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Forums - Sony - Sony: Our first-party dev is as big as Microsoft and Nintendo's combined

Last time I checked, the four biggest developers/publishers are...

1) Activision/Blizzard
2) Electronic Arts
3) UbiSoft
4) SONY

Maybe my list isn't accurate anymore, but out of principle, why would anyone have any problem with the size of SONY's studios as long as they are providing the games?



Hackers are poor nerds who don't wash.

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Grooski said:
Darc Requiem said:
Cthulhu said:
NJ5 said:
Cthulhu said:
Darc Requiem said:

Sony needs to shut up and get their house in order. I've never seen a last place company to talk so much smack. They need to buckle down, figure out to get the PS3 price down, and pray that can somehow catch Microsoft for second place. Never have a seen so many different people from one company open their mouth and insert their foot so often. The phrases "talk is cheap" and "actions speak louder than words" are words Sony should consider.

 

I judge a company from the games they offer. 1rt 2nd or 3rd places doesnt matter. All i want is games.

Btw Sony's house is in order

What do you mean by "Sony's house in order"?

Are you completely ignoring the fact that their gaming division hasn't been consistently profitable since before the PS3 launched, and that the whole of Sony is now having losses too?

Sony has already said they'll fundamentally restructure the gaming business for profitability. This means they don't think the house is in order, and it may also mean that this quote from Mr. Koller won't be valid for long.

 

The games keep coming, thats all i care

 

That's the thing. If they keep mismanaging their game platforms the games won't keep coming. They botched the PS3. They ignored the PSP for 18 months inspite of it's solid sales. Sony's business decisions as for late have been one cluster fuck after another. They need to get their house in order. I'm not a fan of Sony but I don't want them to go belly up because they can't get out of their own way.

I want Sony sharp and competitive so both Nintendo and MS have to stay on their toes. They haven't been for this entire generation. They need stop worrying about Microsoft's and Nintendo's platforms and worry about their own. Their constant shift in focus shows a real lack of overall direction. Nintendo and MS have clear business plans. Sony keeps shifting in the wind and it's to their detriment.

 

Hmm, maybe. But then again:

 

(i) 22 million served and counting in just over 2.5 years...

Which makes the slowest selling console Sony has ever released.

(ii) NO loss of 3rd party support, in fact, more exclusive X360are now making its way to the PS3, indicating an INCREASE in support. Vast majority of titles now releasing day and date with their counterparts.

The PS1 and PS2 had EXCLUSIVE third party support. The PS3 having trouble getting equal support for the third parties. Games continue to hit the 360 first and then the PS3 later.

(iii) PS3 outselling the X360 at the same cycle point.

The PS3 is selling slower than PS1, PS2, and Wii at the same cycle point. The 360 had a 5.5. million unit lead when the PS3 launched. The 360 currently has a 8.2 million unit lead over the PS3.

(iv) Anticipated 33 million console sales by end Dec 09

Which is lower than both the Wii and 360.

(vi) Profitability of console in Q2/Q3 likely

Unfortunately for Sony, Nintendo was profitable from day one. Even if the PS3 becomes profitable, it's highly unlikely to make up for all of the financial losses. It will not make up for the lost marketshare.

(vii) Increased revenues from game sales, launch of video store in PAL, launch of music download service in all territories exponentially increasing the operating revenues of Sony Game. Home to expand with increased publisher support. Don't like Home? Its a revenue cash cow.... who cares if you don't. Strengthen this with increased PS3 and PSP software sales and you have an excellent mix at profits from Q3 2009 onward.

Revenue means nothing. Profit however does. Even when the 360 and X-box before it were losing money, the were both generating signficant revenue. Take Two's revenue was through the roof with GTAIV's release, unfortunately their profits were not. The problem Sony faces and Nintendo does too at much lesser extent. Currency. The Europe/PAL market would be the source of tremendous profit however the strong yen has made certain that isn't the case.

(viii) As for coming last, what does coming second and outselling its competitor get Microsoft??? Nothing...because the PS3 install base is now too high. You can't moneyhat exclusives anymore when you have to cover expected sales for this fanbase. As this fanbase rises, so does expected return on development costs for EVERY third party release making development now worthwhile.

What does that net Microsoft? A weakened Playstation brand. MS won't have to pay as much for money hats and Sony will not have the overwhelming free support that comes with being the reigning market leader. Sony will have to work just as hard if not harder than Microsoft for third party support. Coming off the succes of the PS1 and PS2. Third parties assumed Sony would be console leader and started up projects with little no financial incentives. The PS4 won't have that luxury.

Its now past the point of mattering who comes second this gen because it is nothing but fanboy service. More and more the focus will return to profitability.

A larger userbase isn't fanboy service. It provides a higher ceiling for software sales which in turn leads to more profits. The higher the userbase the less of a financial incentive a hardware manufacturer has to give third parties for exclusive content. A lower userbase means less leverage for a hardware manufacturer in negotations with a third party company for content.

Koller is dead right. Having a massive devlopment team is a huge advantage as we move further on this gen.

That is about the only thing he did get right. A strong internal development team takes away the reliance on third party developers for content.

With the same continued AAA third-party releases, a vastly overwhelming majority of first party exclusives, a massive army of development focussed on new IP investment for the future and a strengthening of revenues I'd say that the PS3 is not doing too shabby at the moment.

None of what stated above changes the fact that Sony has lost massive amounts of marketshare. You may think that does not matter, but the loss leader philsophy Sony employs requires a commanding lead in marketshare to be profitable. It relies on software sales not only making for the losses on hardware but on R&D as well. Given their position in the market, Sony would be extremely fortunate to break even on the PS3 when all is said and done.

Yes you'll notice I ignored the Wii, which is probably what 30 million Wii owners do regularly...

Spoken like a true fanboy. Both Sony and Microsoft buried their heads in the sand when came to Nintendo. We've seen what that has gotten them.

 

Honestly, I didn't think anyone had the nerve to argue that the Sony hadn't botched the PS3. Sony better be thankful for RRoD. Without it, it's likely that the PS3 would be even further behind the 360.

 



I really hope they don't downsize due to the recession....

I really enjoy playing all those mediocre selling but AAA none-the-less games they produce...

The steady stream of excellent games of a mix of old franchises and new IPs are the best in the industry. I wouldn't be surprised if third parties start to feel the pinch when trying to compete for sales on the PS3



PSN ID: T_Gears

End of 2009 ltd sales:

Wii = 67-68m

X360 = 38-39m

PS3 = 34-35m

Prediction: The PS3 will surpass the 360 on weekly sales after it drops to $299 on all regular weeks (no big releases).

I'd be interested in knowing how many games haven't made a profit. Aside from the obvious titles like LAIR, and Killzone 2... how many haven't made a profit, yet?

We can assume that Heavenly Sword, Warhawk, Gran Turismo Prologue, Uncharted, the Resistance games, the new Ratchets have all made profits.

What other games with large budgets have there been?

As for the smaller games, the PSN titles and the PSP games, it's safe to assume that they've posted profits.

I think the problem Sony has at the moment is that they have a lot of projects in the pipeline that are eating money, they've got the one of the worst out of the door (Killzone), but there are still a couple more-ish to come.

What Sony needs to do is work out why the 360 sells so much software, and get it into the PS3 - they've implemented a Trophy system, but they need to focus on getting exclusive content for their platform.

And that's what I predict Sony will be doing by the end of this year: shrinking their dev team by 10%-20%, and spending the money on exclusive content, making sure that the PS3 versions of multi-platform titles are the definitive versions, and making sure that the consumer realises this.



--OkeyDokey-- said:
bardicverse said:
leatherhat said:

Proof of quality and quantity

@bardicverse

 

Theres nothing stupid about facts, sony has bigger first party studio then nintendo and MS combined

 

Oh but there is about this one. See, Sony's first party is severely lackluster compared to Nintendo's. So by boasting of a larger first party, they are saying that with a bigger staff, they still can't compete with Nintendo's first party, which apparently is smaller. Thus, in turn, it can be translated that he is saying Sony's first party dev teams aren't nearly as talented as Nintendo's.

 

Sony... lackluster?
So what have Nintendo 1st and 2nd party studios  got in store for Wii this year, then?

Punch Out, Wii Sports and repackaged Gamecube games. Yay!

Meanwhile, Sony has lined up for PS3 in 2009...

Killzone 2 (already out), Heavy Rain, God of War 3, Ratchet and Clank Future 2, Uncharted 2, InFamous and maybe even Gran Turismo 5.

I know which list looks lackluster...

What about Tales of Vesperia along with White Knight Chronicles?

Oops, we are talking 1st and 2nd party.

 



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BMaker11 said:
bardicverse said:
leatherhat said:

Proof of quality and quantity

@bardicverse

 

Theres nothing stupid about facts, sony has bigger first party studio then nintendo and MS combined

 

Oh but there is about this one. See, Sony's first party is severely lackluster compared to Nintendo's. So by boasting of a larger first party, they are saying that with a bigger staff, they still can't compete with Nintendo's first party, which apparently is smaller. Thus, in turn, it can be translated that he is saying Sony's first party dev teams aren't nearly as talented as Nintendo's.

 

Keep clinging to your Mario games while Sony's devs continue to push out new IPs......

 

This is why most major PS releases have had numbers behind them. Killzone 2. GTA4. RE5. MGS 4. The Ratchet and clank iteration that comes each year... Uncharted two is already announced while the last Mario stems from 2007 and Zelda from 2006 and we have not even seen a sequal announced(!) for both.

For every LBP you list, nintendo has a wii fit. For every Fl0wer you mention, there is a Disaster. Think before you react.

 



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Euphoria14 said:

Well, if cover system is so common in FPS games these days name me some console FPS or any FPS that allows you to go behind cover, move along the cover and lean out for shots.

Take a look at some tactical shooters like Rainbow Six or Ghost Recon.



Sardauk said:
Kenology said:
Cthulhu said:
Samus Aran said:
You know what Ninty should say... Our console sales are as big as Microsoft or Sony combined. Sony keeps attacking Nintendo with the dsi and stuff like that. Sony deserve to get their ass wupped!

Actually Sony is trying to make new games, i dont see Ninty trying very hard.....and the end i will playing MAG, Uncharted2 and so on and you will play with the Ninty's sales

 

Strange...   I don't remember enjoying Wii Sports, Wii Fit, Endless Ocean, Wii Play, Captain Rainbow, Another Code, Disaster: Day of Crisis, Nintendogs, Brain Age, Personal Training: [enter type here], Soma Bringer, Hotel Dusk: Room 215, Flash Focus, Elite Beat Agents, etc. on the NES, SNES, GB, GBA, N64, or even the Gamecube...  Maybe Nintendo is making new games perhaps?

Goal posts to receive an epic shove in... 3... 2... 1...

 

That is because you are a kiddy-pokemon-lover...according to Sony's PR

http://www.vgchartz.com/forum/thread.php?id=67100&page=1

 


lol! That thread is awesome!

Euphoria14 said:
--OkeyDokey-- said:
bardicverse said:
leatherhat said:

Proof of quality and quantity

@bardicverse

 

Theres nothing stupid about facts, sony has bigger first party studio then nintendo and MS combined

 

Oh but there is about this one. See, Sony's first party is severely lackluster compared to Nintendo's. So by boasting of a larger first party, they are saying that with a bigger staff, they still can't compete with Nintendo's first party, which apparently is smaller. Thus, in turn, it can be translated that he is saying Sony's first party dev teams aren't nearly as talented as Nintendo's.

 

Sony... lackluster?
So what have Nintendo 1st and 2nd party studios  got in store for Wii this year, then?

Punch Out, Wii Sports and repackaged Gamecube games. Yay!

Meanwhile, Sony has lined up for PS3 in 2009...

Killzone 2 (already out), Heavy Rain, God of War 3, Ratchet and Clank Future 2, Uncharted 2, InFamous and maybe even Gran Turismo 5.

I know which list looks lackluster...

What about Tales of Vesperia along with White Knight Chronicles?

 

Tales is Namco, but I guess you could add WKC (even though I think it looks like rubbish).

Edit: Wait, nope, WKC is only being published by Sony.



The_God_of_War said:
They're just stating a fact. And any statement by a Sony employee will result in a 10+ page thread. Sony could say "The PS3 is black" and it would still happen.

 

True. I think it's the context in which Koller is saying it. It gives off the arrogance that because they have the largest studios that their games are > then everyone elses. That'll get ya 10 pages and counting. *shrugs*



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