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Shaunodon said:
Ryuu96 said:

I guess it's just annoying when I post in support of the Union and then have defensive Xbox fans come in and tell me that I can't be mad about a game being cancelled because I never played it and therefore can't put any blame on Microsoft at all. And those same people will happily then believe the Perfect Dark rumours to jump to Xbox's defence in cancelling Perfect Dark, Lol.

It's hypocritical and quite honestly, comes across as fanboy defence. It's okay to criticise Microsoft, Lol.

I'm not talking about you BTW. 

When have you ever actually made some constructive criticism about the incompetent mishandling of Xbox division specifically which led to this point?

You constantly give the well paid Xbox executives a free pass as if they were all having to operate with a Microsoft accountant holding a gun to their heads.

You just want to blame a corporation for behaving in the same way corporations have always behaved. If Xbox was run well and successful, they would be protected and the people's jobs would be protected.

Lol. What the fuck are you talking about? Would be cool if you actually read the thread once in a while.

1. Last year I said Phil Spencer should step down after the first mass layoffs and closures.

2. Two weeks ago when the next mass firings happened I once again said Phil Spencer should step down, I blasted him a lot and said how can he show his face to his employees, I said that he has let them down, I said that it is partially his fault for his stupidly high promises made to Satya, I said that he's going to look like a dick celebrating Xbox's 25th anniversary in 2026 after he's just slashed thousands of employees, I said that I don't really want to see him in the celebrations, I've long said that his Game Pass target of 100m+ was stupid, I said that he has broken the trust of his employees.

3. I shit talked Matt Booty a lot during the firings two weeks ago and put a ton of blame on him, I also said that he needs to be fired, multiple times, I pinned a lot of blame of the Perfect Dark situation on him, I repeatedly questioned how the fuck that happened and said anyone else would be fired, I said it was a massive fuck up on his part, again, I straight up called for this guys firing, not just a step down, I said he should be fired.

Try reading my posts next time bud, I've thrown blame at Phil, Matt and Satya.

If Xbox was run well and successful, they would be protected and the people's jobs would be protected.

This part is complete nonsense and naivety though, we know already that Microsoft Gaming is profitable, many of the studios hit are profitable, we know for a fact that Rare is profitable, we know that Zenimax is profitable, we know that King is profitable, we know that Game Pass is profitable, etc. They weren't hit by layoffs because they're unprofitable, they were hit by layoffs to make even more profits and to divert cash into AI (as confirmed by the Seattle Times, I wasn't just saying this for the sake of it, it was literally confirmed by a reputable newspaper).

And practically every American company does mass layoffs lately, despite all making huge profits, they're often planned around the start or end of a fiscal year, Microsoft is notorious for it and been doing it for years now, it wasn't just Microsoft Gaming that was hit, it has been practically every division in Microsoft, are you about to tell me that Microsoft isn't ran well and is unsuccessful? These types of layoffs are done to increase shareholder prices and bump up fiscal profits a tad more to beat previous records.

Last edited by Ryuu96 - on 15 July 2025

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Ryuu96 said:
Shaunodon said:

When have you ever actually made some constructive criticism about the incompetent mishandling of Xbox division specifically which led to this point?

You constantly give the well paid Xbox executives a free pass as if they were all having to operate with a Microsoft accountant holding a gun to their heads.

You just want to blame a corporation for behaving in the same way corporations have always behaved. If Xbox was run well and successful, they would be protected and the people's jobs would be protected.

Lol. What the fuck are you talking about? Would be cool if you actually read the thread once in a while.

1. Last year I said Phil Spencer should step down after the first mass layoffs and closures.

2. Two weeks ago when the next mass firings happened I once again said Phil Spencer should step down, I blasted him a lot and said how can he show his face to his employees, I said that he has let them down, I said that it is partially his fault for his stupidly high promises made to Satya, I said that he's going to look like a dick celebrating Xbox's 25th anniversary in 2026 after he's just slashed thousands of employees, I said that I don't really want to see him in the celebrations, I've long said that his Game Pass target of 100m+ was stupid, I said that he has broken the trust of his employees.

3. I shit talked Matt Booty a lot during the firings two weeks ago and put a ton of blame on him, I also said that he needs to be fired, multiple times, I pinned a lot of blame of the Perfect Dark situation on him, I repeatedly questioned how the fuck that happened and said anyone else would be fired, I said it was a massive fuck up on his part.

Try reading my posts next time bud, I've thrown blame at Phil, Matt and Satya.

If Xbox was run well and successful, they would be protected and the people's jobs would be protected.

This part is complete nonsense and naivety though, we know already that Microsoft Gaming is profitable, many of the studios hit are profitable, we know for a fact that Rare is profitable, we know that Zenimax is profitable, we know that King is profitable, we know that Game Pass is profitable, etc. They weren't hit by layoffs because they're unprofitable, they were hit by layoffs to make even more profits and to divert cash into AI (as confirmed by the Seattle Times, I wasn't just saying this for the sake of it, it was literally confirmed by a reputable newspaper).

And practically every American company does mass layoffs lately, despite all making huge profits, they're often planned around the start or end of a fiscal year, Microsoft is notorious for it and been doing it for years now, it wasn't just Microsoft Gaming that was hit, it has been practically every division in Microsoft, are you about to tell me that Microsoft isn't ran well and is unsuccessful? These types of layoffs are done to increase shareholder prices and bump up fiscal profits a tad more to beat previous records.

'Profitable' doesn't always mean 'successful'. If Microsoft believes those resources have a higher potential return in another division while the growth in Xbox has stagnated, why do you think they wouldn't cut their losses?

Critisicism about Xbox leadership isn't down to just one or two guys, the whole division has been clearly lacking a single person that actually undestands the current landscape. They've needed a complete cleanout for a long time now, but you always speak under the impression if they just get rid of a couple key guys, everything will suddenly smooth out again.

The only thing current Xbox leadership knows how to do is spend money and sell lies. It's been that way for two generations. Getting rid of Don for Phil didn't change that, getting rid of Phil for Sarah won't change that.

You keep talking with the short-sighted mentality that a fresh face will make a difference, what they need(ed) is an actual clue of what they're trying to sell.



Pretty sure I also criticised Phil for the closure of Arkane Austin and Tango Gameworks but I went softer on Tango because they ended up not closing them and just spinning them off which I don't mind because at least the studio is still alive, but it didn't stop me from criticising their excuse for initially closing Tango Gameworks which was that they were spread too thin.

I'm pretty sure I criticised Microsoft as a whole for bullshitting to the courts during the ABK trial too but I actually forgot what exactly I accused them of lying over but I'm sure if you go back two weeks you can find it, Lol. But every time I criticise Microsoft/Xbox I don't have to specifically type out every single executives name, it should be obvious I'm talking about leadership in both departments. Whatever I accused them of bullshitting to the courts about, it would have applied to all of them, Lol.

Criticising Xbox/Microsoft leadership harshly has been something I've been very consistent about when it comes to layoffs and closures and has always been my redline, some may think I go too extreme with it, I'm not sure how you can look at me saying to straight up fire Matt Booty and say that I'm being too kind towards Xbox executives, Lmfao.



Shaunodon said:
Ryuu96 said:

Lol. What the fuck are you talking about? Would be cool if you actually read the thread once in a while.

1. Last year I said Phil Spencer should step down after the first mass layoffs and closures.

2. Two weeks ago when the next mass firings happened I once again said Phil Spencer should step down, I blasted him a lot and said how can he show his face to his employees, I said that he has let them down, I said that it is partially his fault for his stupidly high promises made to Satya, I said that he's going to look like a dick celebrating Xbox's 25th anniversary in 2026 after he's just slashed thousands of employees, I said that I don't really want to see him in the celebrations, I've long said that his Game Pass target of 100m+ was stupid, I said that he has broken the trust of his employees.

3. I shit talked Matt Booty a lot during the firings two weeks ago and put a ton of blame on him, I also said that he needs to be fired, multiple times, I pinned a lot of blame of the Perfect Dark situation on him, I repeatedly questioned how the fuck that happened and said anyone else would be fired, I said it was a massive fuck up on his part.

Try reading my posts next time bud, I've thrown blame at Phil, Matt and Satya.

If Xbox was run well and successful, they would be protected and the people's jobs would be protected.

This part is complete nonsense and naivety though, we know already that Microsoft Gaming is profitable, many of the studios hit are profitable, we know for a fact that Rare is profitable, we know that Zenimax is profitable, we know that King is profitable, we know that Game Pass is profitable, etc. They weren't hit by layoffs because they're unprofitable, they were hit by layoffs to make even more profits and to divert cash into AI (as confirmed by the Seattle Times, I wasn't just saying this for the sake of it, it was literally confirmed by a reputable newspaper).

And practically every American company does mass layoffs lately, despite all making huge profits, they're often planned around the start or end of a fiscal year, Microsoft is notorious for it and been doing it for years now, it wasn't just Microsoft Gaming that was hit, it has been practically every division in Microsoft, are you about to tell me that Microsoft isn't ran well and is unsuccessful? These types of layoffs are done to increase shareholder prices and bump up fiscal profits a tad more to beat previous records.

'Profitable' doesn't always mean 'successful'. If Microsoft believes those resources have a higher potential return in another division while the growth in Xbox has stagnated, why do you think they wouldn't cut their losses?

Critisicism about Xbox leadership isn't down to just one or two guys, the whole division has been clearly lacking a single person that actually undestands the current landscape. They've needed a complete cleanout for a long time now, but you always speak under the impression if they just get rid of a couple key guys, everything will suddenly smooth out again.

The only thing current Xbox leadership knows how to do is spend money and sell lies. It's been that way for two generations. Getting rid of Don for Phil didn't change that, getting rid of Phil for Sarah won't change that.

You keep talking with the short-sighted mentality that a fresh face will make a difference, what they need(ed) is an actual clue of what they're trying to sell.

Microsoft has done that to every division though, AI currently has the higher potential return in their minds and so they've made layoffs in every department, it doesn't mean they're all unsuccessful, it just means they want more money and AI is the current trend. Last year they laid off 1,500 employees from their Azure division and Azure is one of their most successful units, Lol.

Growth in Microsoft Gaming hasn't stagnated, we can see that from the recent fiscal quarters, the only thing declining is Hardware but everything else is up, sometimes even beating their projections, they've singled out Microsoft Gaming multiple times in recent quarters as being the reason for growth in profits in their overall "More Personal Computing" division which includes Windows and Devices, Windows OEM licensing, Surface, PC Accessories, HoloLens, Gaming, Search and News Advertising, etc. If Microsoft Gaming is the reason for profit growth in that area then it is not stagnating.

Also we can see from NPD's recent reports that Subscription Spending has been notably increasing every single month since CoDs inclusion into Game Pass, before that Subscription Spending had stagnated, now obviously this includes other Sub services but I think it's pretty damn safe to say that a decent chunk of it is due to Game Pass spending growth.

They're also starting their porting initiative which will result in a lot of growth, they've dominated this quarter via software as per NPD and it's almost guaranteed they're about to show a record quarter and this is without including the layoffs because the layoffs won't be calculated in Q4 as they happened at the start of the Fiscal Year therefore they will only show up in Q1.

I don't agree that every single person in the entire Gaming division is to blame and lack vision, I don't agree with firing every single executive position inside of Microsoft Gaming, a complete cleanout would just result in Satya shutting down the division, ain't no chance anyone will do that. Plenty of brilliant Xbox studios guys who could step up to the plate too, I've been an advocate of Feargus Urquhart taking over Matt Booty's position. But again, Microsoft Gaming is far from failing.

If anything, Satya will probably keep Phil and Matt around because they're yes men, he tells them to fire people to pump up the stock and save some money for AI and Phil/Matt say "How much?" without any struggle, anyone who did refuse to follow the orders of their CEO would probably end up fired anyway, and they'll likely be mass layoffs under any MS CEO because Satya is a cutthroat CEO who has been doing mass layoffs for years now.



I do pin blame on Phil Spencer and Matt Booty as pointed out but at the same time, I do think trying to push the blame entirely towards them, that the layoffs happened because apparently Microsoft Gaming is a failing business unit, also absolves Satya and Microsoft of some of the blame, it pushes away from the simple matter that this is pure corporate greed.

1. We have reputable newspapers reporting that the layoffs were to push money towards AI. We know Satya just earmarked like $80bn towards AI spending for 2025. Microsoft choosing to invest their money in what they think is a bigger money maker does not mean other divisions (again, Xbox wasn't the only one hit) are failing, it just means they want to make more money and faster, Lol.

2. Zenimax Online Studios and King were both hit awful, King despite being massively profitable had layoffs in the hundreds so that they could replace the workers with AI. Zenimax despite being one of the most profitable studios across XGS and Zenimax (excluding ABK) was hit massively. TESO even just charted in Xbox's May 2025 NPD somehow and has consistently been a strong seller on Steam for like 5+ years straight.

3. Rare was hit badly despite being a profitable studio (look it up, it's public information required by UK law), Sea of Thieves like TESO consistently sells well and they recently ported it to PlayStation 5.

4. Game Pass is confirmed profitable, in addition, according to NPD, Subscription Spending has notably increased every month since CoD was added into Game Pass, before then it was stagnate and in May it just had a huge boost. I'll say the caveat again that Subscription Spending includes all Console Subs but it doesn't take a genius to make an educated guess that Game Pass would be a significant contributor to that increase.

5. Microsoft Gaming was confirmed profitable even before they acquired ABK (Phil said in the low single digits, I assume he means billions because $1m would be ridiculous, Lol). ABK itself as a public company was profitable ranging from $1 to $3bn and their operating margin was in the ranges of 20-30%. Integration costs took away ABK's profit but that should be over now.

6. Microsoft literally JUST started their porting initiative which would result in a notable increase in their revenue, some titles have sold millions already, they've dominated the NPD software chart, Oblivion Remaster was a massive hit and already the 2nd best selling game of 2025. They're almost certain to report a record breaking Q4 and this won't include cost savings of the layoffs.

7. Microsoft has consistently reported Xbox revenue growth for the past multiple quarters, they've sometimes beaten projections recently and have been singled out multiple times as their profit margins having notable increases, the Microsoft Gaming division has been praised as being the reason for profits increasing in "More Personal Computing" too.

8. PC Game Pass has experienced large growth recently, Xbox Cloud Gaming has set new records last quarter.

Ain't really anywhere Microsoft Gaming isn't growing aside from the Hardware but even that plummeting isn't enough to hurt the overall division's growth. There are things where failures are seen such as Turn 10's Forza Motorsport clearly underperforming and The Initiative/Perfect Dark's complete development fuck up but the rest can't be contributed to failings (King/Zenimax/Rare) and the overall division is healthy and growing by a notable amount. There's a few failings on Phil and Matt's side, but there's also just the fact that a lot of it just comes down to pure greed from Microsoft.

Last edited by Ryuu96 - on 15 July 2025

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Some Stats For The Above Statements - NPD.

  • October - 16% Growth in Non-Mobile Subscription Spend
  • November - 8% Growth in Non-Mobile Subscription Spend
  • December - 11% Growth in Non-Mobile Subscription Spend
  • January - 13% Growth in Non-Mobile Subscription Spend
  • February - 9% YoY Growth in Non-Mobile Subscription Spend
  • March - 11% YoY Growth in Non-Mobile Subscription Spend
  • April - 18% YoY Growth in Non-Mobile Subscription Spend
  • April - 29% YoY Growth in Non-Mobile Subscription Spend

Subscription Spending was stagnate before October.

NPD Software Domination in May

Most Recent Quarter

  • Xbox Cloud Gaming hit record numbers in usage.
  • PC Game Pass revenue grew 45% year-over-year.

If you're wondering about how Xbox did this past quarter, it beat Microsoft's expectations

[image or embed]

— John Welfare (@johnbp.bsky.social) 30 April 2025 at 22:11

Likely to have a record breaking Q4 (even if they didn't have ABK).

Xbox Gaming Contributed and Helped Increase The Profitability of Microsoft's More Personal Computing Segment

Gross margin increased $898 million or 13% driven by growth in Gaming, Search and news advertising, and Windows and Devices. Gross margin percentage increased driven by sales mix shift to higher margin businesses and improvement in Gaming and Search and news advertising.

FY25 Q2 - More Personal Computing Performance - Investor Relations - Microsoft

Gross margin increased $623 million or 9% driven by growth in Search and news advertising and Gaming. Gross margin percentage increased driven by improvement in Search and news advertising and Gaming.

FY25 Q3 - More Personal Computing Performance - Investor Relations - Microsoft



Basically I'm 50/50 on the blame, I'd pin Turn 10/Forza Motorsport and The Initiative/Perfect Dark on Xbox management, and I've gone as far to say that Matt should be fired for Perfect Dark at a minimum and I'm angry at Phil too and said he should step down, it's clear these are less about greed and more about management fuck ups, Forza Motorsport underperformed after a lengthy development and released in an inadequate state, Perfect Dark was in development hell for like 6-7 years straight, Lol.

When it comes to King and Zenimax, I'm very comfortable in saying both those came down to pure corporate greed.

Rare and Everwild I'm not sure on because barely anyone has reported on the state Everwild was in recently, but we did hear positive things from Andy Robinson, and I don't think it was worth losing Gregg Mayles and Louise O'Connor who both largely contributed to giving Microsoft a huge hit with Sea of Thieves and are pillars of Rare, especially since Gregg Mayles only took over the project a few years ago and from the sounds of it, he basically took over a concept, an idea only, and fuck all else was done because the previous director left before he even came up with an idea, Lol. It basically sounds like Gregg took over nothing more than a name and an art-style.



Just saying. Nintendo has not done layoffs. They are hiring. All those studios Nintendo works with, like Grezzo. Intelligent Systems. Nintendo first-party studios like Monolith are also hiring. Nintendo's higher-ups took a pay reduction to avoid layoffs. Using the excuse Oh this is how corps work, why get upset? It is a lazy argument. It doesn't have to be that way. The most successful company on consoles right now is proving there is a better way and still makes money.



Bite my shiny metal cockpit!

Leynos said:

Just saying. Nintendo has not done layoffs. They are hiring. All those studios Nintendo works with, like Grezzo. Intelligent Systems. Nintendo first-party studios like Monolith are also hiring. Nintendo's higher-ups took a pay reduction to avoid layoffs. Using the excuse Oh this is how corps work, why get upset? It is a lazy argument. It doesn't have to be that way. The most successful company on consoles right now is proving there is a better way and still makes money.

Nintendo aren't a mega-corp, they are solely a gaming and entertainment company, always have been. That's the reason I trust them over Xbox and PlayStation. They don't have corporate overlords holding their reigns. Xbox will innevitably have to answer to Microsoft whether we like it or not.

After the failure of the Xbox One and barely recovering their image towards the end, Xbox division was given a crap load of funds and freedom to bounce back this gen. Instead it's been far worse. This is just reality now.



Angelus said:
Ryuu96 said:

I'm 90% of the time the one arguing with others about being negative all the time too, Lmao. It's not like I've a habit of being overly critical, but the one time I am, I have people saying I can't be critical, I can't be mad at Microsoft, I can't be upset about things being cancelled, it feels like a low-key "get over it" after a less than a few weeks and people just wanting to move away from having to hear criticism directed towards Microsoft, I'm sorry but I'm going to be critical for a while, blame Microsoft for being screw ups. I'll still post about games I'm enjoying, Lol.

I will continue to talk shit about AI and I will continue to talk shit about layoffs and greedy corporations and if you want regulation then you ought to be talking shit about AI alongside me and spreading it far and wide, don't just accept it as an inevitably, call out these companies for using AI to replace workers or creating soulless slop and treating employees like shit, Lol.

I didn't say any of that actually

I said you're yelling at a cloud for moving with the wind. In a room of 10 people that can't change it any more than you can. I don't like people losing their jobs their jobs either. I think AI is gonna lead us to confronting some pretty serious issues that we as a society have shown to be VERY bad at dealing with at the best of times, and utterly inept at the worst of them. You're just fixated on a microcosm, while underselling the actual problem because you're determined to just say "fuck this." 

Your particular brand of bitching about this is going to accomplish exactly nothing, and if someone goes away from here and parrots your nonsense all they're taking away from that, at best, is "oh wow, guess MS is really dumb for betting this hard on AI. Guess that's gonna really bite them in the ass, cus it sure sounds shit. Can't ever replace good hard working folk, no sir..."

Cool. Definitely getting the right point across there. But it's ok, right? Cus AI is overhyped. Not a big deal overall, really. Just MS are kinda being dickheads about it atm. They'll get over it after it loses them a bunch of money in the long run and we keep talking about what asses they are for going down this road.

It's actually a legend that was spread by Reagan and Thatcher and took some time to take root. But by now I see it everywhere: "it is like it is, we can change nothing". I think differently. Society is formed and shaped by people and we could change the economic, societal and political system, if we wanted. AI is just a technology, but how it affects people is up to us, shaped by decisions we make. Or you know powerful people if we let us lull into a sense that it is "above our paygrade". So yeah, I don't know about the yelling at clouds stuff. Maybe we are the wrong target audience for Ryuu's yelling, but I don't think the yelling itself is pointless.



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