@ mariozeland

Uhh... no

MK Wii is one of, if not, Nintendo's biggest franchise. Don't try to downplay sales by saying it's a spin-off...

Nice try.

I think it is also important to note a couple of things:

1) The latest addition to the GTA franchise has been indisputably recognized as THE game of the year and one of the most anticipated games at that. Mario Kart is a great game, but GTA's popularity dwarfs Mario Kart's in comparison.

2) The marketing campaign for GTA was MASSIVE!!! I MEAN GTA WAS EVERYWHERE!!! I honestly saw very little advertising for Mario Kart (Advertisement costs money!!!! Lots of money)

3) The development costs for GTA compared to Mario Kart...do I need to say much more?

I think considering the circumstances..

(GTA is more popular, GTA received tons of exposure, GTA was very very expensive...and yet the Wii and Mario Kart still sold very very well)

Nintendo and Mario Kart did great against the BIGGEST GAME of 08!!!

Great Job Nintendo! It was also very balls-e of Nintendo to put Mario Kart up against GTA!!!!

Like many posters have said before me...Nintendo is doing a phenomenal job!!!

Played_Out said: twesterm said: I wasn't going to get into this and had only come to this topic to make sure it wasn't going to get nasty but I just have to clear this up: Mario Kart isn't Nintendo's most popular franchise, that would be Super Mario Bros. If you want to get nasty, it took two consoles to beat one Nintendo game that averages a good 10 points lower than it. Nintendo flooded the market? Yeah, they upped production but flooding the market is when you put A LOT of supply out there and then it just sits there. As long as Wii's move they aren't doing anything wrong. I could have swore I have seen interview after interview where Reggie says there is no mythical warehouse full of Wii's. I wasn't going to get into this and had only come to this topic in the hope that it was going to get nasty but I just have to clear this up: 1. Mario Kart and Super Mario Bros are both part of the same franchise. The clue is in the titles. Confusing, I know. 2. It didn't take both consoles. Both versions of GTA4 well and truly spanked MKWii. 3. No comment. 4. That's called a lie. It's what executives are paid to do. I'd just like to take this opportunity to remind the wii glory supporters that this is what Pachter predicted. He said the wii would dominate for 2 years before it's sales started to decline. Those 2 years are not yet up. Bubbles can burst.

 BINGO!

kingofwale said: twesterm said: kingofwale said: I don't see how this is viewed as a "HUGE failure" in PS360. We have PS360 number 1 game of the year vs Nintendo most popular Franchise game (mario kart) and we will see that GTA KILLED it. Sure, Nintendo did flood the market with their consoles for once. but why can't they do this earlier? WHy leave those in the warehouse when they could be in someone's home earlier where they'd buy another game or two? I wasn't going to get into this and had only come to this topic to make sure it wasn't going to get nasty but I just have to clear this up: Mario Kart isn't Nintendo's most popular franchise, that would be Super Mario Bros. If you want to get nasty, it took two consoles to beat one Nintendo game that averages a good 10 points lower than it. Nintendo flooded the market? Yeah, they upped production but flooding the market is when you put A LOT of supply out there and then it just sits there. As long as Wii's move they aren't doing anything wrong. I could have swore I have seen interview after interview where Reggie says there is no mythical warehouse full of Wii's.  nope, I don't intent what I said to be taken the wrong way. I was not an cheap shot at nintendo at all, I just didn't see it as an utter defeat on the part of HD console at all.  1.. I believe DD was the best selling game on GC? I could be wrong there. 2.. we have already established that Wii's owners don't care about game scores. 3.. I don't mean "flood" the market in term of "dumping", but comparing with the 700K it sold last monthing, shipping and selling more than half of that in 1 week is much more than what they normally ship. 4.. Well, I think the past week prove that there are warehouse full of Wii somewhere, there's no way that Nintendo just magically increased the production all the sudden.   To answer another's question. PS3's install base in NA. close to 5 million. Nintendo Wii's install base in NA. close to12 million. to have a GTAIV on PS3 outselling MKWii is a HUGE win for Sony as well as for GTAIV.

You know, you are talking about 2 franchises, from which other sold 40M on PS2 alone and the other has sold around as much in 15 years every platform combined. I think you do see the difference.
Now, GTA4 did have huge opening week, which was obvious, and so did Mario Kart Wii too (which was obvious too), alhough i would have expected MKWii to outsell GTA4 PS3 version in NA.
The thing is, that MKWii war obviously targeted to counter GTA4, which i believe it did with huge Wii supply, since PS360 hardware boosts were less than what i expected. Nintendo do know, that they can't do anything to GTA4, but what they can do, is to hit the competitions HW sales.

And wouldn't you, kingofwale, call button mashing "a dumbed-down removal from realistic aspect"? I was just wondering since one of your posts didn't make sense.

@OP: Not so much, but I'm not sure Forbes were thinking short term in that statement, and longterm has yet to be proven/disproven.
The odds are slim either way though.

I replied to the Forbes article. Now the author looks like he wrote a report about a book he didn't read.

Do people here actually think developers care about attach rates? noone except fanboys do, unless all the consoles have sold exactly the same amount as one another.. developers care about quantity of software sold.. it doesn't matter how many people they were selling it to.. if game x sold 5mil to a 100mil platform.. thats more of a profit than a game y that sold 2mil on a 3mil console.. attach rates mean nothing to a (normal) business

kingofwale said: Goodlife said: kingofwale said: because without smart implication, it's just another method of MINDLESS and REPETITVE motion?? In fact, I am also amazed that people would actually enjoy THAt type of 'appeal' Are you telling me you don't like mindless and repetitive motions??! Give a non-gamer a "normal" controller and say it's "A" to stab, C+D+A to stab while move, A+D to stab on the left etc and they will probably say "I'll just watch you play" Tell them there's no buttons, just stab with the remote to stab and more the remote round a bit to do other things, they will probably pick it up and have a go. I don't like anything mindless period, I want games that make you think, make you interested in the storyline or even care about the character you are playing. I have no problem with replacing buttons with actions. All I'm asking is... GIVE ME good, smart implimentation of Wiimote, Give me 1-1 motion and give me consistency. Frankly, other than a few odd games (MP3 or possibly Z&W), none of the games on Wii can claim that.

Lets see, off the top of my head some Wii games with good motion controls that I've played (not going to comment on anything I haven't actually had my hands on):

Dragonball Z: Budokai Tenkaichi 2 (haven't played 3 but heard they actually improved the controls)
Excite Truck
Warioware: Smooth Moves
Rayman: Raving Rabbids 2
Wii Sports
Elebits
Big Brain Academy: Wii Degree
Dewey's Adventure (while not the best game, the controls were good)
Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix
Mario Kart Wii
Mario Strikers: Charged
Metroid Prime 3: Corruption
No More Heroes
Resident Evil 4: Wii Edition
Super Mario Galaxy
Zack & Wiki

Yeah, there are only a small handful of Wii games that actually did a goot job of implementing motion controls.  I'm sure I missed a few other games I played and had good controls, but whatever, that's a good enough list.

Also, while GTAIV does have a good legs, I guarantee you anything with Mario in the title has better legs. But since the topic is So... did GTA IV dent the Wii's armor in America yet like Forbes said? the obvious answer is not in any way at all.

No, no, twesterm, it has to be ONE-ONE. kingofwale is fully capable of spending a good 2+ hours doing full body motions of his character's actions while watching the screen intently and not missing any cues. He won't get tired at all and he certainly wouldn't be part of a freakish ultraniche audience.

Seriously, kingofwale, if you want 1:1 controls, buy Wii Fit.

kingofwale said: twesterm said: kingofwale said: I don't see how this is viewed as a "HUGE failure" in PS360. We have PS360 number 1 game of the year vs Nintendo most popular Franchise game (mario kart) and we will see that GTA KILLED it. Sure, Nintendo did flood the market with their consoles for once. but why can't they do this earlier? WHy leave those in the warehouse when they could be in someone's home earlier where they'd buy another game or two? I wasn't going to get into this and had only come to this topic to make sure it wasn't going to get nasty but I just have to clear this up: Mario Kart isn't Nintendo's most popular franchise, that would be Super Mario Bros. If you want to get nasty, it took two consoles to beat one Nintendo game that averages a good 10 points lower than it. Nintendo flooded the market? Yeah, they upped production but flooding the market is when you put A LOT of supply out there and then it just sits there. As long as Wii's move they aren't doing anything wrong. I could have swore I have seen interview after interview where Reggie says there is no mythical warehouse full of Wii's. nope, I don't intent what I said to be taken the wrong way. I was not an cheap shot at nintendo at all, I just didn't see it as an utter defeat on the part of HD console at all. 1.. I believe DD was the best selling game on GC? I could be wrong there. 2.. we have already established that Wii's owners don't care about game scores. 3.. I don't mean "flood" the market in term of "dumping", but comparing with the 700K it sold last monthing, shipping and selling more than half of that in 1 week is much more than what they normally ship. 4.. Well, I think the past week prove that there are warehouse full of Wii somewhere, there's no way that Nintendo just magically increased the production all the sudden.   To answer another's question. PS3's install base in NA. close to 5 million. Nintendo Wii's install base in NA. close to12 million. to have a GTAIV on PS3 outselling MKWii is a HUGE win for Sony as well as for GTAIV.

Just to comment on your number 4, kingofwale, I got owned in the past for thinking the same thing as you. By Bruceongames even, now that hurt. But you learn from your mistakes.

From the information I got, consoles are normally shipped by boat, a slower mode of transportation, yes? For times that more systems will obviously sell, they fly over shipments. Hense, increased avaliablity at that time. And then, thats why you see smaller sales for a little while afterward. Normal shipments by boat are catching up.