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Who gives a fuck about John Oliver on this. He is British. You trying to gain brownie points with your rebel flag bearing friends? The south were traitors and racist. That is a fact.



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Dulfite said:
sundin13 said:

I don't think this phenomenon is quite as widespread as you seem to think it is, and even if it was it still wouldn't justify the action that many Republicans have taken against schools. 

90% of what happens at schools is controlled by the board of education for each district. If CRT is being weaponized in a district, then it doesn't matter how uncommon it is nationally, it has to be dealt with and angers many. The district I taught in weaponized it. The one I live in was starting to weaponize it, along with having little kids have access to books about molestation and rape in horrifying, specific detail, amongst other things, so the people living around me elected two conservatives to the board last Tuesday in the election, beating the supposedly non-political incumbents who allowed these policies to take place. The people have spoken around here. These are district-specific issues, mostly. None of us know how "widespread" this is or isn't, because we only live in our small neck of the woods.

Do what your god loving christians do then pull your kids out of public schools and have them engraved into one way of thinking unless god forgive they actually think for themselves or start asking questions.



KLAMarine said:
Runa216 said:

I love that the critics of CRT don't actually know what it is/does. Just another delicious layer of hilarity that comes from certain political groups.

CRT is the school of thought that says we need to be aware of our racial history and how it impacts the current cultural landscape. If you default to assuming "CRT is making white kids hate their country", maybe you need to reflect on the history of your country. If thinking critically made them realize that the nation they live in isn't perfect and has flaws, then maybe that says more about the accurate reflection of history vs your rose tinted glasses than it does about scholars and educators.

Seriously, if critical thinking reveals imperfections in history, and you personally think that's somehow offensive, then you are not on the right side of history. IT's just that simple. If you're the type of person who defaults to 'CRT makes kids hate themselves' and 'Teaching CRT is anti-patriotic' without actually factoring in any of the scholarly work that goes towards those conclusions or are incapable of self-reflecting enough to think that maybe there's something poignant there...well, I just don't even know what to say to you or your kind anymore.

You're outright admitting that you've got a perspective borne of revisionist history and that anything critical of that perception is seen as a threat. that's not the mindset of someone who is right about stuff. People who are correct generally don't act that way.

Well I think if we ask John Oliver himself, someone I understand you hold in high regard, yes. I think he would agree CRT can potentially screw kids up sometimes because the lessons can go south bad.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EICp1vGlh_U (9:00, 9:55)

Upon review, I should have posted something more akin to the above. I came off as too sure of myself originally. Apologies on any misunderstanding.



Dulfite said:
sundin13 said:

Assuming that happened, that sucks but it says nothing about CRT. It says that these individuals handled race poorly, it doesn't say that the government should step into to ensure that schools simply don't teach about race and how the effects of our country's racist history still linger in our society. 

Sure, but there are a lot of people that support CRT (or what they think it is) that are using it as ammo against white people, and that's what has gotten white's easily offended by CRT, in my experience. It isn't right wing ignorance of the of CRT, but rather left wing ignorance of how to apply CRT that is causing problems, in my limited, anecdotal experience.

The thing is, that's not CRT.  What you are talking about is totally different since CRT wasn't even a thing until the term was made popular by conservatives looking to politicalize it.  You might have some people looking to politicalize race in general but that is not CRT.  Your examples just show that you are using the term as a catch all to anything racial which was the aim in the first place by conservatives. Create the umbrella and throw everything into one pot so it muddies the discussion and you can label everything CRT.  

My question is what would be the conservative way to discuss race in a classroom environment since you stated the problem is how the liberals apply race.  One example is from Texas schools where they voted to remove the word slavery from history and social studies.  Another example from the same area is a new bill to remove public schools from teaching about history of slavery and also laws and rules made during times after the civil war that suppressed not only black people but even women like the right to vote.  Just like you can find examples of bad faith situation on race, there are currently a host of bad faith examples happen this every moment in conservative states who appear to want to rewrite history on all levels.



RolStoppable said:
Dulfite said:

I can't really address CRT specifically. What I can address is how terrible it was, as a white teacher, to be told by black administrators that we should teach our students that white people are inherently evil. To even bring up conservative perspectives would bring terrible retribution down from the admins, and we always tried to along with liberal and independent perspectives, because that's what is fair. Students should learn about all perspectives and all religions. That same administrative team of principles literally said, "You wouldn't teach a bunch of Jews about Hitler either, would you?". Yes, yes we would! We learn from history, not trying to hide what happened! And I don't know any teachers that believe white people were in the right over slavery centuries ago. We aren't trying to hide that. We, of course, know our ancestors messed up. But teaching black and white students that white people are evil or more evil than the rest of mankind to this day? You've got to be kidding me! This isn't me exaggerating, this actually happened to me and my fellow social studies teachers. The amount of abuse I witnessed firsthand and heard from fellow teachers I worked with about how they were dealt with by black administrators was horrifying, all because we were born white. I had the privilege of having black administrators make me out to be the bad guy simply because of the color of my skin.

So I don't know what CRT teaches, frankly I don't care. These administrators used CRT to justify their actions. Maybe it isn't CRT's fault, maybe it is, but regardless, there are people interpreting things from it to justify horrible actions and perspectives done upon white people who had nothing to do with slavery.

The story would be a lot more believable if you had said "white administrators."

Why would it be more believable?



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sethnintendo said:

Who gives a fuck about John Oliver on this. He is British. You trying to gain brownie points with your rebel flag bearing friends? The south were traitors and racist. That is a fact.

He's actually got Dual-citizenship, making him as much an American as anyone else. Not the most pertinent point but still. He also has well-researched points and actually holds up to scrutiny (I fact checked a bunch of his stuff since it's a comedy show first, a news show second, and yeah, his stuff's accurate based on primary, respectable sources.) 

And man, I'm beginning to remember why I stayed out of this thread for so long. Just so much inexcusable, willing ignorance being presented as fact and nobility. So many logical fallacies, so many misrepresentations of the facts, so much debate about morals and ethics without anything backing up the points aside from personal opinions regardless of the facts. 

Politics really are a shit show. 

Machiavellian said:
Dulfite said:

Sure, but there are a lot of people that support CRT (or what they think it is) that are using it as ammo against white people, and that's what has gotten white's easily offended by CRT, in my experience. It isn't right wing ignorance of the of CRT, but rather left wing ignorance of how to apply CRT that is causing problems, in my limited, anecdotal experience.

The thing is, that's not CRT.  What you are talking about is totally different since CRT wasn't even a thing until the term was made popular by conservatives looking to politicalize it.  You might have some people looking to politicalize race in general but that is not CRT.  Your examples just show that you are using the term as a catch all to anything racial which was the aim in the first place by conservatives. Create the umbrella and throw everything into one pot so it muddies the discussion and you can label everything CRT.  

My question is what would be the conservative way to discuss race in a classroom environment since you stated the problem is how the liberals apply race.  One example is from Texas schools where they voted to remove the word slavery from history and social studies.  Another example from the same area is a new bill to remove public schools from teaching about history of slavery and also laws and rules made during times after the civil war that suppressed not only black people but even women like the right to vote.  Just like you can find examples of bad faith situation on race, there are currently a host of bad faith examples happen this every moment in conservative states who appear to want to rewrite history on all levels.

CRT was actually introduced in the 70s, in law school meant to investigate the impact of the nation's racist history on modern culture, examining why even when we have laws that either don't favour one race over another or outright ban discrimination, we still have racial inequality. 

and hoo boy I don't even wanna get into all the religious teachings banning sex ed and glossing over the genocide of the indigenous people and all the other ear-clasping ways people refuse to come to terms with the shittiness we gave to each other in the past (and therefore perpetuate in the future.)



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https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/alex-jones-infowars-files-bankruptcy-sandy-hook-lawsuits-rcna24768?cid=sm_npd_ms_tw_ma

Good, I hope he ends up on the street and everyone who walks past him spits on him and kicks his teeth in for the vile shit he pulled and continues to pull.



My Console Library:

PS5, Switch, XSX

PS4, PS3, PS2, PS1, WiiU, Wii, GCN, N64 SNES, XBO, 360

3DS, DS, GBA, Vita, PSP, Android

Runa216 said:

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/alex-jones-infowars-files-bankruptcy-sandy-hook-lawsuits-rcna24768?cid=sm_npd_ms_tw_ma

Good, I hope he ends up on the street and everyone who walks past him spits on him and kicks his teeth in for the vile shit he pulled and continues to pull.

My initial reaction to this was positive as well, but it seems to be a way to try and weasel out of paying damages in said lawsuits. I hope it doesn't work.



TallSilhouette said:
Runa216 said:

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/alex-jones-infowars-files-bankruptcy-sandy-hook-lawsuits-rcna24768?cid=sm_npd_ms_tw_ma

Good, I hope he ends up on the street and everyone who walks past him spits on him and kicks his teeth in for the vile shit he pulled and continues to pull.

My initial reaction to this was positive as well, but it seems to be a way to try and weasel out of paying damages in said lawsuits. I hope it doesn't work.

Unfortunately it will work. But there are ways to still get water from a stone.



Runa216 said:
sethnintendo said:

Who gives a fuck about John Oliver on this. He is British. You trying to gain brownie points with your rebel flag bearing friends? The south were traitors and racist. That is a fact.

He's actually got Dual-citizenship, making him as much an American as anyone else. Not the most pertinent point but still. He also has well-researched points and actually holds up to scrutiny (I fact checked a bunch of his stuff since it's a comedy show first, a news show second, and yeah, his stuff's accurate based on primary, respectable sources.) 

And man, I'm beginning to remember why I stayed out of this thread for so long. Just so much inexcusable, willing ignorance being presented as fact and nobility. So many logical fallacies, so many misrepresentations of the facts, so much debate about morals and ethics without anything backing up the points aside from personal opinions regardless of the facts. 

Politics really are a shit show. CRT was actually introduced in the 70s, in law school meant to investigate the impact of the nation's racist history on modern culture, examining why even when we have laws that either don't favour one race over another or outright ban discrimination, we still have racial inequality. 

This post is actually serious. Had to just come back to this thread to say thanks for the laughing material.