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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Xbox 360: Full Installation of Games to Take 10 Minutes, -30% Load Times

BottledSpringWater on 19 July 2008
Lone_Canis_Lupus said:
kowenicki said:
Why are install times so goddam slow on the ps3? its odd. I have only had my ps3 for a few weeks and my only gripe (now ive got a dual shock to replace that crappy sixaxis) is the installs!

 

Blu-ray 2x isn't as fast as DVD 12x. I expect disc drives to become faster just like they did with CDs and DVD though. Blu-ray 4x alone is faster than DVD 12x (there are already a few BD drives for PC with these read speeds). 18MB/s to DVDs 16.2MB/s. The PS2's DVD drive wasn't very fast at launch but became faster as time went on I believe. At least I notice faster load times on my friends slim as opposed to my fat PS2. Anyway, right now Blu-ray is slower, so the 360 will install faster. If something like 4x or faster transfer rates are implementend in PS3s disc drive before the end of the generation...then it will be faster than 360 installs.

 

EDIT: A lot of edits...updated information. I haven't had sleep. @.@

Can Blu-Ray 4x be implemented through a firmware update or is it a whoe new hardware scenario?

 



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iyLhpUPNPIs

360 IS OPERATIONAL AFTER 37 DAYS!

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Rock_on_2008 on 19 July 2008

I feel there are going to be a lot of X360 hypocrites who will be praising the installs. You guys all gave us PS3 owners crap about the installs.
I wonder who is going to be a backflipper on the install game option?



kingofwale on 19 July 2008

I'm waiting for IGN's testing number.

Remember last time Microsoft told us about "specs"??? How was that "Comparing Halo 1's graphics with Crysis"? ;)



Soriku (Feb 10/08): In 5 years the PS3/360 will be dead.

KH3 bet: "If KH3 comes to Wii exclusive, I will take a 1 month of sig/avatar by otheres open a thread apologize and praise you guys' brilliance." http://vgchartz.com/forum/thread.php?start=50&id=18379
Original cast: Badonkadonkhr, sc94597 allaboutthegames885, kingofwale, Soriku, ctk495, skeezer, RDBRaptor, Mirson,

Episode 1: OOPSY!
selnor: Too Human I even expect 3-4 mill entire life and 500,000 first day. GoW2 ( expect 7 - 9 million entire life and over 2 mill first day), Fable 2 (expect 5-6 million entire life and 1.5 mill fist day) BK3 (expect 4 - 5 mill sales entire life and 1 mill first day).. Tales/IU/TLR should get to 2 or 3 million! post id: 868878
Episode 2:
Letsdance: FFXIII (PS3+360) first week in NA = 286K
According to pre-order rate in week 13 (post id: 2902544)
Skeeuk on 19 July 2008
mrstickball said:

http://www.gamespot.com/features/6194093/index.html?tag=top_stories;title;1

One of the not-so-cosmetic changes in the fall update will be the ability to let you play your games directly from the hard disk. The new feature will let users install all of the game content directly onto the hard drive to improve game load times. Microsoft reports that it has seen a 30 percent improvement in load times in internal testing. As an interesting data point, Microsoft went out of its way to tell a group of reporters that the full Devil May Cry 4 hard disk installation took roughly 10 minutes on the Xbox 360. The installation took twice as long when we conducted our own installation tests on the PlayStation 3. Another side benefit of having games installed on the hard disk is reduced noise, since the optical disc no longer needs to spin up. However, you will still need to have the game disc in your optical drive while you're playing it, presumably as a piracy check.
 
 
Wow. Half the time it takes for the DMC4 installation on PS3, the entire thing is copied in full.
Beyond good news. That means that installing a multi-disc game isn't going to take very long. If this comes to pass, talking about whooping the PS3 in every imaginable way concerning installations & load times. This would certainly make the Xbox 360 gaming experience on certain multi-platform games the far more robust, and better experience, no?
 
 

this certainly is a good option for xbox 360, but what of people who have a core/arcade or the people like me who have a 20 gig HD?

if the touted standalone 60 gig HD costs around £69.99 and the standalone 120 gig is lowered to £100 - dont you think thats a complete rip off just for quicker load times?

just imagine installing lost oddesee on a 20 gig(overwhelming mojority of 360 users have this) lets rough it down to 7 gig per disc

7 gig installed on HD times that by 4 = 28 gig on the HD

it would not even fit on a 20 gig.

im sorry but i do not buy this, although a very good addition to the xbox 360 it seems to as if microsoft are trying to get people to shell out extra on hard drive upgrades.

although as some other users have stated, on some games it might benefit, like oblivion and dmc4 and others like mass effect.

 



...not much time to post anymore, used to be awesome on here really good fond memories from VGchartz...

PSN: Skeeuk - XBL: SkeeUK - PC: Skeeuk

really miss the VGCHARTZ of 2008 - 2013...

Retrasado on 19 July 2008
mrstickball said:
Retrasado said:
mrstickball said:
60GB will cost under $100. Rumored at $99 with extra XBL stuff.

slime - No one has said that it'll hurt the PS3. Just that this makes the whole installation issue vastly in favor of the Xbox 360.

theprof - It's kind of hard for a console to be near the end of it's life if it's successor hasn't been announced, nor is planned to be announced for another 2+ years, no?

No, it doesn't. It makes it the same for both the PS3 and the 360. The ONLY advantage to doing this is that now you don't have to listen to the 360's disc drive screaming like a 747 powering up for takeoff. You still have to wait for the game to install. This is the same as the PS3 except that the whole game is installing. Other than the disc drive stopping, this will do nothing but bring the game's load times down to the level that you see on modern PS3 games. If you think installing a game to the HDD will eliminate load times entirely, you are wrong. (try playing a few PC games) This feature is not going to bring the 360 significantly ahead of the PS3 because most newer PS3 games already have very low load times and the disc drive was never an issue for PS3 owners. It will give the 360 a slight advantage because load times will be lower than the PS3, but not by an incredible amount. I'm not trying to troll, but I think a lot of people are getting waay too excited about this feature. It will be nice, but it's not going to shift the balance of power very much, if at all.

 

Ok. Lets compare installations on both systems:

Xbox 360 Playstation 3
Optional Installation Mandatory Installation
-30% Load Time on All Games Unknown Benefits of Installation
Fastest Installation on all Games Installation Speed Varies by Game
Reduced Noise No Benefit
Reduced Wear & Tear on DVD No Benefit
4+ GB Installation Variable Installation

Now, maybe it's me, but having the OPTION on ALL GAMES to have a superior playing experience will always trump possible, and/or unknown benefits that are forced upon me, if I was a PS3 gamer. The only disadvantage of the X360 install is that your doing a full install, therefore more memory is taken up. Outside of this, the X360's installation procedure will be universally better. Every multi-platform game that has required mandatory installations on the PS3 have seen only a slight increase in preformance: I can only wonder what the advantage would be if a user installed the same game onto their Xbox 360.

Sony should adopt this strategy too, I think. Although the installation times and memory it takes up would be substantially higher than the X360, and maybe have slower load times (due to the fact that the same game will most likely take up more memory, therefore requiring longer access times), it's still a better idea than forcing you to do something.

My apologies for not being clear. I'm not saying it won't give the 360 an advantage over the PS3. (how can I say that? It sure as heck does. I too agree that Sony should do the same.) I'm just saying it's most likely not going to radically shift the balance of power toward the 360 anymore than Home will to the PS3. It's a great feature and I think all consoles that have HDDs should have it, but it's not going to really affect the console war that much imho.

 



Not trying to be a fanboy. Of course, it's hard when you own the best console eve... dang it

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DMeisterJ on 19 July 2008

Pre-E3: Installs only 4 comps.

After-E3: Installs, FTW!

Weird, no?



halogamer1989 on 19 July 2008
Retrasado said:
mrstickball said:
Retrasado said:
mrstickball said:
60GB will cost under $100. Rumored at $99 with extra XBL stuff.

slime - No one has said that it'll hurt the PS3. Just that this makes the whole installation issue vastly in favor of the Xbox 360.

theprof - It's kind of hard for a console to be near the end of it's life if it's successor hasn't been announced, nor is planned to be announced for another 2+ years, no?

No, it doesn't. It makes it the same for both the PS3 and the 360. The ONLY advantage to doing this is that now you don't have to listen to the 360's disc drive screaming like a 747 powering up for takeoff. You still have to wait for the game to install. This is the same as the PS3 except that the whole game is installing. Other than the disc drive stopping, this will do nothing but bring the game's load times down to the level that you see on modern PS3 games. If you think installing a game to the HDD will eliminate load times entirely, you are wrong. (try playing a few PC games) This feature is not going to bring the 360 significantly ahead of the PS3 because most newer PS3 games already have very low load times and the disc drive was never an issue for PS3 owners. It will give the 360 a slight advantage because load times will be lower than the PS3, but not by an incredible amount. I'm not trying to troll, but I think a lot of people are getting waay too excited about this feature. It will be nice, but it's not going to shift the balance of power very much, if at all.

 

Ok. Lets compare installations on both systems:

Xbox 360 Playstation 3
Optional Installation Mandatory Installation
-30% Load Time on All Games Unknown Benefits of Installation
Fastest Installation on all Games Installation Speed Varies by Game
Reduced Noise No Benefit
Reduced Wear & Tear on DVD No Benefit
4+ GB Installation Variable Installation

Now, maybe it's me, but having the OPTION on ALL GAMES to have a superior playing experience will always trump possible, and/or unknown benefits that are forced upon me, if I was a PS3 gamer. The only disadvantage of the X360 install is that your doing a full install, therefore more memory is taken up. Outside of this, the X360's installation procedure will be universally better. Every multi-platform game that has required mandatory installations on the PS3 have seen only a slight increase in preformance: I can only wonder what the advantage would be if a user installed the same game onto their Xbox 360.

Sony should adopt this strategy too, I think. Although the installation times and memory it takes up would be substantially higher than the X360, and maybe have slower load times (due to the fact that the same game will most likely take up more memory, therefore requiring longer access times), it's still a better idea than forcing you to do something.

My apologies for not being clear. I'm not saying it won't give the 360 an advantage over the PS3. (how can I say that? It sure as heck does. I too agree that Sony should do the same.) I'm just saying it's most likely not going to radically shift the balance of power toward the 360 anymore than Home will to the PS3. It's a great feature and I think all consoles that have HDDs should have it, but it's not going to really affect the console war that much imho.

 

They have to stick with the mandatory installs for now b/c of the slow 2x BR drive.  The only solution for Sony is to release a newer PS3 with a faster BR drive.  PS3 slim?

 



MinLo on 19 July 2008

I'm happy about the feature......
I bought an arcade version with the intent to buy a hard drive off craiglist or gamestop/eb games......

xbox Hd via Craigslist/EB games
279 + 50 = 329.00

save $20

I have a hdtv w/hdmi so the $20 would have been used for the hdmi wire that I bought for $23.00 including tax.

But now I'll hold off til the 60gb package comes out.

xbox 60gb package
279 + 99 = 379.00

but with the headset and xbox live for 3 months besides the fact if I had gone pro when I bought my arcade I'd only have the 20GB hd. I didn't have enough money to spend for the elite, so all in all I'm lucking out.

If went the used 20gb hd drive option I'd be paying $2.50/gb, where now I'll be paying $1.65/gb for the 60gb option. I don't really care about the headset but the 3 months of live only makes it better.

Hopefully the 60gb bundle will come out the same day Madden 09 comes out. lol



Squilliam on 19 July 2008
TheRealMafoo said:
DirtyP2002 said:

Sony Fanboys again and again.

  • You have to install almost every game on the PS3
  • This won't reduce load times significantly
  • You have the option, if you like to install on the 360 or not.
  • This will reduce load times significantly

THIS IS PS3-ADVANTAGE !!!111

I just don't get, why people can't say something good about another console. The PS3 is not my console of choice, but I don't say, that everything that comes with the it is bad. I can say it is reliable, it is quiet and not every game on it sucks. Why is there no Sony fan saying: "Hey, this option to install whether u like it or not is a good idea." or "the Netflix-deal sounds pretty cool" Believe me guys, it won't hurt you in any way.

 

 

I am a Sony fan, and I have said, and still think all those options of the 360 are awesome. I am very glad it's there. Where I take issue, is now when the 360 has installs, it's all the sudden a great thing. When it was just on the PS3, it was the dumbest thing ever done in console gaming.

Now because they are being hypocritical, there only saving grace is to cling onto the "mandatory" angle. Funny how that was never there main arguing point as to why not to do it.

Anyway, so no. I have no problems with the options. I think they are great! It's the fanboys I have a problem with :)

Assassin's Creed--------(Required) 1.3Gb
Battlefield BC------------(Required?) 0.3GB
Devil May Cry 4--------(Required) 4.83 GB
Dark Sector ------------(Required) 1.2 GB
GTA IV-------------------(Required) 3.3 GB
GT5 Prologue-----------(Required) 5.24GB
Heavenly Sword--------(Required) 2.1GB
Medal Of Honor:Airborne-(Required) 1.95 GB
MLB 08 The Show--------(required) 2GB
Metal Gear Solid 4--------(required) 4.0GB +(optional) 0.5GB for MG online
Oblivion GOTY--------------(Required) 5+GB
Ratchet & Clank Future-(Required) 0.42GB
Resistance: Fall of Man--(Required) 0.22GB
Skate ----------------------- (required) 2.6 GB
Virtua Fighter 5--------(Required) 2.34GB
Warhawk w/boosters-(Required) 1.1 GB
Warhawk w/o boosters(Required) 0.8GB

I removed the unpopular and niche games and the games that have optional install.

Devil May Cry 4 + GTAIV + GT5 Prologue + Metal gear sold kill a 20gb PS3. (17.7gb) 4 games that are popular and it is reasonable to expect that they could be in anyones collection.

Also the game install sizes are seeming to be trending upwards and this will affect greater numbers of 40gb PS3s and especially 20gb and that will be very annoying for people who will have to shuffle installing and reinstalling...

This is bad form for the Developers and Bad form from Sony to let this happen.

Full list - http://www.cheapassgamer.com/forums/showthread.php?s=46e53d151e914134324e0ad3036a69de&t=182682 

Thats the reason why Xbox360 owners are picking holes in the PS3 install policy. I don't call installing a bigger HDD a solution for 90% of people who would never do that, Its a bad thing and im glad I have a 60gb because long term those 40gb/20gb users are going to have issues. The biggest problem? It affects their best customers the worst as well... :(.

The Xbox360 installs are optional, so you don't have to install it and you can just pick up and play any title without worry. Shuffling installs on the PS3 are the things many people didn't want to do on the PC and the reason for even owning a console in the first place.

 

 



Tease.

Lone_Canis_Lupus on 19 July 2008
BottledSpringWater said:
Lone_Canis_Lupus said:
kowenicki said:
Why are install times so goddam slow on the ps3? its odd. I have only had my ps3 for a few weeks and my only gripe (now ive got a dual shock to replace that crappy sixaxis) is the installs!

 

Blu-ray 2x isn't as fast as DVD 12x. I expect disc drives to become faster just like they did with CDs and DVD though. Blu-ray 4x alone is faster than DVD 12x (there are already a few BD drives for PC with these read speeds). 18MB/s to DVDs 16.2MB/s. The PS2's DVD drive wasn't very fast at launch but became faster as time went on I believe. At least I notice faster load times on my friends slim as opposed to my fat PS2. Anyway, right now Blu-ray is slower, so the 360 will install faster. If something like 4x or faster transfer rates are implementend in PS3s disc drive before the end of the generation...then it will be faster than 360 installs.

 

EDIT: A lot of edits...updated information. I haven't had sleep. @.@

Can Blu-Ray 4x be implemented through a firmware update or is it a whoe new hardware scenario?

 

 

Most likley hardware. I doubt a firmware update would be able to increase the drive speed. That's one of the disadvantages of being an early adopter though. The PS2 had a slow drive at first too I think. I'll have to check into it but I'm pretty sure the slims load faster than the fats. Anyway, it wouldn't take much work to implement it into future PS3s. There are already PC Blu-ray drives that have 4x support. The problem is it will probably add onto the expense. So if they do implement it, it might be a year or two down the road. If it comes though, expect loading times on par and faster than 360 games. MGS4 and DMC4 installs will probably be a lot faster as well. There will also probably be a lot less mandatory installs as well in future games. Another advantage would be the drive would make less noise than 360s because 4x of course is 3 times slower than 12x.



PSN: Lone_Canis_Lupus