nightsurge I think simply they WERE desperate, PS3 sales weren't great, the had pressure from 3rd parties & the press earlier in the year was counting PS3 out.

This was their chance.....they took

if they had done this say next year, who knows? the 360 lead could have been at 10 million by then.

nen-suer said: I think it was perfect timing But maybe there will be a slimmer PS3 design down the line

The current Slim PS3 still has a fan right?  Sony's slim line usually doesnt consist of a fan making it even smaller, so im sure a slimmer PS3 without a fan could quite possibly happen =)

V-r0cK said: nen-suer said: I think it was perfect timing But maybe there will be a slimmer PS3 design down the line The current Slim PS3 still has a fan right?  Sony's slim line usually doesnt consist of a fan making it even smaller, so im sure a slimmer PS3 without a fan could quite possibly happen =)

But is that even possible to cool advanced chips like the RSX and Cell or any modern computer/console chip without a fan somewhere moving air?

Your forgetting the estimated cost of Natal dude.

Kotaku is throwing out numbers starting at 150$. PSmote will certainly be cheaper, even if its just for one.

$150 for Natal versus what, exactly?  If a "PSmote" is similar in pricing to a Wiimote which it should be, that's $40 each.  So you have PS Eye = $40 + 2 wands = $120 just for 2 people.  Then if you want all 4, its $200 minimum.

We have no idea what Natal or the wands will cost, but in the end I think they'll be about the same price to get the equal experience with Natal maybe a bit cheaper (up to 4 players local).

nightsurge said: V-r0cK said: nen-suer said: I think it was perfect timing But maybe there will be a slimmer PS3 design down the line The current Slim PS3 still has a fan right?  Sony's slim line usually doesnt consist of a fan making it even smaller, so im sure a slimmer PS3 without a fan could quite possibly happen =) But is that even possible to cool advanced chips like the RSX and Cell or any modern computer/console chip without a fan somewhere moving air?

lol who knows XD... i'd love to properly answer this question but im not that techy enough to know the cooling requirement differences between like the PS2's chip and the PS3. 

If somebody could answer nightsurge's question that would be much appreciated =)

I'm suspecting this is why Microsoft has been awfully quiet regarding what they intend to do to go back in the weekly sales lead. I highly doubt that Sony would be able to afford to drop the PS3 cheaper than 299$, whereas Microsoft "might" be willing to reduce the Arcade unit to 169.99, in which case there would be mayhem and pandemonium (not the game, unfortunately). If they timed it right, i.e. right before the holidays, it might spur on a massive increase in sales that would help them regain the original lead. It also depends on what kind of bundles/ what they have to entice the European/American population.

As of right now though, they can't be happy with what's been going on in Japan. While I'm sure 1.15 million ( I think that was the last sales number) is a vast improvement over the original xbox, it's still a paltry sum compared to what the PS3 has been raking in over there.

That's a good point on the costs, but I think out of the box the wand thing will cost less than Natal, with the tech and R&D costs for Natal being significantly higher than the Wand as far as I can tell. Also MS definately has a huge 1up on the marketing side so it'll be interesting to see how it pans out.

I still very much doubt MS doing a hardware revision, they just don't seem to be able to design stable hardware, but with the success Sony's had I suppose its a possibility. As long as they don't screw up on design again and cool it properly as opposed to lazy and passive cooling. Seriously, I think half the PC gamer's on this site could have designed a more stable console.

Ultimately, both Slim designs were meant to expand the userbase from the core to mainstream gamers, but under different circumstances.

When they originally launched, the PS2 and PS3 had the appearance of "bad add tech"; the sleek design, the metallic case, and all the hype making them out to be the latest and greatest, gave the PS2 and PS3 a very "unconsole" like appearance. While this made the "computer entertainment system" more approachable to the hardcore, there are many for whom "bad ass tech" is actually a turn off, namely the more mainstream/casual gamers. Making a Slim version of the consoles, making them smaller and using plastic instead of metal, changes the appearance from "bad ass" to "toy", and makes it more approachable to the non-hardcore. Meanwhile, the hardcore don't care that much, it's the games that really define the console, the hardcore games were already there, and they already have their "bad ass" version; so who cares if a more "toyetic" version appears.

The real difference is the circumstances surrounding the Slim upgrades. When the PS2 Slim came out, the original had the hardcore/core market locked up, so the only place for growth was into the mainstream/casual space. When the PS3 Slim appeared, the old PS3 was in tough competition with the Xbox 360, giving them little room to maneuver in the hardcore space, and the Wii leapfrogged them right both in the race to the masses, so Sony had to give chase before Nintendo had them on lock down.

I would say the slim model came 3 years too late.

Sony doesn't have much choices but to drop the price and drop the cost of the console in order to stay competetive. The sooner the better for them.
Of course, a redesign doesn't end cost cutting and while a new redesign is not likely to come out, the cost will still be cut several times before this gen ends.

The previous redesigns have also been made in need, not maybe in similar need as the PS3, but at least to boost the sales and fix hardware issues.

Yes it's eventually possible to cool it without a fan, although we likely don't see the fan getting dropped out, due to the need for very expensive heatsink and i don't think it's yet possible to do with the tech today anyway.