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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Malstrom: Microsoft has lost control of the NATAL hype

The Ghost of RubangB on 16 June 2009

People don't know how to copy Nintendo's success. They're thinking "Nintendo's winning due to motion controls! We can make motion controls BIGGER AND BETTER!!!" If anything Nintendo just proved that the BIGGER AND BETTER approach to the industry is a waste of time and money and also doesn't even work. People should be thinking "Nintendo's winning due to revolutionizing the way we play games, think about games, interact with games, and making games more accessible, and doing things that are the exact opposite of everybody else." When somebody else does that and exactly that, they could beat Nintendo.

But I think it's too soon for another gaming revolution. I think the market's still a bit shook up from the Wii and it took developers a few years to change their business philosophies accordingly. I don't think the market can be revolutionized several times within a single generation. Wii is the revolution. Motion+ is the defense against copycats. There will be no game changers until the next battle.


@everybody saying "Too long to read, but blah blah blah" you're wrong. It's not that long of an article. Either read it or don't post. It's not a wall of Natal-bashing. It's about the media, the hype, the rumors, the marketing, the attacks and counterattacks, the paid trolls in forums, and the changes in business philosophy going on everywhere right now. Yeah he's a little over-the-top in his writing style, but I agree with his argument.



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ClaudeLv250 on 16 June 2009

Malstrom is an obnoxious douche but I have to admit that he is (usually) spot on. I never gave thought to Microsoft's massive push for such an unfinished product. E3 was supposed to be hands on time with Natal, not Late Night with Jimmy Fallon. He was also right about the Natal Defense Force, I haven't been paying much attention to their fandribble but I did catch a "it's just like the Wii!" defense.



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Strategyking92 on 17 June 2009

lost control of hype? Isn't that what they wanted? what a idiot.
First it's

"microsoft and it's niche hardcore userbase will be it's downfall by not embracing the CaZuAls."
Now it's
"Microsoft hyping new tech that regular people are excited about will be it's downfall"

Laughable.



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disolitude on 17 June 2009
Avinash_Tyagi said:
disolitude said:
Has this guy ever written a non-nintendo fanboy article?
In his eyes it looks like Nintendo = disruption.

Well guess what, Sega genesis = disruption towards then Nintendo empire in gearing the games to a more mature audience
Sony playstation = disruption for tecnology advancements and selling hardware at a loss.

Malstrom should really get off his Nintendo high horse...
Yes Nintendo is number 1 thanks to their disruption, but there was time when nintendo was being disrupted.

Actually he's very respectful to sega, but he notes that Sony playstation was not a disruption

I cant see how one wouldn't consider PS1 a disruption. The aspect of "make money on software, not hardware" sony introduced put atleast 5 other companies out of the hardware business (Sega, 3DO, Atari, SNK, Phillips CDI).

In any case, since Malstrom is always writing about nintendo, Id love to see him write an interesting article about how nintendo is using their best R&D teams to think of ways to expand the casual ocean...while having much smaller teams work on games for the hardcore. 

We all know its true...why else would we be getting an outsourced Metroid game, a DS port of a Super Mario bros game and Mario Gallaxy 2...which Miyamoto himself said is mostly composed of ideas that didn't make it in to part 1.



The Ghost of RubangB on 17 June 2009

Sony's "make money on software not hardware" philosophy has gotten out of control and almost killed Sony and Microsoft's game divisions as well.

The PS1 did what the SNES did, but was bigger and better. The only new interesting things the PS1 did were "fill whole CD's with FMVs" and "treat 3rd parties better than Nintendo does, and they will give you more support."



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stof on 17 June 2009
Legend11 said:


As for Steven Spielberg I want to ask you, do you think it would have been better for Microsoft to have gone with Will Wright or Richard Garriot instead?  Do you think it would have gotten as many headlines or had as much weight with the mass casual audience and non-gamers?  Do you think that when Oprah was showing Wii Fit that her credibility with the gaming industry mattered?

As for what the Wii Fit crowd is going to buy, how do you know what they're going to buy in the future?  Seriously unless you show me some kind of poll or whatever that backs you up I'm going to say you're just pulling that out of your ass.  From my perspective and I'm not stating this as fact but as an observation, the fitness industry is so big because people tend to continue buying new products every year.  I've yet to see someone buy an Ab Roller for instance and then never buy another piece of fitness equipment again.

Isn't that kind of the point about this article though, Legend? That Microsoft went for headlines but didn't really provide any actual substance for the story that one would expect to find right underneath that headline? Microsoft says "Hey, look at this amazing piece of technology we've got, even Steven Spielberg likes it" and then gives us no evidence at all that the thing will actually be useful as a gaming device. If you're going to show off a piece of equipment that has no known release date or retail software (either working or planned) and is probably even a work in progress, you really do need to prove that it has a point if you want anyone to get excited for it. This article suggests that they really aren't at the point where they should be bringing out Spielberg, they're at the point where they should probably bring out a game designer who can say "This is how we can actually use the thing!" Because so far, the most impressive part of their unvealing wasn't the camera itself, but how those two people were able to make that funky Elephant shape. And we don't need a camera for that, we can do that with a lightbulb and a sheet.



I'm a mod, come to me if there's mod'n to do. 

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Serves me right for challenging his sales predictions!

Bet with dsisister44: Red Steel 2 will sell 1 million within it's first 365 days of sales.

marktheshark275 on 17 June 2009
disolitude said:
Avinash_Tyagi said:
disolitude said:
Has this guy ever written a non-nintendo fanboy article?
In his eyes it looks like Nintendo = disruption.

Well guess what, Sega genesis = disruption towards then Nintendo empire in gearing the games to a more mature audience
Sony playstation = disruption for tecnology advancements and selling hardware at a loss.

Malstrom should really get off his Nintendo high horse...
Yes Nintendo is number 1 thanks to their disruption, but there was time when nintendo was being disrupted.

Actually he's very respectful to sega, but he notes that Sony playstation was not a disruption

I cant see how one wouldn't consider PS1 a disruption. The aspect of "make money on software, not hardware" sony introduced put atleast 5 other companies out of the hardware business (Sega, 3DO, Atari, SNK, Phillips CDI).


Actually, SNK was still in the hardware business even after the PSX had no more games coming out for it, Neo Geo lasted until 2004 by the way. Honestly, I don't think the Neo Geo was a competitor to the PSX, if they are, there wouldn't be any ports of Neo Geo games coming to PSX.

The PSX also didn't put Sega out of the hardware business, that was actually PS2 which did that.

Everything else I agree with though. 

 

 



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Avinash_Tyagi on 17 June 2009
disolitude said:
Avinash_Tyagi said:
disolitude said:
Has this guy ever written a non-nintendo fanboy article?
In his eyes it looks like Nintendo = disruption.

Well guess what, Sega genesis = disruption towards then Nintendo empire in gearing the games to a more mature audience
Sony playstation = disruption for tecnology advancements and selling hardware at a loss.

Malstrom should really get off his Nintendo high horse...
Yes Nintendo is number 1 thanks to their disruption, but there was time when nintendo was being disrupted.

Actually he's very respectful to sega, but he notes that Sony playstation was not a disruption

I cant see how one wouldn't consider PS1 a disruption. The aspect of "make money on software, not hardware" sony introduced put atleast 5 other companies out of the hardware business (Sega, 3DO, Atari, SNK, Phillips CDI).

In any case, since Malstrom is always writing about nintendo, Id love to see him write an interesting article about how nintendo is using their best R&D teams to think of ways to expand the casual ocean...while having much smaller teams work on games for the hardcore.

We all know its true...why else would we be getting an outsourced Metroid game, a DS port of a Super Mario bros game and Mario Gallaxy 2...which Miyamoto himself said is mostly composed of ideas that didn't make it in to part 1.


As we've seen this gen, the lose money on hardware idea doesn't work, as Sony is heavily reeling and Nintendo is prospering



 

Predictions:Sales of Wii Fit will surpass the combined sales of the Grand Theft Auto franchiseLifetime sales of Wii will surpass the combined sales of the entire Playstation family of consoles by 12/31/2015 Wii hardware sales will surpass the total hardware sales of the PS2 by 12/31/2010 Wii will have 50% marketshare or more by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  It was a little over 48% only)Wii will surpass 45 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  Nintendo Financials showed it fell slightly short of 45 million shipped by end of 2008)Wii will surpass 80 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2009 (I was wrong!! Wii didn't even get to 70 Million)

Torillian on 17 June 2009
Avinash_Tyagi said:
disolitude said:
Avinash_Tyagi said:
disolitude said:
Has this guy ever written a non-nintendo fanboy article?
In his eyes it looks like Nintendo = disruption.

Well guess what, Sega genesis = disruption towards then Nintendo empire in gearing the games to a more mature audience
Sony playstation = disruption for tecnology advancements and selling hardware at a loss.

Malstrom should really get off his Nintendo high horse...
Yes Nintendo is number 1 thanks to their disruption, but there was time when nintendo was being disrupted.

Actually he's very respectful to sega, but he notes that Sony playstation was not a disruption

I cant see how one wouldn't consider PS1 a disruption. The aspect of "make money on software, not hardware" sony introduced put atleast 5 other companies out of the hardware business (Sega, 3DO, Atari, SNK, Phillips CDI).

In any case, since Malstrom is always writing about nintendo, Id love to see him write an interesting article about how nintendo is using their best R&D teams to think of ways to expand the casual ocean...while having much smaller teams work on games for the hardcore.

We all know its true...why else would we be getting an outsourced Metroid game, a DS port of a Super Mario bros game and Mario Gallaxy 2...which Miyamoto himself said is mostly composed of ideas that didn't make it in to part 1.


As we've seen this gen, the lose money on hardware idea doesn't work, as Sony is heavily reeling and Nintendo is prospering

Oh come on, as much as you might like to reject it the PS1 and PS2 still did happen.   Are you going to tell me that selling at a loss had nothing to do with them winning, and do you think Nintendo's Motion control will allow them to win indefinitely?



...

Avinash_Tyagi on 17 June 2009
Torillian said:
Avinash_Tyagi said:
disolitude said:
Avinash_Tyagi said:
disolitude said:
Has this guy ever written a non-nintendo fanboy article?
In his eyes it looks like Nintendo = disruption.

Well guess what, Sega genesis = disruption towards then Nintendo empire in gearing the games to a more mature audience
Sony playstation = disruption for tecnology advancements and selling hardware at a loss.

Malstrom should really get off his Nintendo high horse...
Yes Nintendo is number 1 thanks to their disruption, but there was time when nintendo was being disrupted.

Actually he's very respectful to sega, but he notes that Sony playstation was not a disruption

I cant see how one wouldn't consider PS1 a disruption. The aspect of "make money on software, not hardware" sony introduced put atleast 5 other companies out of the hardware business (Sega, 3DO, Atari, SNK, Phillips CDI).

In any case, since Malstrom is always writing about nintendo, Id love to see him write an interesting article about how nintendo is using their best R&D teams to think of ways to expand the casual ocean...while having much smaller teams work on games for the hardcore.

We all know its true...why else would we be getting an outsourced Metroid game, a DS port of a Super Mario bros game and Mario Gallaxy 2...which Miyamoto himself said is mostly composed of ideas that didn't make it in to part 1.


As we've seen this gen, the lose money on hardware idea doesn't work, as Sony is heavily reeling and Nintendo is prospering

Oh come on, as much as you might like to reject it the PS1 and PS2 still did happen.   Are you going to tell me that selling at a loss had nothing to do with them winning, and do you think Nintendo's Motion control will allow them to win indefinitely?

Yeah it really didn't what benefitted them was first mover status, and third parties ditching Nintendo and their competitors doing more of the same.

Yes it'll help them win this gen without a doubt, they'll continue to dominate, then Nintendo will leave behind this red ocean of motion controls for a new blue ocean, the problem with the SNES-Gen PS1/N64 and PS2/Xbox/GCN gens were that companies were battling over the same red ocean, there were no disruptions.

Nintendo abandoned the red ocean this gen and sailed into the blue ocean and disrupted the market, they'll just keep moving into blue oceans, letting MS and Sony try to play catchup while losing tons of cash



 

Predictions:Sales of Wii Fit will surpass the combined sales of the Grand Theft Auto franchiseLifetime sales of Wii will surpass the combined sales of the entire Playstation family of consoles by 12/31/2015 Wii hardware sales will surpass the total hardware sales of the PS2 by 12/31/2010 Wii will have 50% marketshare or more by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  It was a little over 48% only)Wii will surpass 45 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  Nintendo Financials showed it fell slightly short of 45 million shipped by end of 2008)Wii will surpass 80 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2009 (I was wrong!! Wii didn't even get to 70 Million)