tied up in the industry. Sure there would be less sales, but the market would be bigger.
You do have a very good point, both of you, but my statement is 100% accurate. You're looking at the idea tangentially.

This contradicts itself. The size of the market is based on how many customers their are. That's why people always talk about Nintebdo "expanding the market," they're drawing in more customers. How can the market be bigger if thier are less customers?

This is a dispute over what defines "The Market." You could make an argument that it should be number of customers, but since business is all about the money, almost all talk of how big a market is refers to how much revenue it generates.

I don't think that there's a business out there that wouldn't dump a third of its customer base if it meant they could double the revenue from their remaining customers.



"The worst part about these reviews is they are [subjective]--and their scores often depend on how drunk you got the media at a Street Fighter event."  — Mona Hamilton, Capcom Senior VP of Marketing
*Image indefinitely borrowed from BrainBoxLtd without his consent.

@griffin
because if there are 10 people buying a 600$ product vs 60 people buying a 100$ product, the market is the same. That market with the higher number of people has expanded the demographic, but not the revenue.

The problem with the argument that everyone is bringing up with me is that while all of these things are very closely related, they are not all the same thing. They are slightly different interpretations. Mine is not wrong simply because your interpretation is different, you just have a slightly different viewpoint.

Like looking at a ball with a color gradient on it, where I stand, the ball looks blue-green, wheras where you are standing, the ball look green-blue. Niether of us are wrong, but it's folly to start saying that only one view can be right.



@mrkahn
very true, and good analysis. However, the revenue would have been grossly higher.



All I'm saying is having more revenue doesn't necessarily mean having more customers. Many people who bought the Wii wouldn't have jumped into this gen at all, I'm one of them.



Bet between Slimbeast and Arius Dion about Wii sales 2009:


If the Wii sells less than 20 million in 2009 (as defined by VGC sales between week ending 3d Jan 2009 to week ending 4th Jan 2010) Slimebeast wins and get to control Arius Dion's sig for 1 month.

If the Wii sells more than 20 million in 2009 (as defined above) Arius Dion wins and gets to control Slimebeast's sig for 1 month.