So why is the PS3 still dead last??? U and Magnific0 seem to think the PS3 is much cheaper and better so how come it constantly gets outsold by the 360???

yeah but 10-15 bucks per console is alot of money in total

A lower price tag has more appeal to some consumers than actual value considerations. A much more estabilished online community, especially in NA, pulls consumers towards 360. Marketing. Iconic franchises, again especially tailored for the NA online gaming market.

There are many reasons why consoles sell, just look at the Wii mopping the floor sales wise with both PS3 and 360.

I am not  disputing that the 360 is a good console, even a better one than the PS3 for some consumers; but since we're supposed to be _informed_ consumers, we can look beyond the obvious price tag, stop spouting blatant lies like "you'll need $50-$100 HDMI cables with your PS3" and comment on actual features, value, libraries. Let's buy the console(s) we deem better for us, but let's also leave the bullshitting out of here. It's a waste of everybody's time.

@ Werekitten with frog avatar:

There are two different perspectives here, sometimes it isn't exactly clear which one is being used. There is the personal perspective here and the mass market perspective when talking about overall sales. Furthermore one shouldn't take it for granted that people are willing/able to replace a PS3 HDD even here on these forums for example.

i completely agree

@ Squilliam with T.J. Hooker in a red pijama avatar:

True, that base ambiguity causes misunderstandings again and again.

And yes, the HDD easy upgradeability is sort of an advanced feature, it's not for everybody. Just as the abilty to install an extra OS. But just as you were always able of finding a guy at school or in the neighbourhood to solder a chip in your xbox/wii/ps2, you'll be easily be able to have your HDD upgraded for a fraction of the cost per gigabyte compared to MS' proprietary one.
Btw, maybe the comment about replacing HDD was meant for another thread?

@ Werekitten you can upgrade the Xbox 360 HDD quite easily and cheaply if you download a program off the internet. So for people who want to migrate to a larger HDD this way actual process is actually quite similar between the Xbox 360 and PS3 barring the slight issue of only being able to use a 120GB HDD maximum for now, which isn't as much of a concern as the Xbox 360 doesn't require as much storage.

Essentially if you haven't a clue what you're doing then the Xbox 360 is the only way to go, and if you do know what you're doing you can perform the same process on both consoles with roughly the same number of steps and it costs about the same too.

@Squilliam
Even 120GB HDD sounds a little restricitve to me, once the NXE "install" is taken in account. I'm not sure how much data they are cramming on those DVD9 disks, but I can assume that copying to the HDD Star Ocean IV or Lost Odissey will take about 25-30GB for each?

Plus, by strongly limiting the HDD space availability you're losing on present and future chance for gaming. Downloading user created levels and mods for example as in LBP and UT3 (PC and PS3 versions). Bigger downloadable games (Watchmen: the end is nigh is over a GB). And MS seems to be keen on extra DLC... I think those 120GB won't seem all that much at all in a year or two.

I suspect pretty strongly that larger HDDs will become available this year which should solve that problem. When they come out I intend to purchase one off a local etailer and flash it for use in one of my 360s.

A little side note and a curiosity: there are instructions on how to replace the HDD on the PS3 manual, and doing so does not invalid the warranty.
I can assume that the DIY operations on the 360's HDD do invalid it?