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Forums - Sales - Dear JRPG Developers; You’ve made your bed, now lie in it. (HONEST article)

Bitmap Frogs said:
Loud_Hot_White_Box said:

 

360 doesn't need me to imply anything.

There is a quality-bias in Japan and Europe much more so than in the US.

If it were about brand, why the much harder reversal for Playstation in the US?  There must be some difference between the US and the EU/Japan.  I've said what it is.

 

Yeah, that's what your avatar and username are for. So you don't have imply anything. 

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. Bring now market studies backing your position or GTFO. Otherwise you are just making shit up to follow on your biased and agenda-driven posts.

Yep, there must be. And you said what it is - but you didn't bring any supporting argument for it. Any. Therefore your whole post is just lies built atop your own biases.

You are running a circular argument there: you are saying that the ps3 is favored in europe because the europeans like quality backing it up saying europeans like quality which is proved by the continent favoring the ps3. 

You are biased, your posts lack consistency and you post just to further your agenda. 

 

Down to personal attacks, way to support yourself. 

Your flaw is in demanding that I "prove" my theory.  But a theory shows strength merely in being consistent with the facts.  Either admit that, or you have to "prove" that what I said is inconsistent with the facts (Japanese prefer low quality even though 360 is not selling there).  But any such claims you offered would be INCONSISTENT with the facts.

I'm not saying my explanation explains all sales differences.  Marketing, brand legacy, whether a region loves FPSs, these are all factors as well.  Yep, it would be ridiculous for me to ask for "proof" that they are factors.  Merely asking for the proof would show that I don't have a leg to stand on and couldn't offer a counterargument that is consistent with the facts.

Buh bye now!  Btw, you aren't competent to ever summarize my arguments.



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Loud_Hot_White_Box said:
Bitmap Frogs said:

Yeah, that's what your avatar and username are for. So you don't have imply anything. 

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. Bring now market studies backing your position or GTFO. Otherwise you are just making shit up to follow on your biased and agenda-driven posts.

Yep, there must be. And you said what it is - but you didn't bring any supporting argument for it. Any. Therefore your whole post is just lies built atop your own biases.

You are running a circular argument there: you are saying that the ps3 is favored in europe because the europeans like quality backing it up saying europeans like quality which is proved by the continent favoring the ps3. 

You are biased, your posts lack consistency and you post just to further your agenda. 

 

Down to personal attacks, way to support yourself. 

Your flaw is in demanding that I "prove" my theory.  But a theory shows strength merely in being consistent with the facts.  Either admit that, or you have to "prove" that what I said is inconsistent with the facts (Japanese prefer low quality even though 360 is not selling there).  But any such claims you offered would be INCONSISTENT with the facts.

I'm not saying my explanation explains all sales differences.  Marketing, brand legacy, whether a region loves FPSs, these are all factors as well.  Yep, it would be ridiculous for me to ask for "proof" that they are factors.  Merely asking for the proof would show that I don't have a leg to stand on and couldn't offer a counterargument that is consistent with the facts.

Buh bye now!  Btw, you aren't competent to ever summarize my arguments.

 

Hahahaha.

So you are trying to support yourself without backing your statements?

You see, the problem is that your statements do not hold to proper scrutiny because you use circular logic. You have nothing to support your biased fanboy logic. For starters, you have just been questioned on the quality of previous consoles and their performance in the market which is against your hypothesis. Where's your answer to that?

You are working on closed loop logic, and when your biased fanboy explanation used just to further your agenda-driven campaign of hate doesn't stand to scrutiny you just dismiss it saying your hypothesis doesn't account for everything. AKA your hypothesis is flawed.

Brilliant. Golfclap. 

At least you are wise enough to leave the thread before you are further embarrassed. Now, go hide!

 





Current-gen game collection uploaded on the profile, full of win and good games; also most of my PC games. Lucasfilm Games/LucasArts 1982-2008 (Requiescat In Pace).

Also yeah... the PS1 and PS2 were the shoddiest consoles of their generation.

If quality non eror proned hardware was they key Nintendo should of won europe up to the gamecube era.



Kasz216 said:
Also yeah... the PS1 and PS2 were the shoddiest consoles of their generation.

If quality non eror proned hardware was they key Nintendo should of won europe up to the gamecube era.

 

Did PS1/2 have a well known 16% percent failure rate like 360?  No.

There Bitmap, countered it.

Shoddy boxes sell less well in some regions.



Loud_Hot_White_Box said:
Kasz216 said:
Also yeah... the PS1 and PS2 were the shoddiest consoles of their generation.

If quality non eror proned hardware was they key Nintendo should of won europe up to the gamecube era.

 

Did PS1/2 have a well known 16% percent failure rate like 360?  No.

There Bitmap, countered it.

Shoddy boxes sell less well in some regions.

 

Ah, so anxious to prove yourself that you made a major mistake =/ 

Mere amateur, I say.

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news03/playstation.html

Things went sour for Sony and they eventually settled, offering freebies and repairs of broken ps2 units. 

Sony was mass-sued in a class action lawsuit built upon the poor quality of the playstation 2 and they were forced to settle. Now that's poor build quality. Even funnier is that Sony tried to blame consumers for this (dust, fingerprints, etc... it's all in the link, read at your pleasure).

You can diss Microsoft as much as you want, but no one has been able to raise a case at the courts, meanwhile the ps2 did and it generated a lot of bad publicity for Sony. Heck, you just have to ask anyone with a ps2... one of my friends is on his 5th ps2. My 2nd ps2 broke down, didn't buy a third. Etc...

Let me repeat this to you so it sinks, Sony was court-ordered to repair playstation 2 units. 

You countered it? Hah. You sank yourself even more. You should have stayed out of the thread.





Current-gen game collection uploaded on the profile, full of win and good games; also most of my PC games. Lucasfilm Games/LucasArts 1982-2008 (Requiescat In Pace).

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The early PS2 failure rates were well known... and also were very high.

It's early failure rates were likely higher then the 360's considering they lost a few lawsuits about it.



Kasz216 said:
The early PS2 failure rates were well known... and also were very high.

 

Yeah, but this particular troll is trying to build a case that the playstation 3 does better in Europe because Europeans prefer quality product, yet the playstation 2 was shoddy yet it sold like no other console in Europe.





Current-gen game collection uploaded on the profile, full of win and good games; also most of my PC games. Lucasfilm Games/LucasArts 1982-2008 (Requiescat In Pace).

Bitmap Frogs said:
Loud_Hot_White_Box said:
Kasz216 said:
Also yeah... the PS1 and PS2 were the shoddiest consoles of their generation.

If quality non eror proned hardware was they key Nintendo should of won europe up to the gamecube era.

 

Did PS1/2 have a well known 16% percent failure rate like 360?  No.

There Bitmap, countered it.

Shoddy boxes sell less well in some regions.

 

Ah, so anxious to prove yourself that you made a major mistake =/ 

Mere amateur, I say.

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news03/playstation.html

Things went sour for Sony and they eventually settled, offering freebies and repairs of broken ps2 units. 

Sony was mass-sued in a class action lawsuit built upon the poor quality of the playstation 2 and they were forced to settle. Now that's poor build quality. Even funnier is that Sony tried to blame consumers for this (dust, fingerprints, etc... it's all in the link, read at your pleasure).

You can diss Microsoft as much as you want, but no one has been able to raise a case at the courts, meanwhile the ps2 did and it generated a lot of bad publicity for Sony. Heck, you just have to ask anyone with a ps2... one of my friends is on his 5th ps2. My 2nd ps2 broke down, didn't buy a third. Etc...

Let me repeat this to you so it sinks, Sony was court-ordered to repair playstation 2 units. 

You countered it? Hah. You sank yourself even more. You should have stayed out of the thread.

Oho, I was expecting a link about failure rate of PS2 and how it was widely known by the Europeans and Japanese, but I find a hopelessly irrelevant attempt to counter my point.  Kasz seems to recognize the data necessary to counter, but you ignored it in your repsonse to him.  To make it clear: I'm suggesting the PS2's failure rate wasn't as high, and that Sony's quality reputation wasn't harmed nearly as much.

That link you provided, and the presence of lawsuits and a court order, do not show that PS2's quality reputation was as low as the 360's is now.  I fully believe that PS2 disc drives, and 360 hardware generally, fucked up a lot.  But it's a question of degree, and the reputation built upon that degree.  I feel sorry for you if you think a court order proves that PS2 a worse reputation for quality than 360 in Japan/EU.

Microsoft didn't settle in courts (if that's indeed true), it's perhaps in part because they rolled out a $1billion+ program to mitigate their quality issues.  If you say Sony should have done similarly, that's merely moving away from the question of which hardware had the worse rap, to the question of which company's response was better after it got done ignoring or denying the problem.  Ignoring and denying which starts in R&D, of course.

As I've said before, I'm not saying that 360's poor quality is the only factor controlling why it sells better in America than in Japan and the UK, but nonetheless 1) the contention hasn't been countered and is consistent with the facts, and 2) you made a laughable mistake in demanding that I "prove" that quality was a factor.  I didn't come in, state the claim, and demand that you "prove" I was wrong.  I'm just saying that unless PS2/Sony's problems equalled or exceeded the RRoD problem, my contention retains plausibility.

One factor in 360's faster US sales, as opposed to Japan/EU sales, is that consumers in those regions punish poor quality more severely than US consumers.  That's not inconsistent with the facts, and I'm not a troll for raising it.  You're a fanboy for trying to shut me up.

 

About Japan's quality-conscious nature:

"Such population densities also contribute to another reason why companies doing business in the Japanese market need to be so sensitive about their reputation for quality, reliability and service - the Japanese market is one huge rumor-mill which can near-bankrupt a company within weeks if it becomes the victim of a true rumor regarding its stability, product quality or ethics."

http://www.venturejapan.com/japanese-market.htm

 

Hmm, did this happen to PS2?  Did it happen to Apple when iPods took over Japan's mp3 player market?