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Forums - Gaming - Article : Wada is leading Square-Enix's empire into decline!!

Xen on 15 February 2009
outlawauron said:
Xen said:
outlawauron said:
YesWiiCan said:
Thing's started to go wrong for Square Enix after they switched from Nintendo to Sony. Bad Decision.

Right, the platform where their games reached the height of popularity. Oh man, what are you smoking?

"Cry moar" weed.

SE would be nothing without Sony, and if you weren't such a fanboy you'd see that.

No they'd still be a huge company, just that Final Fantasy (and subsquently, Kingdom Hearts, Star Ocean 3, etc.) wouldn't be as popular in NA. Final Fantasy 7 is responsible for kickstarting the West to buying JRPGs.

Not nearly as big though. The Sony advertising campaign for FF7 is a total legend... one responsible for making the west buy JRPG's indeed. And one responsible for Square rising sky-high in places other than Japan.

 



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Fumanchu on 15 February 2009

^ Advertising obviously would have helped, but they're no substitution for critical success and word of mouth hype. The fact that many consider it one of the greatest RPGs of all time, lends itself to the argument that Sony rode the FF exclusivity coat-tails to their success and not the other way around.



badgenome on 15 February 2009
Xen said:
outlawauron said:
Xen said:
outlawauron said:
YesWiiCan said:
Thing's started to go wrong for Square Enix after they switched from Nintendo to Sony. Bad Decision.

Right, the platform where their games reached the height of popularity. Oh man, what are you smoking?

"Cry moar" weed.

SE would be nothing without Sony, and if you weren't such a fanboy you'd see that.

No they'd still be a huge company, just that Final Fantasy (and subsquently, Kingdom Hearts, Star Ocean 3, etc.) wouldn't be as popular in NA. Final Fantasy 7 is responsible for kickstarting the West to buying JRPGs.

Not nearly as big though. The Sony advertising campaign for FF7 is a total legend... one responsible for making the west buy JRPG's indeed. And one responsible for Square rising sky-high in places other than Japan.

 

I would argue that it was this success that caused Squaresoft to get the big head and blow all their money on that shitty Final Fantasy movie, which of course resulted in them merging with Enix. So, in a very roundabout way, Sony ruined Square.

 



Xen on 15 February 2009
badgenome said:
Xen said:
outlawauron said:
Xen said:
outlawauron said:
YesWiiCan said:
Thing's started to go wrong for Square Enix after they switched from Nintendo to Sony. Bad Decision.

Right, the platform where their games reached the height of popularity. Oh man, what are you smoking?

"Cry moar" weed.

SE would be nothing without Sony, and if you weren't such a fanboy you'd see that.

No they'd still be a huge company, just that Final Fantasy (and subsquently, Kingdom Hearts, Star Ocean 3, etc.) wouldn't be as popular in NA. Final Fantasy 7 is responsible for kickstarting the West to buying JRPGs.

Not nearly as big though. The Sony advertising campaign for FF7 is a total legend... one responsible for making the west buy JRPG's indeed. And one responsible for Square rising sky-high in places other than Japan.

 

I would argue that it was this success that caused Squaresoft to get the big head and blow all their money on that shitty Final Fantasy movie, which of course resulted in them merging with Enix. So, in a very roundabout way, Sony ruined Square.

 

Way to spin things around =D

I love your posts dude.

 



Rei on 15 February 2009

Uh oh, like Sony published FFVII because they wanted to help Square and not because they saw the game as an opportunity to earn a lot of money.

Sony did get their reward for FFVII. There is nothing SE owes them. It is clear that FF wouldnt be as popular in the West as it is without Sony. Yet it is also clear that without Square and Enix - Sony would be nothing in Japan. Just go and look at top 5 best selling PSone and PS2 titles in Japan. PS3 has such a low userbase in Japan thanks in large part to lack of SE's games on the console.



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drboot on 15 February 2009
Phoenix_Wiight said:
NiKKoM said:
Ehm.. Didn't all the talent left Square and went to Monolith (Soma Bringer FTW), Brownie Brown, Mistwalker.. and they were left with this Emo dude? >_> Isn't that the main problem of square?

 

yes, the main writers of the FF series left very short into the developement into FFXII (which is why it therefore was bad,) and made mistwalker

 

Frankly, the quality of writing was never one of FF's stengths...



forevercloud3000 on 15 February 2009
outlawauron said:
Xen said:
outlawauron said:
YesWiiCan said:
Thing's started to go wrong for Square Enix after they switched from Nintendo to Sony. Bad Decision.

Right, the platform where their games reached the height of popularity. Oh man, what are you smoking?

"Cry moar" weed.

SE would be nothing without Sony, and if you weren't such a fanboy you'd see that.

No they'd still be a huge company, just that Final Fantasy (and subsquently, Kingdom Hearts, Star Ocean 3, etc.) wouldn't be as popular in NA. Final Fantasy 7 is responsible for kickstarting the West to buying JRPGs.

 

Some will argue that Sony was successful becuase of SE. Others will say it was the other way around. Yet I say lets take a different approach....

Look at the state of both right now. Sony's PS3 is not as successful as in previous itereations. Its not doing terrible but its not doing great either.

SE is on steady decline, in sales, and in the fan's eyes. They have strayed away from Sony and it has proven detrimental to their health.

I have come to the conclusion that it was the coexistence of the two together that made both such a huge success. Full glory cannot be given to either one.



      

      

      

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Pristine20 on 15 February 2009
Dianko said:
Pristine20 said:
makingmusic476 said:
And I agree with those saying that making 360 exclusives was a stupid idea. Out of the five major platforms in Japan, the 360 has BY FAR the smallest install base.

And to the people saying those exclusives weren't moneyhatted... lol. SE may be dumb, but they're not THAT dumb. They certainly had at least some compensation for those endeavors.

 

 this is why many believe that moneyhats were involved. Not saying that thats a good or bad thing...it's just the thing.

Maybe the money M$ gave them far surpassed whatever profits they could make from a ps3 version. That and the fact that they're trying to westernize themselves as that's "where it's at" nowadays.

 

Well, what about the money that Sony must be paying SE? Afterall, PS3 sales in Japan are pathetic. Absolutely pathetic. And elsewhere, there is no reason FFv13 should be exclusive since there is an almost 10 million unit deficit between the 360 and PS3. And that's not even bringing the Wii into the discussion. There is an ongoing thread in 2ch gaming that I think expresses the situation fairly well. It translates roughly to "SE to Sony: "Hurry up and sell some fucking consoles already!", the implication being that SE has refused to release their big games on the PS3 due to the failure by Sony to sell the system.


Why is there a belief that a PS3 version is a given when it's not even in a good enough position to KEEP exclusives? And again, that's an argument against the PS3 and for the 360/mulitplatform. The Wii makes the argument even uglier.

You're funny. I'm pretty sure 2 years ago we all thought ffxiii was ps3 exclusive. FFvsxiii is not even set for release in 2010. 2011 at best and you don't think things can change before then LMAO. It's very unlikely that sony gave anyone money at this point. Have you read their balances lately?

You argue that ps3 sales in Japan are dismal yet accept the fact that a 360 exclusive for a heavily Japan-centric game makes sense. If ps3 sales in Japan are bad, what word would you use to describe the 360s sales there?

The point of the article is that multiplat makes the most sense and the fact that the 360 has exclusives from S-E can only be explained by M$ $$$

 



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Rei on 15 February 2009

Phoenix_Wiight said:
NiKKoM said:
Ehm.. Didn't all the talent left Square and went to Monolith (Soma Bringer FTW), Brownie Brown, Mistwalker.. and they were left with this Emo dude? >_> Isn't that the main problem of square?

 

yes, the main writers of the FF series left very short into the developement into FFXII (which is why it therefore was bad,) and made mistwalker

 

Oh really? Are you sure that you havent just made that up? No? Okay. So, who from the Final Fantasy XII team left Square and joined Mistwalker? Or should I ask - who other than Sakaguchi has left Square to join Mistwalker?

   And I am especially interested in hearing about these mysterious "writers" who, according to you, also left SE to join Mistwalker.

 



Dianko on 15 February 2009
Pristine20 said:
Dianko said:
Pristine20 said:
makingmusic476 said:
And I agree with those saying that making 360 exclusives was a stupid idea. Out of the five major platforms in Japan, the 360 has BY FAR the smallest install base.

And to the people saying those exclusives weren't moneyhatted... lol. SE may be dumb, but they're not THAT dumb. They certainly had at least some compensation for those endeavors.

 

 this is why many believe that moneyhats were involved. Not saying that thats a good or bad thing...it's just the thing.

Maybe the money M$ gave them far surpassed whatever profits they could make from a ps3 version. That and the fact that they're trying to westernize themselves as that's "where it's at" nowadays.

 

Well, what about the money that Sony must be paying SE? Afterall, PS3 sales in Japan are pathetic. Absolutely pathetic. And elsewhere, there is no reason FFv13 should be exclusive since there is an almost 10 million unit deficit between the 360 and PS3. And that's not even bringing the Wii into the discussion. There is an ongoing thread in 2ch gaming that I think expresses the situation fairly well. It translates roughly to "SE to Sony: "Hurry up and sell some fucking consoles already!", the implication being that SE has refused to release their big games on the PS3 due to the failure by Sony to sell the system.


Why is there a belief that a PS3 version is a given when it's not even in a good enough position to KEEP exclusives? And again, that's an argument against the PS3 and for the 360/mulitplatform. The Wii makes the argument even uglier.

You're funny. I'm pretty sure 2 years ago we all thought ffxiii was ps3 exclusive. FFvsxiii is not even set for release in 2010. 2011 at best and you don't think things can change before then LMAO. It's very unlikely that sony gave anyone money at this point. Have you read their balances lately?

You argue that ps3 sales in Japan are dismal yet accept the fact that a 360 exclusive for a heavily Japan-centric game makes sense. If ps3 sales in Japan are bad, what word would you use to describe the 360s sales there?

The point of the article is that multiplat makes the most sense and the fact that the 360 has exclusives from S-E can only be explained by M$ $$$

 

 

Read a few posts up, I explain my position. This post you're responding to was more of an devils advocate argument arguing that every position taken against the 360 can be applied to the PS3. I've answered everyone of the questions you have here, down to how I would describe 360 sales in Japan, in this thread.