sailordude said: well thats your opinion about graphics. about the ps3 failing... the ps3 is in a better position than the 360 was after a year of being out. more consoles moved and less failed systems. bottom line, more money made. and thats a weak arguement saying that oh if ps3 is so much better why doesnt it look better?! well ok let me explain it here, if you develop a game using 360's tools and hardware and port it over to the ps3 it never looks as good. of course not it was designed for the 360, completely different setup. the ps3 has proven itself. resistance was ps3's launch title and it was almost identical to Gears. like iv said before, little less shinny but the game was longer and less glitchy. about the 1080, ever heard of GT5P? im playing that in full 1080p and it looks DAMN good. another way to look at the situation is system life. you cant even argue that having bluray wont make ps3 last longer in this generation compared to 360. what about more recent games that have come out. before now most games have been a shitty port off the 360 and no one expected them to look any better but now games are starting to look better. COD4, GTA IV is a pretty good start for being two HUGE games. with future games coming out like MGS, GT5, resistance 2, motorstorm 2, killzone 2 which all look stunning, its hard to not say that the extra disc space and more powerful CPU wont put these games above the rest.

Its simple logic really, if it wasnt for the PS2 the PS3 would have fallen over and died. The developers have had to work and they've done a great job of bring the PS3 up to the Xbox360s level. GTAIV and CODIV don't even render at 720p! Great job Sony. I would trade that overpriced POS ahead of its time drive for an Nvidia g80 graphics chip with tweaks. You would change your whole outlook on the value of the PS3 with that chip. Sure it was forward looking on the drive front, but it was backwards looking on the GPU front. It was a mistake, its pretty much common knowledge that the Xenos is superior to the RSX though it came out over a year before. With compression and drive technology and a small install on every game you could certainly unpack those heavy sound and texture files onto the HDD so the DVD size wouldnt be as much an issue as you believe. The system cost $800 to produce when it came out, with a g80 it would have cost about $500 for Sony to make the system at launch. Then they could have priced it at $400 and kicked the Xbox360 out of the ballpark with truely superior graphics technology, im talking about twice as powerful what they have currently.

wow some fanboys really are spewing pathetic complaints...
why is it that you own a ps3 and then wanna bash another console so badly? I wonder how many people here are still in the 7th grade....

mztazmz said: Gnizmo said: From the forum rules: "Platform criticism. Posts slamming a particular platform without basis - be it a specific console, macs, windows, or anything similar - will not be tolerated. The forums are here for gamers of all persuasions, so unless you're in a thread specifically geared towards platform comparison/discussion, keep your anti-platform comments out of the thread. Note that there is a difference between having a reasonable argument in the correct thread and trolling." How the fuck has this topic gone this long without being locked? Seriously this is beyond sad. This is nothing more than a fanboy ranting about how the 360 suxxorz and the PS3 and Wii roxxorz.  "Platform criticism. Posts slamming a particular platform without basis -  do the 2 bold underlined words answer your question?   try reading the ENTIRE rule next time and see if it applies. and sorry the truth about M$ is too jard to swallow, just don't shoot the messenger

Your argument. Microsoft is the most unoriginal console maker ever. All someone has to do is prove that is not the case - Like for example, the Mastersystem was a complete ripoff of the NES by Sega. Your argument as no basis Therefore you violated the rules.

ookaze said: I agree with the OP. And I'm still amused when I see someone starts to discover what MS really is. Well, I'm not surprised, because unless you're affected by MS (which is always in a bad way when it happens), why would you look for information on this company? No need to wonder why MS entered the console biz. It's pretty clear. Basically MS succeeded a disruption (with BG cheating and screwing his own friends, blatantly stealing from others) at the IBM mainframe time, and since then, never got anything right anymore (except dirty business tactics), they never ever invented anything anymore, they just blatantly steal the work of other companies and put them out of business, and sometimes just buy them. So now, they've maintained the status quo through several dirty ways (like buying the law, which is most sad for the countries in which it happened) but the nature's forces are such that even if you make dirty alliances, they'll finally fall with you, as you will fall if you can't innovate. So they're attacked on all fronts, and they're losing badly since years. So they feel threatened by several disruptors, and Sony was one of those threatening their only cash cow, the one that originated on their one and only disruption : Windows and the services around it. Sony was talking about a computer in every living room: what a mistake to do when MS is a competitor. MS felt threatened, and had to react. They know they are a poor hardware company, and that's why at first, they decided to partner with Sega on their console. That's the day I knew Sega was dead. No MS partner ever comes out well from such a deal. They pretty much all are destroyed (or at least their product, which means the end for small companies with only one product). Hey, the latest I predicted was HD-DVD. As soon as I knew HD-DVD was MS' last hope to sneak in their poor codec as the main one for everyone, I knew HD-DVD was dead. To this day, I'm still wondering how come noone of these companies see what MS always does, it's as if they don't want to see what happens. But the game industry is starting to make me understand why this happens. BTW, XBL actually started as the software for the Sega console, when MS partnered with Sega. So like always, they stole what Sega made with them, and Sega died. And like always, "people" all forgot about where the technology originated from. And then we have thread like these where all the praise is attributed to MS for something they actually didn't invented. But that's not a first. A lot of people believe that MS invented lots of things in their OS, when nearly everything was actually stolen from elsewhere or bought (and the inventor destroyed). And they didn't lose $4 B, but actually $6.5 B in the XBox brand. I was also rather amused to read someone on this thread, for whom what gave value to his XBox purchase was that he could install XBMC, which is actually Free Software (or at least Open Source, but it's based on Free Software). So basically, XBox had value by the addition of something made by people that MS hate, that they see as their greatest enemy: Free Software. That was hilarious. Another example, is someone was saying that Halo was intended for the PC! WRONG! Halo was a Mac product before MS bought them so that they wouldn't make the game for Mac. MS is an amazing company really, they even copy dirty business tactics, like what they copied from the old IBM (IBM changed since then): vaporware, astroturfing, and shills. So I'm not surprised of the outcome for the XBox brand, really. Like I wasn't surprised about the Tablet PC, the Zune, Game for Windows, ...   Gamers are a special case though, and fortunately. Because gamers helped make Windows the success it is. At least, the Windows for desktop, as the others are failures too. But gamers are special, they can't let them down. They push the hardware, though now they can't push it enough anymore. So MS has a problem with Vista. But the console was the salvation. Consoles are less prone to piracy, but the problem MS had, was that with Sega dead, there was not a single console that used MS proprietary technology, Direct X. That would have made no sense, when free standards existed (like OpenGL, that MS nearly succeeded in killing, but once again, salvation came from Free Software), and when Free Software libraries existed too. So XBox brand is far more to MS than most people think it is. That's why they have to support it, even if they lose lots and lots of money. That's why Harvard's Christensen (who wrote universally and critically acclaimed economy masterpiece books like "The Innovator's Dilemna" or "The Blue Ocean Strategy") himself doesn't understand the business MS has with the XBox brand, which in his understanding is bound to fail, as it can't be sustained. MS has become a company whose move you can perfectly predict, as long as you observed them long enough, have some basic economy sense, and have some knowledge of the field they try to enter.

 Very smart and INFORMATIVE post!

 

It's too bad most of the people in this thread couldn't get halfway through your post without chokin on the truth

Didn't even know that stuff about Sega, but it makes perfect sense. M$ just ruins everything they touch. If it wasn't for the fact that Nintendo and Sony have a great track record with gamers, M$ probably would suceed at monopolizing the console business(what are disguting thought!)

Squilliam said: mztazmz said: Gnizmo said: From the forum rules: "Platform criticism. Posts slamming a particular platform without basis - be it a specific console, macs, windows, or anything similar - will not be tolerated. The forums are here for gamers of all persuasions, so unless you're in a thread specifically geared towards platform comparison/discussion, keep your anti-platform comments out of the thread. Note that there is a difference between having a reasonable argument in the correct thread and trolling." How the fuck has this topic gone this long without being locked? Seriously this is beyond sad. This is nothing more than a fanboy ranting about how the 360 suxxorz and the PS3 and Wii roxxorz. "Platform criticism. Posts slamming a particular platform without basis - do the 2 bold underlined words answer your question?   try reading the ENTIRE rule next time and see if it applies. and sorry the truth about M$ is too jard to swallow, just don't shoot the messenger   Your argument. Microsoft is the most unoriginal console maker ever. All someone has to do is prove that is not the case - Like for example, the Mastersystem was a complete ripoff of the NES by Sega. Your argument as no basis Therefore you violated the rules.

geta grip dude, you can't "prove" anything. whichever console in the history of gaming is to be deemed unoriginal, is totally subjective depending on how you look at it. 

it's pretty obvios you favor the 360 and i can see why my post offends you. strange that you want the post locked, but here you are still posting in it? if you don't like this thread then leave it. 

and it's no small wonder why M$ is copying Sony and Nintendo. The Wii is obviously killing the 360 and over the past few weeks the PS3 has outsold 360 in all 3 regions.

what really burns up the 360 fans is that the PS3 is outselling it even though it has "no good games" and the 360 has "so many great games". If the PS3 can outsell the 360 despite this, what's gonna happen when the PS3 gets it's good games???(like Metal Gear 4, God of War 3, Final Fantasy XIII, Final Fantasy versus XIII, and Gran Turismo 5)

it's going to kill the 360, and yes you can quote me on that

mztazmz said: Squilliam said: mztazmz said: Gnizmo said: From the forum rules: "Platform criticism. Posts slamming a particular platform without basis - be it a specific console, macs, windows, or anything similar - will not be tolerated. The forums are here for gamers of all persuasions, so unless you're in a thread specifically geared towards platform comparison/discussion, keep your anti-platform comments out of the thread. Note that there is a difference between having a reasonable argument in the correct thread and trolling." How the fuck has this topic gone this long without being locked? Seriously this is beyond sad. This is nothing more than a fanboy ranting about how the 360 suxxorz and the PS3 and Wii roxxorz. "Platform criticism. Posts slamming a particular platform without basis - do the 2 bold underlined words answer your question?   try reading the ENTIRE rule next time and see if it applies. and sorry the truth about M$ is too jard to swallow, just don't shoot the messenger   Your argument. Microsoft is the most unoriginal console maker ever. All someone has to do is prove that is not the case - Like for example, the Mastersystem was a complete ripoff of the NES by Sega. Your argument as no basis Therefore you violated the rules. geta grip dude, you can't "prove" anything. whichever console in the history of gaming is to be deemed unoriginal, is totally subjective depending on how you look at it.  it's pretty obvios you favor the 360 and i can see why my post offends you. strange that you want the post locked, but here you are still posting in it? if you don't like this thread then leave it.  and it's no small wonder why M$ is copying Sony and Nintendo. The Wii is obviously killing the 360 and over the past few weeks the PS3 has outsold 360 in all 3 regions. what really burns up the 360 fans is that the PS3 is outselling it even though it has "no good games" and the 360 has "so many great games". If the PS3 can outsell the 360 despite this, what's gonna happen when the PS3 gets it's good games???(like Metal Gear 4, God of War 3, Final Fantasy XIII, Final Fantasy versus XIII, and Gran Turismo 5) it's going to kill the 360, and yes you can quote me on that

You can't prove anything, and what was the point of all this? Just a rant on how you think the Xbox360 sucks... Wow! I favour the PC, I only support the Xbox360 because I decided to back "That horse". I could have as easily been a PS3 supporter. I think people like Starcraft, Mrstickball, etc influenced me there too. You made this thread because you're upset at the very existance of the Xbox360 console. Because it does harm to Sony that they are essentially splitting the HD market into two while the Wii gets away unopposed in its own niche. When FF13, GT5, GOW3, come out I will finally start using my PS3... But it will be 2009 and we don't know what games are coming out for the Xbox360 in that year yet. Don't you DARE say that they have no games coming out, because thats an absolute fallacy. It just shows a lack of imagination really. What really burns PS3 fans more, is the fact that the Xbox360 is still selling well and will continue to sell well for the forseeable future. This is inspite of NOT having Blu Ray or the Cell or even the mighty Playstation Logo. Thats what this thread is about really.

Squilliam said: mztazmz said: Squilliam said: mztazmz said: Gnizmo said: From the forum rules: "Platform criticism. Posts slamming a particular platform without basis - be it a specific console, macs, windows, or anything similar - will not be tolerated. The forums are here for gamers of all persuasions, so unless you're in a thread specifically geared towards platform comparison/discussion, keep your anti-platform comments out of the thread. Note that there is a difference between having a reasonable argument in the correct thread and trolling." How the fuck has this topic gone this long without being locked? Seriously this is beyond sad. This is nothing more than a fanboy ranting about how the 360 suxxorz and the PS3 and Wii roxxorz. "Platform criticism. Posts slamming a particular platform without basis - do the 2 bold underlined words answer your question?   try reading the ENTIRE rule next time and see if it applies. and sorry the truth about M$ is too jard to swallow, just don't shoot the messenger   Your argument. Microsoft is the most unoriginal console maker ever. All someone has to do is prove that is not the case - Like for example, the Mastersystem was a complete ripoff of the NES by Sega. Your argument as no basis Therefore you violated the rules. geta grip dude, you can't "prove" anything. whichever console in the history of gaming is to be deemed unoriginal, is totally subjective depending on how you look at it. it's pretty obvios you favor the 360 and i can see why my post offends you. strange that you want the post locked, but here you are still posting in it? if you don't like this thread then leave it. and it's no small wonder why M$ is copying Sony and Nintendo. The Wii is obviously killing the 360 and over the past few weeks the PS3 has outsold 360 in all 3 regions. what really burns up the 360 fans is that the PS3 is outselling it even though it has "no good games" and the 360 has "so many great games". If the PS3 can outsell the 360 despite this, what's gonna happen when the PS3 gets it's good games???(like Metal Gear 4, God of War 3, Final Fantasy XIII, Final Fantasy versus XIII, and Gran Turismo 5) it's going to kill the 360, and yes you can quote me on that   You can't prove anything, and what was the point of all this? Just a rant on how you think the Xbox360 sucks... Wow! I favour the PC, I only support the Xbox360 because I decided to back "That horse". I could have as easily been a PS3 supporter. I think people like Starcraft, Mrstickball, etc influenced me there too. You made this thread because you're upset at the very existance of the Xbox360 console. Because it does harm to Sony that they are essentially splitting the HD market into two while the Wii gets away unopposed in its own niche. When FF13, GT5, GOW3, come out I will finally start using my PS3... But it will be 2009 and we don't know what games are coming out for the Xbox360 in that year yet. Don't you DARE say that they have no games coming out, because thats an absolute fallacy. It just shows a lack of imagination really. What really burns PS3 fans more, is the fact that the Xbox360 is still selling well and will continue to sell well for the forseeable future. This is inspite of NOT having Blu Ray or the Cell or even the mighty Playstation Logo. Thats what this thread is about really.

You can't prove anything, and what was the point of all this? geez, this is really dfficult for you isn't it? the whole POINT is that you can't prove, one way or the other, that 360 is the most unoriginal console and therefore you can't prove that my post is without basis. i can't explain it any more clearly so if you're still confused, just drop it already.

you've really got quite a mouth there, too bad your intellect is superceded by it.

first you assume my opinion(which is really your opinion btw) - "Don't you DARE say that they have no games coming out", then you criticize the assumed opinion - "It just shows a lack of imagination really"

that's really pathetic. you put words in my mouth, then attack those words.

and it's totally ok for xbox fanboys too say that the PS3 has "no good games", even though Resistence, Motorstorm, Heavenly Sword, ratchet and Clank, Uncharted, and Unreal 3 are all good games. but how DARE i say the same about the 360's future games!!!(which i didn't even say)

please spare me this hypocritical bs.

the truth(which you'll most likely deny) is that it's all downhill for the 360:( Halo 3 is and always will be the biggest selling title the 360 has. GTA4 is doing equally well on both systems despite M$ thinking that the downloadable content was a nobrainer decision maker for consumers. Ninja Gaiden 2, Fable 2, and Alan Wake will sell well. Gears 2 will sell well but it doesn't have the advantage the first one did(it pretty much had no competiton).   

on the flipside, Metal Gear, Final Fantasy, and Gran Turismo games historically sell at least 5 million copies per game and will trounce the 360's coming titles. end of story.

now pretend this thread is locked as you want it to be, and go away. 

Unoriginal as the achievements than now sony is copying and not just the achivements but all the online game.

"You can't prove anything, and what was the point of all this? geez, this is really dfficult for you isn't it? the whole POINT is that you can't prove, one way or the other, that 360 is the most unoriginal console and therefore you can't prove that my post is without basis. i can't explain it any more clearly so if you're still confused, just drop it already" If YOU can't prove it then your whole thread premise falls flat. I think I gave a good example with the SMS vs NES, a pretty much straight copy. "first you assume my opinion(which is really your opinion btw) - "Don't you DARE say that they have no games coming out", then you criticize the assumed opinion - "It just shows a lack of imagination really"" Sorry, I've just heard too many times that the Xbox360 has no games in 2009, which is false. "and it's totally ok for xbox fanboys too say that the PS3 has "no good games", even though Resistence, Motorstorm, Heavenly Sword, ratchet and Clank, Uncharted, and Unreal 3 are all good games. but how DARE i say the same about the 360's future games!!!(which i didn't even say)" Perhaps you could say that it was errors on both sides of the table really. Besides I might think the Wii has no games because I like FPS games. Someone might counter and say look at X,Y,Z and we'd both be right. Since I don't like Metal gear but I love action games like GOW/Ninja gaiden im more impressed by the 360 in the month of June. "the truth(which you'll most likely deny) is that it's all downhill for the 360:( Halo 3 is and always will be the biggest selling title the 360 has. GTA4 is doing equally well on both systems despite M$ thinking that the downloadable content was a nobrainer decision maker for consumers. Ninja Gaiden 2, Fable 2, and Alan Wake will sell well. Gears 2 will sell well but it doesn't have the advantage the first one did(it pretty much had no competiton)." Its been uphill since Halo 3 - sales have shown this. Halo 3 may not be the biggest selling game on the system, there are a couple of years left and there will be a bigger userbase in the end. I would say that on Gears2 - It will be a really good game. Better than the first, you have Epic making it. Since you like UT3 it seems as you listed it, then you should realize that gears 2 will be quite a spectacle. If anyone can nail more performance out of the Xbox.. I would expect Epic could get the most. They have a software engine to sell as their no1 priority. The Xbox360 is about as original as the PS2 was compared to the PS1, an evolution of what worked in the first incarnation. Sony on that transition didn't do much apart from make it more powerful. They used the same controller, just specced up hardware in a larger system.

Shura said: Unoriginal as the achievements than now sony is copying and not just the achivements but all the online game.

 online gaming has been on the PC since 1993

 if you want to narrow it down to consoles, the dreamcast was the first one to do it(ookaze made a great post on this page about it) here's a noteworthy quote:

 BTW, XBL actually started as the software for the Sega console, when MS partnered with Sega. So like always, they stole what Sega made with them, and Sega died. And like always, "people" all forgot about where the technology originated from. And then we have thread like these where all the praise is attributed to MS for something they actually didn't invent. But that's not a first. A lot of people believe that MS invented lots of things in their OS, when nearly everything was actually stolen from elsewhere or bought (and the inventor destroyed).

nuff said

although i will give credit to M$ for acheivments. as far as i know, they were the first to do i. although i personally don't get what the big deal is, but i'm not an egocentric gamer like most people and i do admit that the feature is very popular.