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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Why doesn't someone make a 1080p FPS on the console

NNN2004 on 02 April 2009
WereKitten said:

@Sardauk
Your TV is fine. It is telling you that KZ2 is in 720p because it's not being upscaled by your PS3. So it's the TV that upscales it to its native resolution (1080 I suppose).

In Gears case, it's being rendered at 720p (I think it supports 720p and 1080i, like KZ2), and then the upscaler chip inside the 360 upscales it to 1080p, and that's correctly recognized by your TV.

In one case you're upscaling using the chip in your TV, in another you're upscaling using the chip in your 360, in both cases the rendering is 720p.

@NNN2004

Upscaled 720p is usually good enough, especially in motion. Note that it works for all consoles: as I said, if you feed a 720p signal to a 1080p TV, then the TV circuitry will upscale it. The only downside is if your TV has a really bad upscaler chip, then it might be better to let your console do the upscaling work.

ok can the tv upscale the ps3 games or the console should have to upscale also to do this ?

 



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NJ5 on 02 April 2009

Because the PS3 and the 360 GPUs aren't powerful enough to render native 1080p at a good framerate in games with demanding rendering requirements.

 



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WereKitten on 02 April 2009

@NNN2004

If your TV has a vertical resolution of 1080 and you feed it a 720p signal it will _necessarily_ upscale it to fill the screen.
Thus whatever the source of the 720p signal - a PS3, a cable box, a dvd/bluray player -, if you see a full screen image on a 1080p TV, then it means it is being upscaled. So you're done.

Basically on the PS3 the TV modes are autodetected, and you can't generally force all games to upscale. On the 360 you can force to upscale, and you can test outputting 720p or 1080p to see which image quality is better with your setup.

A little con of the 360 method: if you set it to upscale to 1080p and then connect it to a 720p TV, you will basically upscale 720p->1080p with the 360 chip then downscale 1080p->720p with the TV chip. The result of the double scaling will probably be a slight degradation of the image.

Again same disclaimer: if someone knows differently on the subject, please jump in and correct me.



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Deneidez on 02 April 2009

Well, the games would look more or less like original Xbox games or Wii games with 1080p resolution and better textures. X360 & PS3 GPUs just can't do better. :P



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Sardauk on 02 April 2009
bdbdbd said:
@Sardauk: It's viewed in a window? Do you have a setting that would automatically detect the signal and the TV would always upscale it to fit your screen resolution?

 

euh ... no

I don't think my screen upscale anything...



 

Evan Wells (Uncharted 2): I think the differences that you see between any two games has much more to do with the developer than whether it’s on the Xbox or PS3.

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Sardauk on 02 April 2009
Asmo said:
Sardauk said:

Yes you are right. But why can't I have an upscaled image for KZ2 then ? (Note that KZ2 is still tucked on 720p on my TV... or am I confused ? It runs the XMB in 1080p then switch to 720p when I start KZ2)

You didn't get what he said then. Your Killzone 2 is upscalled but by your TV not your console. The TV says 720p because this is the resolution of the signal its getting.

 

 

I'm not sure about what you say .

But that was my first point : I say my TV displaying a message with "720p" (when booting KZ2)  and I think that the image looks different (less limpid) than when it says 1080.

It was especially striking when I saw the turrets in multiplayer...

 



 

Evan Wells (Uncharted 2): I think the differences that you see between any two games has much more to do with the developer than whether it’s on the Xbox or PS3.

NJ5 on 02 April 2009
WereKitten said:

@NNN2004

If your TV has a vertical resolution of 1080 and you feed it a 720p signal it will _necessarily_ upscale it to fill the screen.
Thus whatever the source of the 720p signal - a PS3, a cable box, a dvd/bluray player -, if you see a full screen image on a 1080p TV, then it means it is being upscaled. So you're done.

Basically on the PS3 the TV modes are autodetected, and you can't generally force all games to upscale. On the 360 you can force to upscale, and you can test outputting 720p or 1080p to see which image quality is better with your setup.

A little con of the 360 method: if you set it to upscale to 1080p and then connect it to a 720p TV, you will basically upscale 720p->1080p with the 360 chip then downscale 1080p->720p with the TV chip. The result of the double scaling will probably be a slight degradation of the image.

Again same disclaimer: if someone knows differently on the subject, please jump in and correct me.

I guess you should be correct, but I'm not sure if most 720p TVs accept a 1080p signal.

I know mine doesn't, but then again I have a HD CRT which is not very typical in the first place. It supports 720p and 1080i HDMI input but not 1080p (so I set the 360 to output 720p).

 



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waron on 02 April 2009

ps360 are too weak to manage somethin like that - maybe in next generation, but definitely not now.



bdbdbd on 02 April 2009

@Sardauk: If a 720 resolution image is viewed in 1080p TV in full screen size (your TV seems to be 40" 1080p LCD), the image has to be upscaled, if not, it's not viewed in full screen.

Essentially upscaling means that the image is stretched. Stretching means, that the upscaler needs to create pixels out of nowhere for the extra lines (in practice, the upscaler tries to find the most likely colour for the "created" pixel).



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Asmo on 02 April 2009
Sardauk said:

 

I'm not sure about what you say .

But that was my first point : I say my TV displaying a message with "720p" (when booting KZ2)  and I think that the image looks different (less limpid) than when it says 1080.

It was especially striking when I saw the turrets in multiplayer...

 

 

What I say is that if your TV was displaying it in 720p then you will have a black frame around the picture.

 

The reason is :

Resolution of your TV 1920x1080 pixels

Resolution of the game 1280x720 pixels

 

To have the game in full screen, you need to upscale the game image. So your TV is doing this job 720p -> 1080p

 

If you see a difference between the 360 upscale and the TV upscale means your TV's upscaler isn't as good as the 360 one.