angrypoolman said:
highwaystar101 said:
So the proof you need to support macro evolution has to be one that can be observed within our lifetime? You can't say that to discredit evolution, fossil records are accurate enough to prove evolution. The observations can be seen repeatedly and the fossil records are strong.
How about macro evolution that has been observed within human history, with well documented records? Is that acceptable? Look up the evolution of the dog, humans domesticated wolves around 14,000 years ago. For years the wolves* hadn't evolved at a particularly fast rate because they were well adapted to their environment. But all of a sudden there was a major shift in their environment and evolution occurred extremely rapidly. From those few species of wolf that were domesticated 14,000 years ago we now have countless breeds of dog, because of the amount of different environments domestication brought. This has been recorded over the course of human history.
Ask yourself, does a chihuahua and a great dane look and act exactly the same? Because we have sufficient evidence to prove that they both evolved from a common ancestor in the space of only a few thousand years.
Source
* When I say wolves I mean an ancestor of the wolf.
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i dont get it, what is so great about the fossil record? all you know about any fossil is that it is something that died a long time ago. we dont know if it had any kids and we dont know what kind of conditions these fossils underwent before we discover them. also, correct me if im wrong, but dont humity and moisture make it hard to radiometrically date these things accurately?
i dont have a problem with a wolf and a cayote and a modern day dog having a common ancestor, im sure it was some dog like creature. also, you dont know the relationship there was between those wolves and humans. you can say they were domesticated all you want, but at the end of the day, all you can do is guess with some bones you found in the dirt.
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The fossil record is one of the most accurate ways we have of measuring the transition of species. If you think that all fossils are radiometric dated you are wrong. Many of the fossils are dated by the geological environment they were found in which is a very accurate way of determining the period of existence.
Look, fossils are had to argue against, we have found repeatedly and with good stead the same story over an over again, life evolves. Have we ever found a dinosaur and a human in the same place dated at the same time? No. the reason is that humans and dinosaurs existed in completely separate time periods and we find them in different geological areas that we can place a date on. We don't find humans and dinosaurs buried next to each other because they existed hundreds of millions of years apart. Therefore geological dating is accurate.
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As for the dog argument I don't think you understood it at all. Domestication of the dog has been recorded 14,000 years back, by people, not fossils. We know at this point dogs were an early ancestor of the wolf. Breeds of dog such as terriers, poodles, great danes, chihuahuas and so on didn't exist. They only came about since the domestication of the dog brought on rapid evolution as it had to adapt to new environments that was influenced by humans.
For example I have two Shar-Peis, they were used thousands of years ago as fighting dogs and as such every aspect of them is incredibly well suited for fighting because they were handpicked by the Chinese for fighting ability, those that couldn't fight were killed and those that won fights got to reproduce. The result was that over many generations it became the dog it is today, and since the fighting had stopped it has evolved again to suit it's new surroundings.
The story can be seen in almost anything, domestication brought along rapid evolution. Examples include the Horse, Pig, sheep, cows. Anything that is reared by humans really. The dog is just a good argument because it evolved to a distinct diversity. Again show me that a great dane and a poodle look exactly the same, because we have evidence that they were the same species within the timescale of human civilisation.
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