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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Nintendo's success with the Switch both a blessing and a curse?

d21lewis on 13 December 2019
Shadow1980 said:
If you look at the history of console sales, the release of one system from another brand has never had any impact on sales of a console from another brand, either from the same generation (for offset releases) or from a previous generation. Despite Sega claiming to do "What Nintendon't," the release of the Genesis had no effect on NES sales. The release of the PS1 had no effect on SNES sales. The release of the Dreamcast had no effect on PS1 sales, and the release of the PS2 had no effect on Dreamcast sales. The release of the 360 had no effect on PS2 sales. And the Switch had no effect on PS4 or XBO sales. There is absolutely no reason to expect the PS5 and XSX (that's the abbreviation I'm sticking to for now) to have any effect on Switch sales.

In fact, the only time a console's sales are effected by a release of another console is when its own successor debuts. While every system experiences a growth-peak-decline life cycle, the "decline" part tends to accelerate once a system is replaced by another system from the same brand. The only system that will have any obvious effect on Switch sales is the Switch's successor.

The console market is not a zero-sum game. The existence of many people who own various combinations of Nintendo, PlayStation, and Xbox consoles attests to that (I personally have owned nearly every major console ever; the only ones I never owned were the Master System, TG-16, Saturn, and PS3). And the Switch offers a substantially different experience that what Sony and MS offer (as did the Wii and Wii U before it). PlayStation and Xbox are powerful, conventional home consoles focused on big-budget high-fidelity AAA games. The Switch meanwhile is a less powerful console-handheld hybrid, where you can switch between playing on your TV or playing on the go (and now it has a purely handheld SKU). As a result it gets very few third-party AAA titles (you can count the number of major third-party multiplatform titles that also came to Switch on your fingers). But that's not a problem as most people buy Nintendo consoles primarily for Nintendo games. The lack of meaningful large-scale AAA third-party support has not been and will not be a hindrance to Nintendo systems, the Switch included. Nintendo has missed out on most major third-party titles since Gen 7, but that didn't stop the Wii from being popular, it wasn't the reason the Wii U failed, and it hasn't kept the Switch from being a success.

Excellent post!! 



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scottslater on 13 December 2019
Alistair said:

A 5 watt APU based on 2014's mobile tech is not a home console. It really shouldn't even be an argument. Add a dock to the Vita and you had the same thing. Personally the Wii U was a great console for me. If I look at the Switch, outside Mario Odyssey, nothing was new on the system for the first few years. The Gamecube to Wii transition was more exciting than the Wii U to Switch transition (20 years with only 2 power levels, only Nintendo). Would like modern mobile tech or a console based on the weakest current GPU, the 1650 Super. That's all. If Nintendo can't even do that, I'll be supporting emulators with my money, not buying another Switch (which I already sold after beating Mario Odyssey). If Nintendo wants to nip the emulator community in the bud, they can start with a decent home console. Nintendo is losing 10+ million of their life long fans with the Switch, and you can't ignore that the Switch's success is mainly the people who bought the 3DS. I have several friends with a Wii U who have bought the Switch and are less than impressed.

Except it is a home console that just happens to have better portability... otherwise you wouldn't see things like a Pro Controller that is always a best selling item on Amazon (currently #8 in Video Game sales for 2019 and the highest selling controller)...

First few years of new games that dominated sales and highly rated: Pokemon, BotW, Mario Kart, Luigi's Mansion 3, Fire Emblem, SSBU, Super Mario Maker 2, Mario & Rabbids, Link's Awakening, Splatoon 2, Odyssey, etc... just take a look at Amazon's best selling Video Game category and it will give you an idea of how well the Switch is doing right now... PS/Xbox are carried by Fortnite, Madden, CoD, etc... and any game that is released on Switch, PS4, and Xbox 1 the Switch outsells it almost always (Spyro, Crash Bandicoot N. Sane Trilogy, Crash Racing, Just Dance 2020, Civilization VI, etc)... in fact, the only game I see that the Switch has been outsold on is MK11 and that's because Smash makes that game irrelevant to Switch owners... The Switch is dominating right now and I don't think the PS5/XSX will change that in 2020 (and possibly 2021)...

Last edited by scottslater - on 13 December 2019

Nintendo with the Switch:

zorg1000 on 13 December 2019
scottslater said:
Alistair said:

A 5 watt APU based on 2014's mobile tech is not a home console. It really shouldn't even be an argument. Add a dock to the Vita and you had the same thing. Personally the Wii U was a great console for me. If I look at the Switch, outside Mario Odyssey, nothing was new on the system for the first few years. The Gamecube to Wii transition was more exciting than the Wii U to Switch transition (20 years with only 2 power levels, only Nintendo). Would like modern mobile tech or a console based on the weakest current GPU, the 1650 Super. That's all. If Nintendo can't even do that, I'll be supporting emulators with my money, not buying another Switch (which I already sold after beating Mario Odyssey). If Nintendo wants to nip the emulator community in the bud, they can start with a decent home console. Nintendo is losing 10+ million of their life long fans with the Switch, and you can't ignore that the Switch's success is mainly the people who bought the 3DS. I have several friends with a Wii U who have bought the Switch and are less than impressed.

Except it is a home console that just happens to have better portability... otherwise you wouldn't see things like a Pro Controller that is always a best selling item on Amazon (currently #8 in Video Game sales for 2019 and the highest selling controller)...

First few years of new games that dominated sales and highly rated: Pokemon, BotW, Mario Kart, Luigi's Mansion 3, Fire Emblem, SSBU, Super Mario Maker 2, Mario & Rabbids, Link's Awakening, Splatoon 2, Odyssey, etc... just take a look at Amazon's best selling Video Game category and it will give you an idea of how well the Switch is doing right now... PS/Xbox are carried by Fortnite, Madden, CoD, etc... and any game that is released on Switch, PS4, and Xbox 1 the Switch outsells it almost always (Spyro, Crash Bandicoot N. Sane Trilogy, Crash Racing, Just Dance 2020, Civilization VI, etc)... in fact, the only game I see that the Switch has been outsold on is MK11 and that's because Smash makes that game irrelevant to Switch owners... The Switch is dominating right now and I don't think the PS5/XSX will change that in 2020 (and possibly 2021)...

You are making just as many ridiculous claims as he is, where are you coming up with Crash, Spyro, CTR selling more on Switch? Or that MK11 is only selling worse because of Smash?



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

scottslater on 13 December 2019
zorg1000 said:
scottslater said:

Except it is a home console that just happens to have better portability... otherwise you wouldn't see things like a Pro Controller that is always a best selling item on Amazon (currently #8 in Video Game sales for 2019 and the highest selling controller)...

First few years of new games that dominated sales and highly rated: Pokemon, BotW, Mario Kart, Luigi's Mansion 3, Fire Emblem, SSBU, Super Mario Maker 2, Mario & Rabbids, Link's Awakening, Splatoon 2, Odyssey, etc... just take a look at Amazon's best selling Video Game category and it will give you an idea of how well the Switch is doing right now... PS/Xbox are carried by Fortnite, Madden, CoD, etc... and any game that is released on Switch, PS4, and Xbox 1 the Switch outsells it almost always (Spyro, Crash Bandicoot N. Sane Trilogy, Crash Racing, Just Dance 2020, Civilization VI, etc)... in fact, the only game I see that the Switch has been outsold on is MK11 and that's because Smash makes that game irrelevant to Switch owners... The Switch is dominating right now and I don't think the PS5/XSX will change that in 2020 (and possibly 2021)...

You are making just as many ridiculous claims as he is, where are you coming up with Crash, Spyro, CTR selling more on Switch? Or that MK11 is only selling worse because of Smash?

As I said in my post, on Amazon's top selling list...

https://www.amazon.com/best-sellers-video-games/zgbs/videogames/ref=zg_bs_nav_0

https://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/2019/videogames/ref=zg_bs_tab_t_bsar

The MK11 claim is pure speculation (with Smash selling 15 million units in less than a year seems a reasonable conclusion)

Last edited by scottslater - on 13 December 2019

Nintendo with the Switch:

zorg1000 on 13 December 2019
scottslater said:
zorg1000 said:

You are making just as many ridiculous claims as he is, where are you coming up with Crash, Spyro, CTR selling more on Switch? Or that MK11 is only selling worse because of Smash?

As I said in my post, on Amazon's top selling list...

https://www.amazon.com/best-sellers-video-games/zgbs/videogames/ref=zg_bs_nav_0

https://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/2019/videogames/ref=zg_bs_tab_t_bsar

The MK11 claim is pure speculation (with Smash selling 15 million units in less than a year seems a reasonable conclusion)

That's not how sales work, you cant take a single retailer in a single region to conclude overall sales.

And no that is not a reasonable conclusion since Mortal Kombat has always sold better on other consoles.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

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160rmf on 13 December 2019
goopy20 said:
The_Yoda said:

Except for those of us that play it only as a home console ... I've used it as a portable once while waiting in line on a black friday.  It was too cold to have my hands out of my pockets so even then all I did was watch Hulu on it.

Well, there's a reason why Nintendo released the Switch lite. I mean when you think of it, the Switch is basically a more refined and sexier looking Wii-U where they switched things around. The Wii-U is a home console that can also be used for limited handheld gaming. And the Switch is designed as a handheld first and can also be used as a (limited) home console. 

How exactly a system that can do everything that your typical home console can do and more is limited?



 

 

We reap what we sow

scottslater on 13 December 2019
zorg1000 said:
scottslater said:

As I said in my post, on Amazon's top selling list...

https://www.amazon.com/best-sellers-video-games/zgbs/videogames/ref=zg_bs_nav_0

https://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/2019/videogames/ref=zg_bs_tab_t_bsar

The MK11 claim is pure speculation (with Smash selling 15 million units in less than a year seems a reasonable conclusion)

That's not how sales work, you cant take a single retailer in a single region to conclude overall sales.

And no that is not a reasonable conclusion since Mortal Kombat has always sold better on other consoles.

I didn't say that was how sales work... I said you it will give you an idea of how well it is doing right now by using the largest retailer in the most important market in the console industry (not to take away anything from other markets).

Why do you think MK sells better on those other consoles, because Switch owners go with the "better" game in SSBU.

Last edited by scottslater - on 13 December 2019

Nintendo with the Switch:

curl-6 on 13 December 2019
Alistair said:

A 5 watt APU based on 2014's mobile tech is not a home console. It really shouldn't even be an argument. Add a dock to the Vita and you had the same thing. Personally the Wii U was a great console for me. If I look at the Switch, outside Mario Odyssey, nothing was new on the system for the first few years. The Gamecube to Wii transition was more exciting than the Wii U to Switch transition (20 years with only 2 power levels, only Nintendo). Would like modern mobile tech or a console based on the weakest current GPU, the 1650 Super. That's all. If Nintendo can't even do that, I'll be supporting emulators with my money, not buying another Switch (which I already sold after beating Mario Odyssey). If Nintendo wants to nip the emulator community in the bud, they can start with a decent home console. Nintendo is losing 10+ million of their life long fans with the Switch, and you can't ignore that the Switch's success is mainly the people who bought the 3DS. I have several friends with a Wii U who have bought the Switch and are less than impressed.

If we're speaking anecdotally, I am a Wii U owner who is very pleased with the Switch and only uses it in docked mode, as a home console.



zorg1000 on 13 December 2019
scottslater said:
zorg1000 said:

That's not how sales work, you cant take a single retailer in a single region to conclude overall sales.

And no that is not a reasonable conclusion since Mortal Kombat has always sold better on other consoles.

I didn't say that was how sales work... I said you it will give you an idea of how well it is doing right now by using the largest retailer in the most important market in the console industry (not to take away anything from other markets).

Why do you think MK sells better on those other consoles, because Switch owners go with the "better" game in SSBU.

That's such a specific qualifier that it means almost nothing.

This is a website dedicated to game sales, it has all the data you need to see that MK has consistently done better on other platforms.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

scottslater on 13 December 2019
zorg1000 said:
scottslater said:

I didn't say that was how sales work... I said you it will give you an idea of how well it is doing right now by using the largest retailer in the most important market in the console industry (not to take away anything from other markets).

Why do you think MK sells better on those other consoles, because Switch owners go with the "better" game in SSBU.

That's such a specific qualifier that it means almost nothing.

This is a website dedicated to game sales, it has all the data you need to see that MK has consistently done better on other platforms.

And Smash outsells other fighting games by a wide margin, so again, there is no reason for Nintendo owners to buy other fighting games because of Smash.

EDIT: For example, just last month SSBU outsold MK11 and that doesn't include digital sales of SSBU.

EDIT2: Also, dismissing Amazon is pretty ignorant, Amazon accounts for 50% of all online retail sales and 5% of all retail sales in general.

EDIT3: Actually, Amazon has a pretty large share of the retail business of video games, almost 7% ($1 billion sales recorded in a $14.5 billion market in 2017)

https://www.statista.com/statistics/725702/us-amazon-top-selling-video-game-categories/

https://venturebeat.com/2018/01/18/npd-2017-an-incredible-year-for-games-leads-to-11-sales-growth/

Last edited by scottslater - on 13 December 2019

Nintendo with the Switch: