By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Gaming Discussion - What exactly do you consider to be "SJW agenda" in games?

 

Does the inclusion of women in BFV bother you?

Yes 15 22.06%
 
No 53 77.94%
 
Total:68
Kirin_gaming on 26 August 2018
haxxiy said:

Dragon Age: Inquisition had more or less the demographic profile of the modern United States despite being set on a medieval copy of Great Britain and France, and inexplicably had modern atittutes towards transsexuality etc. as well.

Of course, the writers are free to make up a world emotionally appealing to their political views (since I believe indulging in idiosyncracies make fantasy more unique) but don't expect it to be free of criticism, specially if it looks dumb and strains suspension of disbelief.

That's the sort of thing that irks me, when it's absolutely forced and silly.

Dude Dragon Age is a fantasy world, FANTASY.

Does the game having 8 kinds of humanoids apart from humans also irk you?



Around the Network
Lucca on 26 August 2018
Ka-pi96 said:
LuccaCardoso1 said:

The problem is when people see politics when there isn't any. Yes, EA execs brought up misogyny and so on, but even before they said anything, when the trailer first came out, people were accusing DICE of being left-winged for having a woman as one of the main characters. Like, wtf? Representing people other than white cis hetero males is not a question of political view, it's just representativity. We shouldn't be attributing sides and polarizing something that just shows us how diverse we are as a species. I can't wrap my head around how someone opposes the thought of having different ethnicities, genders, sexualities et cetera represented.

The videogame industry is so far behind when it comes to diversity. While we have films such as Call Me by Your Name or Moonlight winning Oscars, I can't remember a single big game where the main character was gay. Just look at last year's TGA. In the main categories, all games with fixed main characters follow the same pattern regarding them: 1) If they're human, they're white. 2) If they have a partner, it's from the opposite sex. Both topics are true for 100% of all main characters in games with a fixed main character (no physical appearance customization other than clothing) running for GOTY, Game Direction, Narrative, Art Direction, Score/Music and Audio Design.

That's absolutely a political view as soon as you mentioned that. It sounds like you're saying you want everything to be represented equally at award shows and the like, which is not only a political opinion but is also quite frankly ridiculous. "diversity" shouldn't matter a jot for awards and the like, the only thing that should matter is how good the games are.

It's like awhile back when people complained about a lack of black people nominated for oscars, now I'm not a big movie watcher so maybe there were some great performances by black actors that year in which case you could justify some of the criticism, but otherwise it's absolutely ridiculous to claim that people should be nominated for awards (or even win them) just because of the colour of their skin. No, they should actually have done well enough to deserve an award. It shouldn't matter whether those nominated are 100% white or 0% white, the only thing that should matter is that they're 100% of those that did the best.

You got me wrong. I'm not saying that games with more diverse casts should be nominated instead, I indeed think that the nominated games were the best in that year, I'm just saying that it's a shame that none of the best games of the year have a diverse cast of characters.



B O I

JWeinCom on 26 August 2018
Ka-pi96 said:
JWeinCom said:


This is not a history lesson, or a book that claims to be an accurate betrayal of world war 2.  It's a game with a primary purpose of entertaining.  If they think the game would be more entertaining with women, that's their business.  

Do you take objection to X-Men first class implying mutants were responsible for the cuban missile crisis?  Was that also rewriting history?

heh, intentional, or just hilariously ironic mistake?

Oh, and just saying "that's how the devs intended it" does NOT protect it from criticism. People have every right to criticise the way the devs intended the game.

Whoopsie.  That's an amusing error.

On the point, I didn't say you couldn't criticize it.  If you don't like it you don't like it.  But comparing it to 1984 is just silly.



DreadPirateRoberts on 26 August 2018
Kirin_gaming said:
haxxiy said:

Dragon Age: Inquisition had more or less the demographic profile of the modern United States despite being set on a medieval copy of Great Britain and France, and inexplicably had modern atittutes towards transsexuality etc. as well.

Of course, the writers are free to make up a world emotionally appealing to their political views (since I believe indulging in idiosyncracies make fantasy more unique) but don't expect it to be free of criticism, specially if it looks dumb and strains suspension of disbelief.

That's the sort of thing that irks me, when it's absolutely forced and silly.

Dude Dragon Age is a fantasy world, FANTASY.

Does the game having 8 kinds of humanoids apart from humans also irk you?

Yeah, I have to agree with this.  Inventing a fantasy world styled on some historical point in time in the real world does not lock anyone into specific demographics for the invented world itself.  To be blunt, criticizing DA:I in this fashion simply screams someone looking for reasons to be offended.



Lucca on 26 August 2018
shikamaru317 said:

Things I consider to be part of the SJW agenda

-Diversity that feels forced. BFV is a prime example of this category, as it features women fighting in combat roles for armies that specifically forbade women from serving in combat roles. Another hypothetical example would be a game set in the rural US that has as many black, hispanic, Asian, native American, etc. characters as white characters. In most rural areas in the US whites make up at least 70% of the total population according to census data (my own county, which is rural, is 95% white as of the 2010 census, while the largest city in my county is 85% white), having a ton of minority characters in such a game would be an example of forced diversity. Another example would be an RPG with a party that covers just about every race just to check-off the diversity box. 

-Anti-religious themes, particularly anti-Christian themes. SJW's can't stand Christians because the Bible speaks against a number of causes that they support, such as abortion and the LGBT movement, and many SJW's also have a problem with other religions for the same reason. As a result, some SJW developers will inject anti-religious themes into their games.

-Forced LGBT romance scenes featuring playable characters or common LGBT public displays of affection featuring NPC's. An example of this would be the lesbian kiss in TLOU2, as it is a forced story event as far as we know, not an optional romance option.

-Censoring or toning down of violence, in some misguided attempt to prevent school shootings or some other such nonsense. 

-Modern Left-wing ideals showing up in historical games where modern left-wing ideals didn't exist.

-Left-wing poltics showing up in modern or future setting games, unless they are countered by right-wing politics that are portrayed in a non-villainous way. 

-Removal of potentially offensive iconography because some wimp might not be able to handle seeing it. An example would be the removal of the Swastika from Battlefield V and CoD WW2 last year. 

-Censoring or toning down of sexy costumes. Some examples of this would be Nintendo of America/Europe not releasing Japanese DLC costumes for a number of games in recent years, because the outfits are sexy. Another example would be the seeming removal of sexy costumes in DoA 6 so far. 

-Feminists like Anita Sarkeesian who want to get rid of sexy female playable characters, under some misguided belief that it places unrealistic expectations on women or some other such nonsense, yet are ok with sexy male playable characters. 

-Attempts to block niche Japanese visual novels from release in the west because they contain sexual content.

 

Things I don't consider to be part of the SJW agenda

-Female playable characters or racial minority characters that make sense for the time period or geographical setting of the game. I have zero problems with female playable characters at all as long as they match the setting and don't feel forced, and even prefer them over male playable characters in many instances, frequently choosing female if there is a choice in game, like the upcoming AC Odyssey. Likewise I have no problem with minority race playable characters or party members as long as they match the setting.

-Optional LGBT romances. Bioware has had LGBT romance options since Juhani in KOTOR way back in 2003, and with only one exception (DA: Origins) I never had a problem with it because it never felt forced. DA:O was a different matter though, Zevran threw himself at me the whole game, which was quite annoying. As long as a developer makes this kind of content entirely optional I have zero problems with it.

Why are non-optional gay romance scenes a problem? Aren't them the same as non-optional hetero romance scenes? You're either for both or against both.



B O I

Around the Network
Lucca on 26 August 2018
shikamaru317 said:
LuccaCardoso1 said:

Why are non-optional gay romance scenes a problem? Aren't them the same as non-optional hetero romance scenes? You're either for both or against both.

I disagree. Hetero relationships are the natural norm, because they serve the biological purpose of reproduction, seeing a man and a woman kiss shouldn't offend anybody. However some people might be offended by being forced to watch a lesbian or gay kiss when playing a game, for religious reasons or maybe they're just homophobic (not that I agree with homophobia). 

Homosexuality is as natural as heterosexuality. One is just more common than the other.

I don't see why a couple being able to reproduce makes them more socially acceptable. People don't have sex for reproduction 99% of the times they have sex anyway.

And as for people being offended by it because of religious reasons, games already show a lot of killing and blood. If one's not offended by that, I don't see why they should be offended by a kiss.

Do you think developers are pushing an SJW agenda for going against what a prejudiced group wants? There are few ideologies that I know are straight up wrong, and homophobia is one of them. Homophobia is just the modern version of racism.



B O I

flashfire926 on 26 August 2018

shikamaru317 said: 

-snip-

Nailed it there. The only thing I would disagree is not being allowed to have a mandatory lesbian kiss.For the kiss in TLOU, Itself I thought it was just fine. But combined with the other things going on at ND it's becomes obvious that that specific instance is nothing more than a SJW agenda.



Bet with Intrinsic:

The Switch will outsell 3DS (based on VGchartz numbers), according to me, while Intrinsic thinks the opposite will hold true. One month avatar control for the loser's avatar.

BrayanA on 26 August 2018
LuccaCardoso1 said:
shikamaru317 said:

...

Why are non-optional gay romance scenes a problem? Aren't them the same as non-optional hetero romance scenes? You're either for both or against both.

Because the majority rule should be applied by default. It's like in a non chilly eating country you expect your food to be non chilly by default and when you go to a burger bar you have most burgers without chilly and it's not specifically indicated that they are not chilly. Of course you can have chilly as an extra if they offer it as an extra. Some burgers are chilly by default and this is specifically indicated, so the majority of people that don't like chilly will not be unpleasantly surprised. Of course there is nothing wrong to have a chilly food restaurant for chilly lovers were chilly food will be offered and if someone complained it's his problem not yours. In India it's the opposite - don't expect any indications on your food to alert you that it may be chilly. The majority are chilly eaters and they expect it to be chilly. It's your job as a minority non chilly eater to ask for non chilly food.



DonFerrari on 26 August 2018
Ka-pi96 said:
Unrealistic diversity is the most obvious example. Like a cast with diverse ethnicities etc in a game set during modern times makes perfect sense, but something historical being changed to fit some "quota" is just ridiculous. A good example is when people bitched about there not being black people in Kingdom Come: Deliverance. Yeah, because black people were so common in medieval Bohemia...

Instead of bitching maybe those people should make a game set in medieval Africa instead. Then it could be all black people, and you know what I'd actually be interested in such a game. I enjoy historical games, especially if they're set in a region/time period I don't know much about so that would be a pretty cool idea for a game. And hey, I'd be happy if there weren't any white people in it too, since you simply wouldn't find white people in (sub-saharan) medieval Africa anyway so it would be as it should be.

Yep, we have norse, japanese, chinese, greek and couple other folk/legend times. I would like some South American, Soth African and North American legends/myths good games (and certainly would be disapointed if they decided to make the games in english with european skin).



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari on 26 August 2018
morenoingrato said:
An SJW agenda in games would be forced diversity and blatant political statements.

Yet most people here will freak over a woman in a game or really stretch games to make them seem as if they had an SJW agenda. Persecutory delusion.

Do you have the statistic for it? Sales of the games with woman doesn't seem to point people are generaly offended by woman being in games.

More funny is people atributing lack of woman or gay people in games as excuses for those groups not buying games, but forgeting that until perhaps PS1 most games had irrecognizable objects or animals for chars and since the 70's male were already a majority of gaming.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."