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Forums - General - Palin's Daughter Says Abstinence Not Realistic

jv103 said:
madskillz said:
Commando said:
yeah I agree with her.

Abstinance/shastity was a norm in the days where it was common for teenagers to get married, have houses and basically become adults. Nowdays our culture/society fosters adolescents and young adults and basically strives to keep them more childlike. With it bieng very rare for someone to get married by the age of 20, you have to figure Abstinance will become a thing of the past.

Dude, I know 4 virgins - 2 women in their 30s, 2 dudes - both in their late 30s.

For some folks, they want to wait for their spouse - to be married, in their own bed, and not have to sneak around. I had a friend of mine, an ex-man whore, who met my new wife and was like 'Man, she's an amazing woman.' Then, he told me he was jealous because of all the women he had been with, he loved none and it was just an act for him. He said 'Dude, I would love to find a good woman, marry her and enjoy being in love with the woman I am making love to.'

I did make one mistake - due to peer pressure - but I made a vow to remain abstinent.

It was hard as I am a nympho. My ex-fiancee tried a few times and was nearly successful. However, I stood my ground and just decided to wait until I had a Mrs. Skillz. When it happened, dang, it was well worth the wait. And our sex life is still healthy after nearly 7 years and only getting better. I find myself looking at my wife and enjoying every curve of her beautiful body and know that everytime I make love to her, waiting was the right choice all the way.

For me, sex is an intimate gift given by my Creator. There's some good sex in the Bible - look at Song of Solomon. That book is easily the most sexually-charged passage I've ever read. He enjoys gazing at her bosom - loves drinking from his fountain and knows his babe is the bomb.

This culture has it so right - sex with multiple partners and few consequences. Don't like your marriage? Walk away - matter of fact, hit a drive-thru and end it that way.

I have yet to see a person who shares themselves with so many folks who doesn't feel empty or well on their way there. I have no need to bring VD, HIV, AIDs, chlymidia and other junk into my union. Porn shows the deed, but doesn't show the emotional attachment when the dude - or woman - moves on. It doesn't show how a partner is dealing with VD. It doesn't show how the woman deals with pregnancy and the man busts a nut and bails.

No ... it shows the deed with no consequences. = PHAIL.

Do I notice women? Yeah - I'm a dude, but I have purposed in my heart to be true to my vows and only death will we part. I want to know one woman's body and trust me, after 10 years of waiting, it is well worth you holding off on banging some hawties.

By the way - Proverbs states - Hope deferred maketh the heart sick: but when the desire cometh, it is a tree of life.

Yeah, it's easy to fall and say 'Everyone's doing it,' but it takes a very strong person to say 'I'll wait until I get married' and hold their gift. Most of us will get married and waiting for your spouse sends a powerful message to them - I loved you this much that I didn't share myself with anyone else.

 

I totally respect your choice.

I was going to ask you though do you think people feel empty because of their sexual nature because it is inherently ungratifying? Or do you think it has to do with a culture centered on monogamy that requires independence (even from that spouse -dependence is bad in this culture)?

America experienced the sexual revolutions in the '60s. Huge mistake. Marriage is just a sham and love is lacking. My belief is in a marriage, the husband is the one in charge and responsible. The woman is his helpmeet - his VP. Sex is used to bond couples in their first years of marriage. Without the bonding, the marriage will likely fail. America's not big on patience. They want things now. Waiting is not something they are used to. And folks want to get busy and not invest anything worthwhile into relationships. For me and a few others, we understand that love takes time, getting to know your future spouse and having an understanding about things before you get married. And sex can get old after 6-7 months with the same partner.

Spouse dependence is awesome. You have to work as a team to fight off temptation, to be there to help your spouse, through sickness, health, richer or poorer. A commitment. And sex seals the deal.

My question is really geared toward the structure of society in general meaning that the symptom of having low self worth comes not from serial monogamy but rather the impersonal attitude we often find in our communities?

Low self esteem can be found among folks desiring love. Why do people have the inert need to be part of a bigger organization? They are like everyone else and want to be loved. If you meet a person who says otherwise, they're lying. Some of us can endure longer periods without love, but we all need to be loved and appreciated. Women often think a man will love them and want them if they have sex with them. That's often not the cause. However, if that man said 'I love you so much that I am willing to forego my selfish desires to learn more about you, to study you and deepen my love for you ... then, on our honeymoon get it crunk, sweet.' That man is showing self control. And for a woman, you'll win her heart in the end.

I was just thinking that this may be a symptom of that rather than the sex because I too have known people who would have casual sex with close friends and they were okay (at least they never complained to me). It almost seems like the 'unhappiness' you are speaking of may come from the inability to 'posess' or have sole rights to a person.

Sex is a powerful act. It's personal - and believe it or not, you both are becoming one. The more folks you have sex with, the more you are becoming one with folks. During certain periods of sex, you and your partner can sync - your rhythms will sync - you may even notice your breathing is in sync. You are one - and the more you do it, the more you will lose yourself. I can go way deeper about it, but I won't. But the thing about sex is - unlike most other acts, your entire being is involved.

 

Hola. I'm 35, btw, so I can give you some perspective.

From what my peeps have told me, and what I know, sex was designed for a man and wife into the bounds of marriage. If you choose to do it outside of marriage, while initially fulfilling, eventually, it's just a shallow act. Sure, you'll enjoy it and love the feeling you get from it, but in the end, if there's no love, no commitment, what's left?

I did have sex before I got married and said 'Never again, until I have Mrs. Skillz wit me.'

Sure, I felt left out a lot. I was like 'Is this really worth it? What if my wife is somewhere getting nailed?' But then, I looked inside of myself and realized I wanted to have sex for self-gratification. I wasn't trying to satisfy a woman - just get mine and get moving. My heart wasn't in it - so I just waited.

When my wife and I got together, the anticipation was phenomenal. We kissed, but even then, my wife was like 'Let's wait.' I was cool.

I did have some reservations, as we never talked about sex until we got married. For me, love had me wait until we were on our honeymoon. I didn't want to be on my honeymoon, our special night, look in the mirror and say 'Wow, you're a pro at this' or think she was just another jumpoff. No, our night was special. And for the record, our first week of marriage proved to me that my baby was holding all her loving for Mad Skillz. Our first two nights in Ft. Walton, it was evening before we left the hotel to get something to eat.

In the first year of marriage, sex is essential for bonding couples. However, if you have done it before - a lot of times, that specialness is pretty much gone. And without that bonding, look out.

A wise man told me 'It's best for a husband and wife to learn each other. If they are both inexperienced, so what. However, if the man is experienced, and she can't perform like his old flames, he will soon leave her to find someone who doesn't require instruction.'

Sex isn't meant to be shared - it's an intimate, one on one interaction. And sex before you get married really cheapens it.

Find me a divorced couple who waited until they got married to have sex and I'll call it a rarity.

Sex is more powerful than most folks think. It involves your entire being and could have far-reaching consequences.

 



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You guys are assuming that just because you don't "know" any different that you will automatically be satisfied regardless of what that person has to offer sexually.

That is quite an assumption...especially considering people have access to sex vicariously in so many different shapes and sizes these days. We are exposed to sex on a regular and habitual basis, and the expectations society creates for us of what sex "should be" are as influential or possibly MORE influential than our own experiences.

The attitude that just because you don't know anything else that you will be satisfied overlooks this reality.



We had two bags of grass, seventy-five pellets of mescaline, five sheets of high-powered blotter acid, a salt shaker half full of cocaine, a whole galaxy of multi-colored uppers, downers, screamers, laughers…Also a quart of tequila, a quart of rum, a case of beer, a pint of raw ether and two dozen amyls.  The only thing that really worried me was the ether.  There is nothing in the world more helpless and irresponsible and depraved than a man in the depths of an ether binge. –Raoul Duke

It is hard to shed anything but crocodile tears over White House speechwriter Patrick Buchanan's tragic analysis of the Nixon debacle. "It's like Sisyphus," he said. "We rolled the rock all the way up the mountain...and it rolled right back down on us...."  Neither Sisyphus nor the commander of the Light Brigade nor Pat Buchanan had the time or any real inclination to question what they were doing...a martyr, to the bitter end, to a "flawed" cause and a narrow, atavistic concept of conservative politics that has done more damage to itself and the country in less than six years than its liberal enemies could have done in two or three decades. -Hunter S. Thompson

akuma587 said:
You guys are assuming that just because you don't "know" any different that you will automatically be satisfied regardless of what that person has to offer sexually.

That is quite an assumption...especially considering people have access to sex vicariously in so many different shapes and sizes these days. We are exposed to sex on a regular and habitual basis, and the expectations society creates for us of what sex "should be" are as influential or possibly MORE influential than our own experiences.

The attitude that just because you don't know anything else that you will be satisfied overlooks this reality.

But, I do know both sides. After getting busy the first few times with a woman who wasn't my girlfriend, it was only strokes. It felt good but that's it. Matter of fact, I was nailin' her and not even there. Matter of fact, a few days after hitting her, some cat she met at a club nailed her. I wasn't even faded - as long as I could slide in her later on. I didn't, though.

I have seen the lives of folks from different walks and they all have the same result. I have cousins that decided to just get busy. You know what happened? They are men in their late 30s, early 40s used up. They are still searching for love.

You know, maybe I have it wrong, Akuma. I can only base what I know off of limited information and the like, but I will say, from the vast majority of folks I know, including a few of my peeps married more than twice, the data comes back the same without a doubt.

Sex isn't meant to be shared. You may buck the trend, but you will be in a clear minority.

 



But sex before the marriage isn't necessarily a one night stand or sex with someone who isn't your girlfriend/boyfriend, or you don't love.

And I respect love way more than I respect marriage.



alekth said:
But sex before the marriage isn't necessarily a one night stand or sex with someone who isn't your girlfriend/boyfriend, or you don't love.

And I respect love way more than I respect marriage.

I understand, but what I am saying is - what are you looking for in sex? And if you care enough about this person that you'd share yourself with this person, why not wait?

The biggest thing is - folks say abstinence is not realistic is just a cop out. It takes a person who gobs of self control to not have sex than for a person to hit the skins.

I have always been wary of the crowd mentality. I am unique, not a drone. I understand how deep, far-reaching and emotionally connected sex is. Most folks don't - and they do it, enjoy it for a lil while and move on. They keep searching for something that's missing.

There's more to marriage than sex. While it's awesome, if you build a relationship purely on sex, it won't last - unless you keep paying.

The fundamental flaw in this argument is - what is love? Folks are quick to wanna bang a person, but that's just a selfish stance. They speed to eros - and don't stay. They can't. They wonder why their relationship hasn't stood the test of time. There are actually 3 loves - philia, agape and eros. For a lasting relationship, all of those have to be explored.

Too many times, folks will end up in eros, and then try to hit the other loves. The odds are stacked against you that that relationship will last.

Sex is deeper than just the physical act - and people wonder why some folks are hurt afterward.

 



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"intimate one one one interaction" when did we start talking about threeways?



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madskillz said:
akuma587 said:
You guys are assuming that just because you don't "know" any different that you will automatically be satisfied regardless of what that person has to offer sexually.

That is quite an assumption...especially considering people have access to sex vicariously in so many different shapes and sizes these days. We are exposed to sex on a regular and habitual basis, and the expectations society creates for us of what sex "should be" are as influential or possibly MORE influential than our own experiences.

The attitude that just because you don't know anything else that you will be satisfied overlooks this reality.

But, I do know both sides. After getting busy the first few times with a woman who wasn't my girlfriend, it was only strokes. It felt good but that's it. Matter of fact, I was nailin' her and not even there. Matter of fact, a few days after hitting her, some cat she met at a club nailed her. I wasn't even faded - as long as I could slide in her later on. I didn't, though.

I have seen the lives of folks from different walks and they all have the same result. I have cousins that decided to just get busy. You know what happened? They are men in their late 30s, early 40s used up. They are still searching for love.

You know, maybe I have it wrong, Akuma. I can only base what I know off of limited information and the like, but I will say, from the vast majority of folks I know, including a few of my peeps married more than twice, the data comes back the same without a doubt.

Sex isn't meant to be shared. You may buck the trend, but you will be in a clear minority.

 

I'm not devaluing what you have to say, I am just saying that if people assume that they will be happy with their partner sexually simply because they have never had sex with anyone else is a false assumption.

I'm not criticizing people for remaining abstinent, I am just criticizing a poor rationalization for remaining abstinent.

 



We had two bags of grass, seventy-five pellets of mescaline, five sheets of high-powered blotter acid, a salt shaker half full of cocaine, a whole galaxy of multi-colored uppers, downers, screamers, laughers…Also a quart of tequila, a quart of rum, a case of beer, a pint of raw ether and two dozen amyls.  The only thing that really worried me was the ether.  There is nothing in the world more helpless and irresponsible and depraved than a man in the depths of an ether binge. –Raoul Duke

It is hard to shed anything but crocodile tears over White House speechwriter Patrick Buchanan's tragic analysis of the Nixon debacle. "It's like Sisyphus," he said. "We rolled the rock all the way up the mountain...and it rolled right back down on us...."  Neither Sisyphus nor the commander of the Light Brigade nor Pat Buchanan had the time or any real inclination to question what they were doing...a martyr, to the bitter end, to a "flawed" cause and a narrow, atavistic concept of conservative politics that has done more damage to itself and the country in less than six years than its liberal enemies could have done in two or three decades. -Hunter S. Thompson