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Forums - Microsoft - 360 DVD data limit is 6.8 GB

thx1139 on 22 April 2009

Your basing this on the MS-DOS version of FAT?



Its libraries that sell systems not a single game.

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MikeB on 22 April 2009
NJ5 said:
MikeB said:

@ NJ5

Yes, 360 games are optimised like that. But as you move away from the outer edge of the disc, repositioning the lens back towards the edge will increase seektimes.

Like it could make perfect sense on the PS3 to have the main executeable on the harddrive, it makes sense to have this at the outer edge of the 360 DVD for fast game bootup. Streaming is far more of an issue though, it requires a lot of planning, so often developers stick to minimal read speeds instead (the capacity on disc isn't that big neither, so reading faster may not be needed as it's not the main bottleneck).

Everything regarding to read speeds (and clarifications regarding storage space) I aimed to address here:
http://www.vgchartz.com/forum/post.php?id=2002828

But those speed you quoted are probably for the whole disc. If 360 games have the 6.8 GB always on the outer part of the disc, the lower speeds will never happen, increasing the average speed.

 

You misunderstand how discs works. Basically view data at their core as a sequence of 0s and 1s (actually little pits on a disc, equals 0s and 1s), so something like:

0001101011101001011110011100011111111001010100011

6.8 GB regards the whole disc, which is divided into tracks.

The outer tracks, a sequence of 0s and 1s, can hold more data as the track is longer. A disc spinning at a constant rate, thus means one rotation at the outer edge more 0s and 1s will pass the lens than for a single rotation on an inner track.

 



Naughty Dog: "At Naughty Dog, we're pretty sure we should be able to see leaps between games on the PS3 that are even bigger than they were on the PS2."

PS3 vs 360 sales

DirtyP2002 on 22 April 2009

as long as awesome games like Fable II, Gears of War 2, Halo3 etc fit on one Disc, I am okay with that.



Imagine not having GamePass on your console...

NiKKoM on 22 April 2009

Thats quite bad.... for the PS3...
So that would mean that for some PS3 multiplat games with their mandatory installs you are putting almost the entire game on the HD to get the same performance as on the 360?? RE5 had 5?? DMC4 had 4.8? Bioshock 5?



 

Face the future.. Gamecenter ID: nikkom_nl (oh no he didn't!!) 

NJ5 on 22 April 2009
MikeB said:

You misunderstand how discs works. Basically see view data at their core as a sequence of 0s and 1s (actually little pits on a disc, equally 0s and 1s), so something like:

0001101011101001011110011100011111111001010100011

6.8 GB regards the whole disc, which is divided into tracks.

The outer tracks, a sequence of 0s and 1s, can hold more data as the track is longer. A disc spinning at a constant rate, thus means one rotation at the outer edge more 0s and 1s will pass the lens than for a single rotation on an inner track.

 

Lol, that has nothing to do with what I said.

The only thing I said is that the 6.8 GB of data can be placed exclusively on the outer part of the disc, which has higher read speed with a CAV drive.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constant_angular_velocity

 



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Asmo on 22 April 2009
NiKKoM said:
to get the same performance as on the 360?

Performance isn't the same. Taking datas from an HD is much faster than DVD. Have you tried installing some games on your 360?

 



MikeB on 22 April 2009
Asmo said:
vlad321 said:

And the PS3 has a total of 512 megs of memory. Rather weak.

 

360's total memory is 522 MB, that's so much more...

The EDRAM is special purpose on the 360, it's not main system RAM. Just like the RSX's cache, Cell cache and SPU local memory are seperate from main system RAM. Actually the size of this EDRAM is an important 360 bottleneck. Even with 720p with AA, data will constantly have to be moved back and forth impacting efficiency, this inefficiency goes up dramatically with higher resolutions.

Also the PS3's default harddrive can be used in a similar matter as PCs use the harddrive for virtual memory...

 



Naughty Dog: "At Naughty Dog, we're pretty sure we should be able to see leaps between games on the PS3 that are even bigger than they were on the PS2."

PS3 vs 360 sales

MikeB on 22 April 2009
thx1139 said:
Your basing this on the MS-DOS version of FAT?

No, actually I am basing this on a very old developer presentation by Microsoft.



Naughty Dog: "At Naughty Dog, we're pretty sure we should be able to see leaps between games on the PS3 that are even bigger than they were on the PS2."

PS3 vs 360 sales

numonex on 22 April 2009

MikeB you keep going on and on about the same stuff we already know. So DVD holds only 6.8GB data we all knew that already.



NJ5 on 22 April 2009
numonex said:
MikeB you keep going on and on about the same stuff we already know. So DVD holds only 6.8GB data we all knew that already.

Actually dual-layer DVD can hold 8.5 GB, so this is useful information (I think I saw the presentation from Microsoft, the rest of the disc is used for DRM stuff if I recall correctly).

 



My Mario Kart Wii friend code: 2707-1866-0957