pokoko said:
| DonFerrari said:
So are you against his banning and think these companies are acting backwards to what the propose as being public spaces with freedom of speech? From your posts I couldn't see that.
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Stop trying to put words in my mouth.
First, I never said Alex Jones should be banned for saying Obama is a demon.
This is the paragraph where I mentioned that: "Honestly, the guy needs to reclassify as entertainment. It's just mind boggling that anyone takes him seriously. This is the guy that hinted Obama was actually a demon. A DEMON." Do you see me calling for a ban over that anywhere in that paragraph? Stop trying to twist that. That's dishonest.
As for "freedom of speech," I don't really understand what you are trying to say. Are you suggesting the government should decide what private sector businesses show as content via regulation? If so, then I think that is a terrible idea. No conservative should ever support that.
Regarding his ban, I don't know why he got banned. If he violated their TOS then the ban was earned. If he did not violate their TOS then I would not support their decision. However, so far I haven't seen anyone defending him try to make a case that he did not violate TOS restrictions. Are you claiming that he did not?
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Nope government shouldn't regulate then. People must talk against it. But what we are seeing is people saying they don't like the guy so it's good that he was banned.
What I'm claiming is that we do have plenty of left wing pages that violate the TOS and get free pass. Which basically shows the bias of the platform and that they aren't really for freedom of speech as they say they are. And also that we have a lot of mini dictators on internet asking for the people they disagree to be banned and shunned.
SpokenTruth said:
DonFerrari said:
BLM have certainly caused a lot of violence and damage. Are they banned? I see more they going to TV and defend their point than they losing platforms.
Several of the pages from left wing in Brazil defend violence against police, death to a political oponent, kill middle class, etc. None of them were banned from these platforms. Or in this case you'll see they aren't really endangering anyone?
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1. BLM is a response to violence, not the source of it. That said, it's also not a centralized or individual group like Alex Jones/Info Wars. BLM pages on Facebook are not directed by a larger organization. It is localized and operated by individuals. If one of them advocates unprovoked violence, report them. But keep in mind that because of that decentralization, it opens up the opportunity for false flag operations. The largest BLM community on Facebook was recently shut down because it was a scam from a white Australia guy and Russia bought thousands of pro-BLM ads. Those BLM pages that advocate unprovoked violence may not even be BLM at all. So yes, the left is subject to TOS violations too.
2. Your laws in Brazil are different and I don't know them enough to comment on what rights, laws and platform TOS policies apply. You may be thinking that what you see on Brazilian social media is the same as US social media, based on what you listed above (advocating the death of a political opponent, death to the middle class...) that isn't common.
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1 - Yes sure, and there is no racism against white people... And all those BLM leaders are lying when identifying as leaders?
2 - Didn't say the law is the same, in fact one of the first post on this thread I pointed the law is different.
I just pointed that FB have no qualms in breaking their own TOS in Brazil to protect left wing pages or to ban right wing pages. And because that is configured as political persecution the government may demand explanations from FB and that is what they done (myself I don't think the government should, but that is the current law and allows them). But much less I think people should be applauding FB for not being clear on their bias and pretending to be neutral while acting one sided.
pokoko said:
irstupid said:
NO.
The free market is all 100% about market prices and how supply and demand dictate economy prices without government intervention in regulating the market.
I know you love to look up Wikipedia, so go ahead and do so. You will find that I am correct.
Thus as I said, the free market would put those people out business if what they did truly offended people. People would quit listening to Alex Jones and he would make no money talking online and thus no longer do it. The bakery would have no customers and thus make no money and go out of business. No one would watch rosseane and the company thus would make no advertising dollars and pull the show.
Again, all ECONOMICS related with no government regulations. That is the free market.
Just as the government coming and regulating how much a company can charge goes against the free market, a company firing someone or banning someone for their own single policy is against free market. Free market is solely determined by the consumers. If consumers want the product and consume, then the free market dictates what the price of said product is. If there is no demand, there is no more supply.
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A company deciding what content they provide is NOT the same as the government regulating prices.
It's supply AND demand. Supply is every bit as important as demand. A free market is not just about consumers, it's also about suppliers. In a free market, suppliers have the freedom to decide what they supply. Otherwise, it would be a regulated market. You can't ignore half the equation.
You're wrong on that point.
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There was demand for Alex content and those companies profited from it as well. So it was much more folding to public pressure and/or left wing internal team (Zucherberg confessed to the Senate that most of his team is left wing) than demand/supply of free market.
Alara317 said:
contestgamer said:
Well then they should be turned in to public utilities so that free speech is allowed on all these platforms. Your argument is basically that Facebook is exercising its free speech by not allowing someone elses. That makes no sense. If FB disapproves of his message then make a post or speech about it and combat it that way. What they're doing is censorship. This is a symptom of that disturbing push we have in our society to make our communities more inclusive, safer and tolerant of eachother. But we achieve this by being intolerant to those on the fringes.
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Wow. You really have absolutely no idea what you're talking about and it's hilarious to see and hear the arguments you're trying to make.
The Freedom of Speech gives you, as a citizen, the right to say whatever you want as long as it's not threatening or outright lying (Libel/Slander.) The first amendment simply states that a person is legally free to have and hold whatever opinion they want and they have the freedom from the government to express those opinions.
From the government.
Your statement is fundamentally flawed on multiple levels because you're assuming that me saying it's perfectly within Facebook's rights to not host someone's rants is the same as taking away their right to free speech. Facebook is not taking away anyone's right to free speech, because Alex Jones is still legally allowed to say what he wants in a public forum, but that doesn't mean that Facebook wants to allow him to say it on Facebook.
You seem to be completely overlooking the difference between a public and private establishment, which is why your argument completely falls apart and why I laugh at you. Facebook is not a government-hosted website, and neither is Youtube. Sure, those companies are huge and you might be foolish enough to believe that just because so many people have access to it that it's a public place, but it's not. Facebook is a privately owned business, and therefore facebook can choose to do business or not do business with whomever they chose. If they chose not to do business with someone screaming conspiracy theories about Sandy Hook, then they have every right to. Just like your local cafe has every right to not host you if you start making racial slurs in their stores or I have every right to boot you out of my house if you start trying to convince me that Gays are Satan's messengers or whatever.
Your fundamental ignorance is that you can't differentiate between public and private, and while I'd love to educate you on that, your response thus far has convinced me you aren't willing to listen.
So in short, you are wrong. Educate yourself on the application of free speech in a public establishment vs a private establishment before you speak again.
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And you can't differentiate that it is proprietary but not private, everyone have access to it and even politicians, political parties, government departments, cities, etc have pages over there.
Also no one really seem anyone bothered to reply on the speeches on universities from right wing figures that had violent left wing protests and where cancelled... and also most here wouldn't allow private companies to openly discriminate and refuse service. So it really is "free market" for them if it supports their side.