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Forums - Sales - Why the PS3 will not last long, let alone 10 years.

Who are you exactly? What degree to you hold  to make assertions about things you know to be true? You must be some first or second year college student studying statistics and market trends, but I think your classes have failed you bud.

This generation of consoles very closely resembles the 16-bit era. Looking at trends (examining only the two HD consoles against the SNES and the Gensis) the Genesis had the most steam and was steadily gaining in hardware sales due to popularity and their excellent software library at the time. The SNES was very far behind at this point and it wasn't until the halfway point of that generation that SNES really gained headway. If I remember correctly Donkey Kong Country was proclaimed as the systems savior and turning point. The point is the SNES was steadily making headway as the Gensis declined and eventually edged out the Genesis in sales. Need I mention there was a recession during the early period of this generation as well?

The PS3 is showing the same trend and there are many similarities. In the begining of the 16-bit war, the power of the SNES wasn't really necessary as in this era the PS3 is in the same boat. The Genesis was selling at a lower price point and had the edge in the games people wanted to play. As the SNES's power was exploited it became necessary, because possibilities opened up that were simply not available on the Genesis. The same is happening with the PS3...primarily with games that are showing off incredible physics...GOW III is a great example. Opportunities for new game idea's and grander schemes are a going to take over this market which is flooded with casual games and hardcore FPS'. The same paralell could be drawn between the flood of side scroller action games on the Gensis and SNES which gave way to the RPG toward the end of the SNES' life and continued to saturate the market on the PS1.

The prediction to follow is that the PS3 will not sell anywhere near as much as the PS1 or PS2, will probably sell around 70 million units and edge out the 360 ever so slightly. If you look at trends between the consoles week over week for the last several months, the gap between the two consoles are steadily closing. Here recently that gap has only been a little over 10k units.

Sony will not be able to take over the Nintendo's right to throne this generation, that much is known and there is few that will dispute that claim with the way the numbers looks right now. Nintendo will get third party support and has, the problem are most of those exclusives were total garbage. I don't expect a great deal of those exclusives to be too great in the future either, save for 1st party Nintendo games which have been their bread and butter since the N64.

The argument that FF should be used as a bench mark for Sony consoles sales has some validity to it. That game will sell millions and will drive up sales of the PS3 in Japan at least. It will probably generate a good deal in America while doing little for MS becuase trends are starting to show the market is pretty well saturated by the 360. Also consider, by and large, that most JRPG players are Sony loyal and are eagerly awaiting to see this game. If you want to place money on a Sony system savior, then I would say that GOW III is most likely to be the system Donkey Kong Country.

I won't sit here and arrogantly assert that I am right about all of this, there are many holes in my arguments and while there are a lot of similarties (as I have drawn) there are also many differences. SNES games always looked consistently better than there Genesis counterparts, this time around many PS3 ports of 360 games look terrible in comparison up until the last year or so. That is one of many.

I do however completely disagree with your analysis that Sony will abruptly die and I think you need to look at your numbers again. Sony might not be number one, but it isn't going anywhere either.

 



-- Nothing is nicer than seeing your PS3 on an HDTV through an HDMI cable for the first time.

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^^PS3 will sell 70 million units?



Bet between Slimbeast and Arius Dion about Wii sales 2009:


If the Wii sells less than 20 million in 2009 (as defined by VGC sales between week ending 3d Jan 2009 to week ending 4th Jan 2010) Slimebeast wins and get to control Arius Dion's sig for 1 month.

If the Wii sells more than 20 million in 2009 (as defined above) Arius Dion wins and gets to control Slimebeast's sig for 1 month.

kaneada said:

Who are you exactly? What degree to you hold  to make assertions about things you know to be true? You must be some first or second year college student studying statistics and market trends, but I think your classes have failed you bud.

This generation of consoles very closely resembles the 16-bit era. Looking at trends (examining only the two HD consoles against the SNES and the Gensis) the Genesis had the most steam and was steadily gaining in hardware sales due to popularity and their excellent software library at the time. The SNES was very far behind at this point and it wasn't until the halfway point of that generation that SNES really gained headway. If I remember correctly Donkey Kong Country was proclaimed as the systems savior and turning point. The point is the SNES was steadily making headway as the Gensis declined and eventually edged out the Genesis in sales. Need I mention there was a recession during the early period of this generation as well?

The PS3 is showing the same trend and there are many similarities. In the begining of the 16-bit war, the power of the SNES wasn't really necessary as in this era the PS3 is in the same boat. The Genesis was selling at a lower price point and had the edge in the games people wanted to play. As the SNES's power was exploited it became necessary, because possibilities opened up that were simply not available on the Genesis. The same is happening with the PS3...primarily with games that are showing off incredible physics...GOW III is a great example. Opportunities for new game idea's and grander schemes are a going to take over this market which is flooded with casual games and hardcore FPS'. The same paralell could be drawn between the flood of side scroller action games on the Gensis and SNES which gave way to the RPG toward the end of the SNES' life and continued to saturate the market on the PS1.

The prediction to follow is that the PS3 will not sell anywhere near as much as the PS1 or PS2, will probably sell around 70 million units and edge out the 360 ever so slightly. If you look at trends between the consoles week over week for the last several months, the gap between the two consoles are steadily closing. Here recently that gap has only been a little over 10k units.

Sony will not be able to take over the Nintendo's right to throne this generation, that much is known and there is few that will dispute that claim with the way the numbers looks right now. Nintendo will get third party support and has, the problem are most of those exclusives were total garbage. I don't expect a great deal of those exclusives to be too great in the future either, save for 1st party Nintendo games which have been their bread and butter since the N64.

The argument that FF should be used as a bench mark for Sony consoles sales has some validity to it. That game will sell millions and will drive up sales of the PS3 in Japan at least. It will probably generate a good deal in America while doing little for MS becuase trends are starting to show the market is pretty well saturated by the 360. Also consider, by and large, that most JRPG players are Sony loyal and are eagerly awaiting to see this game. If you want to place money on a Sony system savior, then I would say that GOW III is most likely to be the system Donkey Kong Country.

I won't sit here and arrogantly assert that I am right about all of this, there are many holes in my arguments and while there are a lot of similarties (as I have drawn) there are also many differences. SNES games always looked consistently better than there Genesis counterparts, this time around many PS3 ports of 360 games look terrible in comparison up until the last year or so. That is one of many.

I do however completely disagree with your analysis that Sony will abruptly die and I think you need to look at your numbers again. Sony might not be number one, but it isn't going anywhere either.

 

Welcome to VGChartz, kaneada! (I'm not about to get into this arguement.  Just wanted to welcome you here!)



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Arius Dion said:
^^PS3 will sell 70 million units?


I've lowered it to 50 to 70, but I still think it will pass the 360 for second place by the time all three next gen systems release.



txrattlesnake said:
Arius Dion said:
^^PS3 will sell 70 million units?


I've lowered it to 50 to 70, but I still think it will pass the 360 for second place by the time all three next gen systems release.

Well then the PS3 better get a move on. -100k a week ww aint gonna cut it.



Bet between Slimbeast and Arius Dion about Wii sales 2009:


If the Wii sells less than 20 million in 2009 (as defined by VGC sales between week ending 3d Jan 2009 to week ending 4th Jan 2010) Slimebeast wins and get to control Arius Dion's sig for 1 month.

If the Wii sells more than 20 million in 2009 (as defined above) Arius Dion wins and gets to control Slimebeast's sig for 1 month.

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BladeOfGod said:
theRepublic said:
Jo21 said:
theRepublic said:
txrattlesnake said:
theRepublic said:
txrattlesnake said:

I'm not giving snakes a bad name. If the PS3 gets GT5 and then it gets FFXIII and they live up to their usuals sales levels as they should in Japan and in the end move the PS3 to where it has sold 5 to 7 million copies in Japan, then it gets a couple of more Kojima games and Kingdom Hearts 3 on top of that will it pass the Wii in the end probably not. But with those games and the others that will follow in their wake, it will surely pass the 50 million mark.

So, those are my numbers 5 to 7 million PS3s sold in Japan after the release of FF Versus XIII bringing more Japanese exclusives to the PS3 as a result.

And 50 to 70 million PS3s sold worldwide LTD putting it firmly in second place when this gen ends.


twesterm said:

Whenever I see threads like this I like to bring out this handy little chart I made:

You can speculate all you want about prices and what can and can't happen, but this chart paints a pretty clear picture.  In order to overtake 360 worldwide sales in three years, the PS3 would have to outsell it by 51k per week every week for the next three years.  That just isn't going to happen.

The only reasonable figure on there is the 5 figure (260 weeks) and that's 31k per week every week for fives years.  By the time five years is over the "winner" of this generation will have already been long decided and it just won't matter.

So yeah, just accept there's absolutely zero chance of the PS3 overtaking the 360 in worldwide sales or in the Americas.  It's possible it may happen in Others, but even that can't happen for several years.

I'm not saying the PS3 is a failure by any means, I'm just say it can't "win" and it can't overtake the 360 in a reasonable amount of time.

http://vgchartz.com/forum/post.php?id=2202853

     How long did it take the Wii to catch the 360?  It seems like it didn't take it anywhere near three years.

With dramatically better exclusives on PS3 than 360 the PS3 could start to overtake the 360 much quicker than you speculate.  Especially if there aren't any significant games or only a few Rare games being placed on the 360 at the same time the PS3 is making up the majority of those sales.

It took less than a year:

http://vgchartz.com/hwcomps.php?cons1=Wii&reg1=All&cons2=PS3&reg2=All&cons3=X360&reg3=All&start=39040&end=39327&weekly=1

But that is because the Wii was routinely selling close to 200,000 more units per week:

http://vgchartz.com/hwcomps.php?cons1=Wii&reg1=All&cons2=PS3&reg2=All&cons3=X360&reg3=All&start=39040&end=39327

Look at the chart.  Find how much more you think that the PS3 will sell over the 360 on average each week.  It will then tell you how many weeks it will take to catch the 360.

Personally, I think this gen will be pretty much over in around 3 to 3.5 years.  That means to catch the 360, the PS3 will have to sell between 44,000 and 51,000 units more than the 360.  I don't see that happening.  Even if it did, that would basically be a tie, and wouldn't change anything in the market.

For any meaningful change in the market to occur, the PS3 would have to pass the 360 in the next year or two.  That would mean that the PS3 would have to outsell the 360 by 76,000 to 153,0000 units per week.  I really don't see that happening.

christmas can do wonders.

even if does 360 will get replaced first. first to come. first to leave.

Once a new gen starts, its game over.  It doesn't matter if the PS3 passes the 360 after that.

Yea, keep saying that to yourself. If by some miracle  Xbox outsells PS2 or GBA outsells PS2, people would made that news bigger than moon landing.

Don't you realize why it is game over?  Once a new gen starts, software support for the second and third place consoles of the previous gen is going to dry up.

So how exactly would the Xbox or GBA keep selling without software support?



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loadedstatement said:
kaneada said:

Who are you exactly? What degree to you hold  to make assertions about things you know to be true? You must be some first or second year college student studying statistics and market trends, but I think your classes have failed you bud.

This generation of consoles very closely resembles the 16-bit era. Looking at trends (examining only the two HD consoles against the SNES and the Gensis) the Genesis had the most steam and was steadily gaining in hardware sales due to popularity and their excellent software library at the time. The SNES was very far behind at this point and it wasn't until the halfway point of that generation that SNES really gained headway. If I remember correctly Donkey Kong Country was proclaimed as the systems savior and turning point. The point is the SNES was steadily making headway as the Gensis declined and eventually edged out the Genesis in sales. Need I mention there was a recession during the early period of this generation as well?

The PS3 is showing the same trend and there are many similarities. In the begining of the 16-bit war, the power of the SNES wasn't really necessary as in this era the PS3 is in the same boat. The Genesis was selling at a lower price point and had the edge in the games people wanted to play. As the SNES's power was exploited it became necessary, because possibilities opened up that were simply not available on the Genesis. The same is happening with the PS3...primarily with games that are showing off incredible physics...GOW III is a great example. Opportunities for new game idea's and grander schemes are a going to take over this market which is flooded with casual games and hardcore FPS'. The same paralell could be drawn between the flood of side scroller action games on the Gensis and SNES which gave way to the RPG toward the end of the SNES' life and continued to saturate the market on the PS1.

The prediction to follow is that the PS3 will not sell anywhere near as much as the PS1 or PS2, will probably sell around 70 million units and edge out the 360 ever so slightly. If you look at trends between the consoles week over week for the last several months, the gap between the two consoles are steadily closing. Here recently that gap has only been a little over 10k units.

Sony will not be able to take over the Nintendo's right to throne this generation, that much is known and there is few that will dispute that claim with the way the numbers looks right now. Nintendo will get third party support and has, the problem are most of those exclusives were total garbage. I don't expect a great deal of those exclusives to be too great in the future either, save for 1st party Nintendo games which have been their bread and butter since the N64.

The argument that FF should be used as a bench mark for Sony consoles sales has some validity to it. That game will sell millions and will drive up sales of the PS3 in Japan at least. It will probably generate a good deal in America while doing little for MS becuase trends are starting to show the market is pretty well saturated by the 360. Also consider, by and large, that most JRPG players are Sony loyal and are eagerly awaiting to see this game. If you want to place money on a Sony system savior, then I would say that GOW III is most likely to be the system Donkey Kong Country.

I won't sit here and arrogantly assert that I am right about all of this, there are many holes in my arguments and while there are a lot of similarties (as I have drawn) there are also many differences. SNES games always looked consistently better than there Genesis counterparts, this time around many PS3 ports of 360 games look terrible in comparison up until the last year or so. That is one of many.

I do however completely disagree with your analysis that Sony will abruptly die and I think you need to look at your numbers again. Sony might not be number one, but it isn't going anywhere either.

 

Welcome to VGChartz, kaneada! (I'm not about to get into this arguement.  Just wanted to welcome you here!)

Thanks! I've been around, but I haven't posted much. I have to admit the audience is pretty well educated here...makes the arguments more interesting.



-- Nothing is nicer than seeing your PS3 on an HDTV through an HDMI cable for the first time.

The SNES/Genesis comparison is completely on target when compared to the PS3/360. Like the Genesis the 360 relies heavily on early adopters in the US. Like the SNES the PS3's greater power and universal appeal will become more apparent as the generation drags on.

I think of the 720 as the next Saturn. The next gen system that will release too early for consumers who are already weary of your product because of previously failed add ons.



theRepublic said:
BladeOfGod said:
theRepublic said:
Jo21 said:
theRepublic said:
txrattlesnake said:
theRepublic said:
txrattlesnake said:

I'm not giving snakes a bad name. If the PS3 gets GT5 and then it gets FFXIII and they live up to their usuals sales levels as they should in Japan and in the end move the PS3 to where it has sold 5 to 7 million copies in Japan, then it gets a couple of more Kojima games and Kingdom Hearts 3 on top of that will it pass the Wii in the end probably not. But with those games and the others that will follow in their wake, it will surely pass the 50 million mark.

So, those are my numbers 5 to 7 million PS3s sold in Japan after the release of FF Versus XIII bringing more Japanese exclusives to the PS3 as a result.

And 50 to 70 million PS3s sold worldwide LTD putting it firmly in second place when this gen ends.


twesterm said:

Whenever I see threads like this I like to bring out this handy little chart I made:

You can speculate all you want about prices and what can and can't happen, but this chart paints a pretty clear picture.  In order to overtake 360 worldwide sales in three years, the PS3 would have to outsell it by 51k per week every week for the next three years.  That just isn't going to happen.

The only reasonable figure on there is the 5 figure (260 weeks) and that's 31k per week every week for fives years.  By the time five years is over the "winner" of this generation will have already been long decided and it just won't matter.

So yeah, just accept there's absolutely zero chance of the PS3 overtaking the 360 in worldwide sales or in the Americas.  It's possible it may happen in Others, but even that can't happen for several years.

I'm not saying the PS3 is a failure by any means, I'm just say it can't "win" and it can't overtake the 360 in a reasonable amount of time.

http://vgchartz.com/forum/post.php?id=2202853

     How long did it take the Wii to catch the 360?  It seems like it didn't take it anywhere near three years.

With dramatically better exclusives on PS3 than 360 the PS3 could start to overtake the 360 much quicker than you speculate.  Especially if there aren't any significant games or only a few Rare games being placed on the 360 at the same time the PS3 is making up the majority of those sales.

It took less than a year:

http://vgchartz.com/hwcomps.php?cons1=Wii&reg1=All&cons2=PS3&reg2=All&cons3=X360&reg3=All&start=39040&end=39327&weekly=1

But that is because the Wii was routinely selling close to 200,000 more units per week:

http://vgchartz.com/hwcomps.php?cons1=Wii&reg1=All&cons2=PS3&reg2=All&cons3=X360&reg3=All&start=39040&end=39327

Look at the chart.  Find how much more you think that the PS3 will sell over the 360 on average each week.  It will then tell you how many weeks it will take to catch the 360.

Personally, I think this gen will be pretty much over in around 3 to 3.5 years.  That means to catch the 360, the PS3 will have to sell between 44,000 and 51,000 units more than the 360.  I don't see that happening.  Even if it did, that would basically be a tie, and wouldn't change anything in the market.

For any meaningful change in the market to occur, the PS3 would have to pass the 360 in the next year or two.  That would mean that the PS3 would have to outsell the 360 by 76,000 to 153,0000 units per week.  I really don't see that happening.

christmas can do wonders.

even if does 360 will get replaced first. first to come. first to leave.

Once a new gen starts, its game over.  It doesn't matter if the PS3 passes the 360 after that.

Yea, keep saying that to yourself. If by some miracle  Xbox outsells PS2 or GBA outsells PS2, people would made that news bigger than moon landing.

Don't you realize why it is game over?  Once a new gen starts, software support for the second and third place consoles of the previous gen is going to dry up.

So how exactly would the Xbox or GBA keep selling without software support?

sony have more studios than microsoft and nintendo combined, thats why.

though if sony decides to fully support PS4 only then is game over though sony support ps2 heavily until 2007 with god of war 2 hitting even ps3 was resurging.



theRepublic said:

Don't you realize why it is game over?  Once a new gen starts, software support for the second and third place consoles of the previous gen is going to dry up.

So how exactly would the Xbox or GBA keep selling without software support?

You speak as if it's a law of nature, but it isn't so. At best you're projecting in the future mechanics that happened how many times? Two, three? And this time with different technologies, economic conditions etc.

When did in the past the second and third place console constitute almost a single development platform?

When did in the past the development cost of a game baloon to such proportions, and in the same way the time required to develop the middleware needed to make a profit?

The game is changing all the time. Looking back at NES and SNES, Genesis, N64 and PS1 is simplistic. How the development will work in 2012-2013 has still to be written. It could very well be that both MS and SONY pull a Wii and release upgraded versions of their machines, but similar enough that simultaneous development can happen for the two generations.



"All you need in life is ignorance and confidence; then success is sure." - Mark Twain

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