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No he isn't. Just because some guy comes out of nowhere and starts claiming he is the prophet of Jehova and then dies for his belief doesn't make god real at all. It's as real as the creation of a satirical father who got pissed at his kid's school for being idiots (it wasn't from South Park). Just because there's a billion people believing it doesn't make him any more real. If I write you the Spaghetti Codex which would be the Bible of the Monster would that validate him more?



Tag(thx fkusumot) - "Yet again I completely fail to see your point..."

HD vs Wii, PC vs HD: http://www.vgchartz.com/forum/thread.php?id=93374

Why Regenerating Health is a crap game mechanic: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=3986420

gamrReview's broken review scores: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=4170835

 

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vlad321 said:
No he isn't. Just because some guy comes out of nowhere and starts claiming he is the prophet of Jehova and then dies for his belief doesn't make god real at all. It's as real as the creation of a satirical father who got pissed at his kid's school for being idiots (it wasn't from South Park). Just because there's a billion people believing it doesn't make him any more real. If I write you the Spaghetti Codex which would be the Bible of the Monster would that validate him more?

 

 Well, if you believed in my holy text, you would not think he came out of nowhere

I will disregard the rest because you are making no sense....  You are just preaching to me now.



And that's the only thing I need is *this*. I don't need this or this. Just this PS4... And this gaming PC. - The PS4 and the Gaming PC and that's all I need... And this Xbox 360. - The PS4, the Gaming PC, and the Xbox 360, and that's all I need... And these PS3's. - The PS4, and these PS3's, and the Gaming PC, and the Xbox 360... And this Nintendo DS. - The PS4, this Xbox 360, and the Gaming PC, and the PS3's, and that's all *I* need. And that's *all* I need too. I don't need one other thing, not one... I need this. - The Gaming PC and PS4, and Xbox 360, and thePS3's . Well what are you looking at? What do you think I'm some kind of a jerk or something! - And this. That's all I need.

Obligatory dick measuring Gaming Laptop Specs: Sager NP8270-GTX: 17.3" FULL HD (1920X1080) LED Matte LC, nVIDIA GeForce GTX 780M, Intel Core i7-4700MQ, 16GB (2x8GB) DDR3, 750GB SATA II 3GB/s 7,200 RPM Hard Drive

That "preaching" isn't actual preaching, it's appeal to logic, I'm sorry if you think it's on the level of what comes out of some religious leader's mouths.



Tag(thx fkusumot) - "Yet again I completely fail to see your point..."

HD vs Wii, PC vs HD: http://www.vgchartz.com/forum/thread.php?id=93374

Why Regenerating Health is a crap game mechanic: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=3986420

gamrReview's broken review scores: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=4170835

 

Strategyking92 said:
vlad321 said:
Strategyking92 said:
ManusJustus said:
Strategyking92 said:
I believe god exists because it is logical. Something cannot be created from nothing, unless it has always been.

Who created god?  So you say not everything has to be created.  Then why does the universe have to be created?

 

 Bolded: there ya go. Yes, My logic is a paradox, but some things just are

Underlined: Maybe god and the universe are intertwined. You know? Personally, I do not believe in the "big bang" theory. So alot of options are possible.

All I am saying is that science cannot explain, nor prove everything. People think they can explain everything away with it, but it isn't possible when you get close to the "god" issues.

 

No, they are not. I can prove to you that you will never be able to get to work/school or that every human on the planet ha equal amounts of money, that doesn't make those true. Science also can't prove or disprove The Flying Spaghetti Monster either, do you think it's real then?

no. But I can prove you watch south park at least occasionally. j/k

 You have to admit though, even if you don't, that god is far more likely than a spagetti monster. But he might have created one. You never know, science can't disprove it. But..... a noodle can't live.... unless it wasn't a noodle.... but a worm.... a Flying worm monster.... is that what you meant?

No, that's exactly the point. Both are equally likely (or unlikely), both contradict the laws of physics as we know them, there isn't one that's more "factible" than another. Let's use the probably very known, but always handy Russell's teapot:

If I were to suggest that between the Earth and Mars there is a china teapot revolving about the sun in an elliptical orbit, nobody would be able to disprove my assertion provided I were careful to add that the teapot is too small to be revealed even by our most powerful telescopes. But if I were to go on to say that, since my assertion cannot be disproved, it is an intolerable presumption on the part of human reason to doubt it, I should rightly be thought to be talking nonsense. If, however, the existence of such a teapot were affirmed in ancient books, taught as the sacred truth every Sunday, and instilled into the minds of children at school, hesitation to believe in its existence would become a mark of eccentricity and entitle the doubter to the attentions of the psychiatrist in an enlightened age or of the Inquisitor in an earlier time.

What differentiates God from the FSM? That one is a belief from ancient times and the other was thought by a guy three years ago as a medium of protest. If the FSM were the ancient one and God the three year old theory, you'd find the FSM believable and God's theory crazy




ManusJustus said:
Tispower1 said:

1. What about energy loss/entropy, surely eventually the universe would stop expanding, plus I seem to remember my physics teacher telling us that the rate at which the universe is expanding atm is increasing, which definately wouldn't fit with that theory, though unfortunately I have no idea what the source was on that! :(

2. According to atheistic beliefs the material universe is all there is, Christianity plus I'm sure other religions (!) accept that what there is around us isn't all there is, it isn't that weird to have a God who doesn't need a cause as he works outside of the constraints of a purely physical universe.

3. I was referring to many things people may make up nowadays. However, Jesus is a moot point given that even non-Christian primary sources from the period indicate he existed, rather than historical records (ie not stories/myths etc) indicating say Unicorns exist in modern times.

I'll try to comment on both posts.

1. If the universe stopped expanding it would collapse upon itself, perhaps eventually resulting in another Big Bang.  That is true, scientists believe the universe is actually accelerating away from each other, which would mean an repulsive force our the universe (Dark Energy?) or an attractive force outside of our universe.

Why cant time be infinite?  Are you suggesting that time will not go on forever, regardless of the shape that our universe is in?  I have more concern with infinite energy (omnipotent being) which would violate the laws the physics, not to mention that such a source would have an infinitely strong gravitational attraction.  I'm leaving out mention of the spiritual realm because, like other examples, there is no way to know if it exists and what properties it has.

2. But religious assumptions of a supernatural being outside of the physical realm is just that, assumptions.  Humans desire to understand the world around them, for the same reason (in my opinion) ancient humans created religion we create theories today about concepts we dont have a grasp of.  Dark energy, dark matter, accelerating universe, before the Big Bang, are concepts that we are not able to grasp with today's technology.  Hopefully, one day will we understand these phenomena, but it seems that the trend has always been science over religious belief, and thats not to mention some other silly scientific ideas too.

3. Jesus existing and Jesus being the son of God (or a manifestation of God, how this fits within monotheism confuses me) are two different things.  We also know that Mohammed and pharoah gods existed, for comparison's sake we have a lot more about them than Jesus.

 

No, I'm suggesting that the oscillating universe idea implies that an infinite amount of time has already passed, which is impossible.  I'm not saying that time couldn't keep going, I'm saying that we can't have crossed an infinite period of time.



Okami

To lavish praise upon this title, the assumption of a common plateau between player and game must be made.  I won't open my unworthy mouth.

Christian (+50).  Arminian(+20). AG adherent(+20). YEC(+20). Pre-tribulation Pre-milleniumist (+10).  Republican (+15) Capitalist (+15).  Pro-Nintendo (+5).  Misc. stances (+30).  TOTAL SCORE: 195
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appolose said: 

No, I'm suggesting that the oscillating universe idea implies that an infinite amount of time has already passed, which is impossible.  I'm not saying that time couldn't keep going, I'm saying that we can't have crossed an infinite period of time.

Why cant we have crossed an infinite amount of time?

By your own definition wouldn't God, who was not created, have been here for an infinite amount of time?  Or do you believe that time is not infinite and instead that God and time started at a certain point?



I can tell you this - I know He exists. I have had numerous visions - seeing things before they happen. I saw one where my mom died - and I prayed for her and wrote about her in my diary. Like a month or so later, my mom was nearly in a fatal accident. My bro told me she almost died twice - once an 18-wheeler going to the Grand Canyon swerved to avoid another car and missed my mom's van by inches - and it didn't shake. That same trip - on the way back down, a boulder nearly took out her van - and instead totaled a guy's Porsche.

My brother told me and I was relived. However, when I was moving out, my mom saw my diary and started reading it. And it happened to be on that entry. She just started reading, read she was going to die soon and confronted me. I told her 'Shoot, I prayed and the Lord said you would be ok.'

Another instance - I saw my wife, son and lil gurl back in 1998. I didn't recognize my wife - I thought the woman was a Hispanic woman, stacked - and a boy, about 7, and a girl about 4. And then, I saw myself. I was 38-39 but slim and hot.

Anyhow, I was coming back from Russia, and shocked - I was like 'Dang, my wife is hot - and I have two children!'

Now, 10 years later, I'm married, my wife is hot and I have two children - a boy 5 and my girl, almost 2. Not only I saw my wife, but accurately saw my children and their birth order.

No, I'm not a psychic, but I see things before they happen - sometimes. I saw doom a few times had I kept going the route I was going. Once, I saw me dying over Iraq after being shot down. Another time, right before I got with my wife, I saw I was married to this Latina and she died in my arms.

Lastly, it's too much going on that was predicted in the Bible that's happening now. I have been a Christian since 1992 and I can tell you, He'll change your life.

Romans 10:9 FTW!



ManusJustus said:
appolose said: 

No, I'm suggesting that the oscillating universe idea implies that an infinite amount of time has already passed, which is impossible.  I'm not saying that time couldn't keep going, I'm saying that we can't have crossed an infinite period of time.

Why cant we have crossed an infinite amount of time?

By your own definition wouldn't God, who was not created, have been here for an infinite amount of time?  Or do you believe that time is not infinite and instead that God and time started at a certain point?

 

For the same reason no one can count up to and past infinity.  For example, if the universe has been around for 6 hours, then that means the universe had gone through 6 hours of time.  If the universe had been around for an infinite amount of time, then that would mean that the universe had gone through an infinite amount of time.  And there is no way to get past an infinite amount of time, just as much as infinity can never be reached.

This problem does not apply to a postulated nonphysical being, however, because time is a property of the physical realm.  God has not had to endure forever because there is no forever, and no time at all, for him.



Okami

To lavish praise upon this title, the assumption of a common plateau between player and game must be made.  I won't open my unworthy mouth.

Christian (+50).  Arminian(+20). AG adherent(+20). YEC(+20). Pre-tribulation Pre-milleniumist (+10).  Republican (+15) Capitalist (+15).  Pro-Nintendo (+5).  Misc. stances (+30).  TOTAL SCORE: 195
  http://quizfarm.com/test.php?q_id=43870 <---- Fun theology quiz

screw it.. Guess I hate to break it to you... But we are in....


THE MATRIX!!!



End of 2009 Predictions (Set, January 1st 2009)

Wii- 72 million   3rd Year Peak, better slate of releases

360- 37 million   Should trend down slightly after 3rd year peak

PS3- 29 million  Sales should pick up next year, 3rd year peak and price cut

appolose said:
ManusJustus said:

Why cant we have crossed an infinite amount of time?

By your own definition wouldn't God, who was not created, have been here for an infinite amount of time?  Or do you believe that time is not infinite and instead that God and time started at a certain point?

For the same reason no one can count up to and past infinity.  For example, if the universe has been around for 6 hours, then that means the universe had gone through 6 hours of time.  If the universe had been around for an infinite amount of time, then that would mean that the universe had gone through an infinite amount of time.  And there is no way to get past an infinite amount of time, just as much as infinity can never be reached.

This problem does not apply to a postulated nonphysical being, however, because time is a property of the physical realm.  God has not had to endure forever because there is no forever, and no time at all, for him.

Essentially, what you are saying is that time in the spiritual realm can be infinite but time in the physical realm cannot.  God was hanging out in a spiritual realm for an infinite amount of time in the past and will be there for an infinite amount of time in the future, but for whatever reason this cant be for the physical realm.  Thats with the huge assumption that there is a spiritual realm.

I also fail to understand why time in the physical realm cannot be infinite.  Do you think that in the future, time will all the sudden stop and come to an end?