i'm sorry but home might be the last thing I want to see on my console.... now I do agree a system like steam would be better... but home please..... I don't want a virtual 3D world... I think XBL is good enough like that... I already said that in the past if I want to play sim's I'll buy sim's lol

but the problem with XBL and MS it's they are already pushing devs to make achievements to have advance online capabilities etc and that for no extra cost for the game... so they can't really say hey guys how about you give us some cash so we can provide free servers for our gamers... where steam can do it as they don't ask anything special to the devs it's actually them who ask if they can use it...

I don't know, if a 'chump' can pull $5 a month easily, how can something so measly keep those annoying kids or even the same chumps who cause problems off the network? Regardless, there are going to be those annoying people, I don't even know why that needs to be brought up as I've heard the subscription of Xbox Live and the PS3's price as detractors to annoying people yet here we are seeing them everywhere.

For a subscription based MMO, how about FFXI? I guess you don't have to have a gold Xbox Live account for it, but it still costs money to play it and keep your character information stored (or whatever).

If the PSN suddenly becomes a charged service, I would seriously consider dropping my online games and just rent singleplayer games for the rest of this generation. Even then, what would they charge? Would it be like Xbox Live and screw me by telling me I have to pay them so I can be allowed to play my $60 game online?

I'm sorry if you're having trouble with Steam, but don't just tell me how much Steam or the PSN isn't good if you're only going to say something like "I don't like it, so don't bring it up!" as you're reasoning to say how much you like Xbox Live compared to Steam. Hell, all of our arguments here are our opinions so why not give some actual reasons.

Actually with Valve, EA is the publisher for the retail copies of Valve's games that go to the brick and motar stores I believe. EA takes care of the retail stuff and Valve, with Steam, takes care of the online transactions. This was a major issue with Valve with Vivendi when they created Steam, which led to them making the current agreement with EA.

Obviously the companies need money, but my problem with Xbox Live isn't that it costs money (which I don't care for anyway) as much as it is that I dislike having to pay just to be able to take game online or if we're talking about Windows Live, you'll be really gimped unless you pay them.

You can tell me all about it in a couple of years when you're delivering pizza to me.

If you want to get into games programming, get a CS degree from a real institution. 

You don't like home? That's fine because you don't have to use it :) And guess what? The people that do like home, the people that DO use it, make your online service free.

People always talk about how "together" live brings them, Sony's service not only brings you "together" you get an avatar, a house, and places to chill to be "together," Hell they're even giving us special/weird game extras and the PS3 equivalent to "Achievements." Thats perfectly fine if you don't want to use that type of thing, but don't knock a perfectly good idea. It will end up keeping the PS3 online experience free, and in my opinion better.

 So you are telling me you prefer having to pay for online. I wouldn't mind things as much if I didn't lag out 3 times while playing Halo last night. They need to work on getting dedicated servers before they give us features.

 yeah brings us together IN GAME.... even the lobby in halo is annoying me..... if i'm online to play it's no to chill with friends in a virtual 3D environement... if i'm not online to play but i have my XB on it's still not to chill with friends.... it's to play solo and i can still communicate with them... I really don't see the point of home.... it's like the 3D chats where you have house and an avatar if that was that bad ass and people really wanted that why is it not working better.... home is not new... it's just new on a console.... and IMO it's a useless fancy gadget 

and for illegalpaladin I have friends pulling more than 50 bucks a day just playing flute on public places.... so yeah 5 bucks a month anyone in western world can find a way to afford it... because any dumb ass on the planet can make 5 extra bucks a month.... hell you just have to take out the trash for your neighbors.....

saying I'm not playing online because you have to pay is a false excuse to blame a company... I'd charged even more if it was up to me to keep those kids out.. because trust me if it was 25 a month you wouldn't have the parents paying for it... and you'd have people motivated by online gaming which apparently you are not as you are not even willing to pay 5 bucks a month about 15 cents a day... come on people are you for real... no service should be free... well actually no service is free not even PSN.... it's just that they don't make you pay directly... but trust me you do pay for it lol.. it's just sony making even less money....

What's the next best thing to the 'hardcore' vs 'casual' argument, either you're worthy of playing online or not. Uh oh, some of us may not be 'real' online gamers because we don't feel the same way about things! I didn't say that I was blaming Microsoft because I don't want to pay for Xbox Live. In fact, I even complimented them on what they did for being able to take these features and put them in Xbox Live. I said that because I can do many, if not, all of the same things as I could if I paid for the subscription, I wouldn't pay for a 'superior' service.

oh my bad didn't mean that that way..... I meant that if 15 cents a day (which you can pretty much find on any walmart parking lot) is too much for someone it means that they are not interested in online playing because at that price tag it is wrong to say it's a psychological barrier for someone interested...

it be a really high price I could understand... but that price is surely not an arguable reason i'm sorry... I don't buy it.... when i hear people say they'd drop PSN if it is not free anymore means to me they don't really want it n the first place....