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Forums - Gaming - If Sony makes a "Playstation Switch" could it succeed?

 

Could Sony make a successful Switch ?

Yes 25 14.37%
 
No 83 47.70%
 
Depends on many things 62 35.63%
 
see results 4 2.30%
 
Total:174
potato_hamster said:
HoangNhatAnh said:

That is why i said 2d or not is meaningless if the hardware is too slow and cost too much time to optimize. If Nintendo try to optimize old 3ds hardware to run SNES VC, then maybe in 2018 it can happen with 75% games at full 60 fps in 3D, 25% left is impossible. Meanwhile, let's ignore New 3ds can run all 100% at 60fps in 3D and takes only one-third of years to work on, sound reasonable

I never made an argument that the 2D nature of the games were meaningless. We are however, talking about Super Nintendo games that are almost 30 years old. Let's not pretend these are demanding games on par with 2D games that were released in the past few years.

Again, we already have a homebrew emulator in SNES9X for the base 3DS that already has perfect emulation in over 85% of Super Nintendo games. There's no reason to suspect that Nintendo can't do even better than that with their own in-house developed emulator considering a) they have an technical team with far more combined expertise and b) they understand the SNES and 3DS hardware better than literally anyone else on the planet. Why would we expect Nintendo to be less successful than you can.

Also, please provide a source that the SNES emulator Nintendo built for the 3DS plays 100% of Super Nintendo games perfectly, and provide a source that Nintendo spent 4 months working on it. Please note that 100% of the games released on the N3DS Virtual Console are already emulated perfectly by the SNES9X base 3DS emulator.

Weaker hardware mean take more time to optimize for emulate, isn't it obvious ? Since when i said 4 months? New 3ds came out in Japan in 2014, SNES VC is 2016 mean 2 years later and you knew New 3ds CPU is 4 times faster than 3ds. Definitely take more times than 2 years like New 3ds, 3 or 4 years? As we see, Switch came out last year, put SNES VC on Switch now is way better choice than 3ds. And all SNES games you mentioned run on 3ds emulator at 60fps in 3D? Yes or no?



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HoangNhatAnh said:
potato_hamster said:

I never made an argument that the 2D nature of the games were meaningless. We are however, talking about Super Nintendo games that are almost 30 years old. Let's not pretend these are demanding games on par with 2D games that were released in the past few years.

Again, we already have a homebrew emulator in SNES9X for the base 3DS that already has perfect emulation in over 85% of Super Nintendo games. There's no reason to suspect that Nintendo can't do even better than that with their own in-house developed emulator considering a) they have an technical team with far more combined expertise and b) they understand the SNES and 3DS hardware better than literally anyone else on the planet. Why would we expect Nintendo to be less successful than you can.

Also, please provide a source that the SNES emulator Nintendo built for the 3DS plays 100% of Super Nintendo games perfectly, and provide a source that Nintendo spent 4 months working on it. Please note that 100% of the games released on the N3DS Virtual Console are already emulated perfectly by the SNES9X base 3DS emulator.

Weaker hardware mean take more time to optimize for emulate, isn't it obvious ? Since when i said 4 months? New 3ds came out in Japan in 2014, SNES VC is 2016 mean 2 years later and you knew New 3ds CPU is 4 times faster than 3ds. Definitely take more times than 2 years like New 3ds, 3 or 4 years? As we see, Switch came out last year, put SNES VC on Switch now is way better choice than 3ds. And all SNES games you mentioned run on 3ds emulator at 60fps in 3D? Yes or no?

I know that English isn't your first language, but I'm having a pretty hard time trying to figure out what you're trying to say for most of this post. I assume you're trying to argue that Nintendo is better of spending their time on making an SNES emulator for Switch instead of putting their efforts in to making a base 3DS emulator today? Of course that's true. Then again, I'm not arguing that Nintendo should do this today, I'm arguing that the could have done it when they were developing the emulator the new 3DS and chose not to. Whether it would take a significant amount of time or effort getting a SNES emulator running on the base 3DS that can play all the games currently available on the N3DS Virtual Console, I'm not about to speculate. It's entirely plausible that the N3DS SNES emulator already works perfectly on the base 3DS for the SNES currently available on the Virtual Console.

And yes, all the SNES games that are currently out for the N3DS Virtual Console are playable on the SNES 9X emulator for the base 3DS at 60fps. I'm not sure what you mean by 3D. These are SNES games. Most of them are 2D. The games on the N3DS Virtual Console aren't 3D games like Star Fox.




potato_hamster said:
HoangNhatAnh said:

Weaker hardware mean take more time to optimize for emulate, isn't it obvious ? Since when i said 4 months? New 3ds came out in Japan in 2014, SNES VC is 2016 mean 2 years later and you knew New 3ds CPU is 4 times faster than 3ds. Definitely take more times than 2 years like New 3ds, 3 or 4 years? As we see, Switch came out last year, put SNES VC on Switch now is way better choice than 3ds. And all SNES games you mentioned run on 3ds emulator at 60fps in 3D? Yes or no?

I know that English isn't your first language, but I'm having a pretty hard time trying to figure out what you're trying to say for most of this post. I assume you're trying to argue that Nintendo is better of spending their time on making an SNES emulator for Switch instead of putting their efforts in to making a base 3DS emulator today? Of course that's true. Then again, I'm not arguing that Nintendo should do this today, I'm arguing that the could have done it when they were developing the emulator the new 3DS and chose not to. Whether it would take a significant amount of time or effort getting a SNES emulator running on the base 3DS that can play all the games currently available on the N3DS Virtual Console, I'm not about to speculate. It's entirely plausible that the N3DS SNES emulator already works perfectly on the base 3DS for the SNES currently available on the Virtual Console.

And yes, all the SNES games that are currently out for the N3DS Virtual Console are playable on the SNES 9X emulator for the base 3DS at 60fps. I'm not sure what you mean by 3D. These are SNES games. Most of them are 2D. The games on the N3DS Virtual Console aren't 3D games like Star Fox.


I think you know i mean 3D mode, right? When turn 3D on, are they still run perfectly at 60fps? I remember Snes9x emulator still have games run at low speed so no, not all. When they were developing the emulator for the new 3DS it was still a long wait till 2016, 3ds is quite weaker than New 3ds so of course it will take a quite longer time.  2017 we have Switch and SNES VC come out for 3ds in 2017 at the earliest is not worth to spend the time and money to research and optimize



HoangNhatAnh said:
potato_hamster said:

I know that English isn't your first language, but I'm having a pretty hard time trying to figure out what you're trying to say for most of this post. I assume you're trying to argue that Nintendo is better of spending their time on making an SNES emulator for Switch instead of putting their efforts in to making a base 3DS emulator today? Of course that's true. Then again, I'm not arguing that Nintendo should do this today, I'm arguing that the could have done it when they were developing the emulator the new 3DS and chose not to. Whether it would take a significant amount of time or effort getting a SNES emulator running on the base 3DS that can play all the games currently available on the N3DS Virtual Console, I'm not about to speculate. It's entirely plausible that the N3DS SNES emulator already works perfectly on the base 3DS for the SNES currently available on the Virtual Console.

And yes, all the SNES games that are currently out for the N3DS Virtual Console are playable on the SNES 9X emulator for the base 3DS at 60fps. I'm not sure what you mean by 3D. These are SNES games. Most of them are 2D. The games on the N3DS Virtual Console aren't 3D games like Star Fox.


I think you know i mean 3D mode, right? When turn 3D on, are they still run perfectly at 60fps? I remember Snes9x emulator still have games run at low speed so no, not all. When they were developing the emulator for the new 3DS it was still a long wait till 2016, 3ds is quite weaker than New 3ds so of course it will take a quite longer time.  2017 we have Switch and SNES VC come out for 3ds in 2017 at the earliest is not worth to spend the time and money to research and optimize

I'm really starting to believe you're having a hard time understanding what I'm saying.

You mean the 3D screen on the 3DS? That actually is controlled by a completely separate part of the console. It has no impact with the ability of the 3DS to play any game. None of the SNES games on the Virtual Console for the 3DS have any type of 3D enhancements. They all run in 2D regardless of how you have your screen set.

As for SNES9X. It is being updated regularly. I provided you a list of game compatibility that actually shows the frame rate for the games as they run on the base 3DS using SNES9X. Over 85% them are emulated perfectly. That includes 60 fps.

And again, I'm not suggesting that IF it would require additonal work to get the SNES emulator to work on the base 3DS they should do that today. But you actually have no grounds claim that Nintendo's current SNES emulator for the New 3DS would not run on the base 3DS. It highly depends on how the emulator is programmed. It's entirely possible would run perfectly well on the base 3DS as is, and you would have to have intimate knowledge on how Nintendo's SNES emulator on the 3DS works to claim otherwise. You simply cannot know the things you are claiming as fact.



HoangNhatAnh said:
EricHiggin said:

If someone wants to spend $250 or whatever the price is on 512GB card, that's their own decision. Buying 2X 256GB cards, especially on sale, would be cheaper than a 512GB and would also give you two separate storage devices. Best graphics they can be is what I said, meaning downgraded to whatever level is necessary to be portable and have a worthwhile battery life based on whatever tech they may end up using. With PS4 getting many smaller indie games, I don't see why the portable wouldn't get them, and why they wouldn't increase with a PS portable on the market. Vita also has plenty of smaller file size games for it, and they may not be compressed quite as well as Nin games but they are still small, and their level of graphics and quality is of course up to the user to decide if it's worth the purchase. Do I want them to constantly be switching between cards? Well that's up to them again, and your the one who said all digital won't work because portable gamers and gamers in general really want physical games, which means bringing them with you on the go and constantly swapping them out if you want to play another. I'm not sure why it was a good thing the other day, and a bad thing today for some reason. Being a PS Plus subscriber, you also would have access to cheaper online store games to begin with, plus your member discount, plus sales, and there are plenty of online sales, so the extra cost of the card ends up the same if not cheaper than buying games on a cart for $50 to $100 each, that is set in stone for good and has no room for extra content on it.

How much a 64GB or higher cart will cost is also a question. Right now Nin won't use them because they are too expensive and Nin/the pubs aren't ok with having to eat the extra cost and don't want to add it to the cost for the consumer. Which is also holding back games they could have now if they just left the decision up to the customer on whether to pay a little more to have access to those bigger games. When Switch offers more storage in larger carts, or micro SD becomes cheaper, or they launch a newer Switch model with more internal storage etc, that will be a good thing and I hope they do, because storage and battery are lacking and holding Switch back some and they could really benefit from a newer model. Their sales are going so well right now though, I don't know if they will feel the need to upgrade so soon. If a PS portable hit the market though, it could potentially mean an upgraded Switch, sooner than later, and for a reasonable price as well, which would be a good thing.

At the moment, none third party is willing to use 32GB cart for Switch, let alone 64GB, that is developers's choice, not Nintendo so ok or not is meaningless if no one use them. Your portable is digital only so it is necessary for several micro sd cards for both AAA, DLCs and indies. Switch at least use cartridge that can fit 16GB game and use cards for multiplayer. Outside Nintendo games, none buy Nintendo system for Western AAA online multiplayer games so no need for many cards, one 256GB card can be enough. Finally, your handheld will come out next year or even 2020, you would think Nintendo won't release a new Switch with stronger chip at that time when Xavier - X3 came out this year already. 3 years later, it will be a lot cheaper

The pubs/devs, however you want to describe them, aren't willing to use larger carts, which means Switch isn't getting their games. What is wrong with charging more for the game due to a larger cart with higher price? If that's such a problem, Switch will always have to wait for third party games. If this price factor is also such a big issue that third parties don't think the games will sell that way, then selling them digitally online for much cheaper, so a PS portable user can download the game and either leave it on the internal storage, or transfer it to their $50 to $250 micro SD card, which will hold up to 5 AAA or 100 indie games, seems like a much better idea, and much better value for your money. No one buys Nin systems for third party games? I've read that quite a few people have bought into Switch with the promise of third party game support, considering that was part of their main message initially showing off NBA and Skyrim at launch. You say Ryzen is too power hungry at 15w and won't last more than an hour compared to X1, yet Xavier specs were just officially announced days ago to use 30w. The lowest power new Tegra available is X2 which isn't all that more capable than X1 and also consumes 7.5w-15w. Is the new Switch going to be way stronger but only have a half hour battery life, or only slightly stronger but with the same battery life?



PS1   - ! - We must build a console that can alert our enemies.

PS2  - @- We must build a console that offers online living room gaming.

PS3   - #- We must build a console that’s powerful, social, costs and does everything.

PS4   - $- We must build a console that’s affordable, charges for services, and pumps out exclusives.

PRO  -%-We must build a console that's VR ready, checkerboard upscales, and sells but a fraction of the money printer.

PS5   - ^ -We must build a console that’s a generational cross product, with RT lighting, and price hiking.

PRO  -&- We must build a console that Super Res upscales and continues the cost increases.

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potato_hamster said:
HoangNhatAnh said:

I think you know i mean 3D mode, right? When turn 3D on, are they still run perfectly at 60fps? I remember Snes9x emulator still have games run at low speed so no, not all. When they were developing the emulator for the new 3DS it was still a long wait till 2016, 3ds is quite weaker than New 3ds so of course it will take a quite longer time.  2017 we have Switch and SNES VC come out for 3ds in 2017 at the earliest is not worth to spend the time and money to research and optimize

I'm really starting to believe you're having a hard time understanding what I'm saying.

You mean the 3D screen on the 3DS? That actually is controlled by a completely separate part of the console. It has no impact with the ability of the 3DS to play any game. None of the SNES games on the Virtual Console for the 3DS have any type of 3D enhancements. They all run in 2D regardless of how you have your screen set.

As for SNES9X. It is being updated regularly. I provided you a list of game compatibility that actually shows the frame rate for the games as they run on the base 3DS using SNES9X. Over 85% them are emulated perfectly. That includes 60 fps.

And again, I'm not suggesting that IF it would require additonal work to get the SNES emulator to work on the base 3DS they should do that today. But you actually have no grounds claim that Nintendo's current SNES emulator for the New 3DS would not run on the base 3DS. It highly depends on how the emulator is programmed. It's entirely possible would run perfectly well on the base 3DS as is, and you would have to have intimate knowledge on how Nintendo's SNES emulator on the 3DS works to claim otherwise. You simply cannot know the things you are claiming as fact.

Over 85% mean not all and New 3ds take at least 2 year to Nintendo put SNES VC on it. I don't said fact but it is not wise to spend too much time to figure out and optimize SNES VC on 3DS while on New 3DS it is much simple and faster, they also need to advertise New 3DS ability so it is good business choice. Also, some games won't ever happen if Nintendo only have 3ds like Minecraft this year, look at Hyrule Warriors Legend 3ds vs New 3ds: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y2J98CvVau4

One question: Do you think psp can run emulator all GBA games? Yes or no?



I don't see a PS Witch (that's how I'm gonna call it) succeeding if it exists just to copy. Videogames need their own identity. Burn the witch!



EricHiggin said:
HoangNhatAnh said:

At the moment, none third party is willing to use 32GB cart for Switch, let alone 64GB, that is developers's choice, not Nintendo so ok or not is meaningless if no one use them. Your portable is digital only so it is necessary for several micro sd cards for both AAA, DLCs and indies. Switch at least use cartridge that can fit 16GB game and use cards for multiplayer. Outside Nintendo games, none buy Nintendo system for Western AAA online multiplayer games so no need for many cards, one 256GB card can be enough. Finally, your handheld will come out next year or even 2020, you would think Nintendo won't release a new Switch with stronger chip at that time when Xavier - X3 came out this year already. 3 years later, it will be a lot cheaper

The pubs/devs, however you want to describe them, aren't willing to use larger carts, which means Switch isn't getting their games. What is wrong with charging more for the game due to a larger cart with higher price? If that's such a problem, Switch will always have to wait for third party games. If this price factor is also such a big issue that third parties don't think the games will sell that way, then selling them digitally online for much cheaper, so a PS portable user can download the game and either leave it on the internal storage, or transfer it to their $50 to $250 micro SD card, which will hold up to 5 AAA or 100 indie games, seems like a much better idea, and much better value for your money. No one buys Nin systems for third party games? I've read that quite a few people have bought into Switch with the promise of third party game support, considering that was part of their main message initially showing off NBA and Skyrim at launch. You say Ryzen is too power hungry at 15w and won't last more than an hour compared to X1, yet Xavier specs were just officially announced days ago to use 30w. The lowest power new Tegra available is X2 which isn't all that more capable than X1 and also consumes 7.5w-15w. Is the new Switch going to be way stronger but only have a half hour battery life, or only slightly stronger but with the same battery life?

People buy Nintendo handheld  for first party and japan third party games exclusive as well as indies. AAA is not really a concern to me. After all, Western gamers want to play on big screen like TV with the best graphic, anyone want the definitive version won't buy a handheld anyway. Charging more or not, if none third party use it then it is useless. And no, many AAA games on Switch like Doom is on 16GB cart with single player, multi is download. Your portable is AAA or indies, Switch is AAA and indies. Nintendo customers always ask for physical even a small indie. I said people won't buy Switch with AAA Western game for multiplayer online because Nintendo online is the weakest, since when i said no one will buy Switch for any third party? You don't seem to remember X1 in Switch is custom and underclock for battery and cooling, they can do the same with X3. Also, games on Nintendo system always have quite lower graphic settings and resolution compared to ps so it will reduce the power hungry as well



Conina said:
HoangNhatAnh said:

X3 is Xavier and X1 chip in Switch is custom. There is no reason to believe X3 won't be custom. 

The only custom of the Switch SoC are the lower clock rates undocked compared to a Pixel C and docked compared to a Shield-TV. Besides that, it is the same Tegra X1 chip

Bold.

HoangNhatAnh said: 

At the moment, none third party is willing to use 32GB cart for Switch, let alone 64GB, that is developers's choice, not Nintendo so ok or not is meaningless if no one use them. Your portable is digital only so it is necessary for several micro sd cards for both AAA, DLCs and indies. Switch at least use cartridge that can fit 16GB game and use cards for multiplayer. Outside Nintendo games, none buy Nintendo system for Western AAA online multiplayer games so no need for many cards, one 256GB card can be enough. Finally, your handheld will come out next year or even 2020, you would think Nintendo won't release a new Switch with stronger chip at that time when Xavier - X3 came out this year already. 3 years later, it will be a lot cheaper.

Bold.

HoangNhatAnh said: 
EricHiggin said: 

The pubs/devs, however you want to describe them, aren't willing to use larger carts, which means Switch isn't getting their games. What is wrong with charging more for the game due to a larger cart with higher price? If that's such a problem, Switch will always have to wait for third party games. If this price factor is also such a big issue that third parties don't think the games will sell that way, then selling them digitally online for much cheaper, so a PS portable user can download the game and either leave it on the internal storage, or transfer it to their $50 to $250 micro SD card, which will hold up to 5 AAA or 100 indie games, seems like a much better idea, and much better value for your money. No one buys Nin systems for third party games? I've read that quite a few people have bought into Switch with the promise of third party game support, considering that was part of their main message initially showing off NBA and Skyrim at launch. You say Ryzen is too power hungry at 15w and won't last more than an hour compared to X1, yet Xavier specs were just officially announced days ago to use 30w. The lowest power new Tegra available is X2 which isn't all that more capable than X1 and also consumes 7.5w-15w. Is the new Switch going to be way stronger but only have a half hour battery life, or only slightly stronger but with the same battery life?

People buy Nintendo handheld  for first party and japan third party games exclusive as well as indies. AAA is not really a concern to me. After all, Western gamers want to play on big screen like TV with the best graphic, anyone want the definitive version won't buy a handheld anyway. Charging more or not, if none third party use it then it is useless. And no, many AAA games on Switch like Doom is on 16GB cart with single player, multi is download. Your portable is AAA or indies, Switch is AAA and indies. Nintendo customers always ask for physical even a small indie. I said people won't buy Switch with AAA Western game for multiplayer online because Nintendo online is the weakest, since when i said no one will buy Switch for any third party? You don't seem to remember X1 in Switch is custom and underclock for battery and cooling, they can do the same with X3. Also, games on Nintendo system always have quite lower graphic settings and resolution compared to ps so it will reduce the power hungry as well

If western gamers only want to play on the big screen, why are Switch sales so high in NA? AAA may not concern you, but based on your past posts, it most certainly matters to everyone else who you speak for apparently. Many AAA games are on Switch? How many? Why so many if the devs/pubs don't care and it doesn't matter and Switch customers don't want them anyway? What's the difference with physical other than the few who like the box collection or premium edition? How is it any different whether Nin loads the game onto the cart at the factory vs the user loading the game onto a card in the device? You mentioned both third party and western AAA. How many specific western AAA games does Nin make? Doesn't Doom have multiplayer? X1 in Switch is not custom, and is simply underclocked when in handheld mode. You said X3 is Xavier, and that they could do it with Xavier, yet it's 30w. Switch 2 would have little choice but to use X2, or another chip that doesn't even exist yet, and you've made it clear that guessing and making up a random idea to fit a claim isn't a valid argument so. Nin and PS systems used to always use highly custom hardware, where as now they only are using semi-custom, if not bone stock. Nin also used hardware that can potentially lead to generational upgrades, as per Nvidia CEO and their 10-20 year outlook, which is unlike Nin, and PS also gave up their all in one device goal they have been going for since they added CD to PS1, DVD to PS2, and BD to PS3. Both Switch and PS4 are fairly safe devices for both companies and don't exactly follow their typical path, so assuming PS will make the portable so it's graphics are so hardcore that the portable would only have a few hours battery life doesn't make much sense. The PS portable would at least match the Switch around 3 hours min for it's most demanding games, at whatever downgraded level they ended up at. Not to mention the battery accessories like Switch has available to it that can double the battery life, which would surely be made for the PS portable as well.



PS1   - ! - We must build a console that can alert our enemies.

PS2  - @- We must build a console that offers online living room gaming.

PS3   - #- We must build a console that’s powerful, social, costs and does everything.

PS4   - $- We must build a console that’s affordable, charges for services, and pumps out exclusives.

PRO  -%-We must build a console that's VR ready, checkerboard upscales, and sells but a fraction of the money printer.

PS5   - ^ -We must build a console that’s a generational cross product, with RT lighting, and price hiking.

PRO  -&- We must build a console that Super Res upscales and continues the cost increases.

Genos8 said:

I don't see a PS Witch (that's how I'm gonna call it) succeeding if it exists just to copy. Videogames need their own identity. Burn the witch!

So like if Sony made a handheld game console, and had a dockable base that displayed the screen on a TV, and you could use separate controllers with the console so you could keep the handheld docked to a base on your TV, and play with a controller on your couch, or just stand the console up and play with a controller - that would be copying Nintendo?

Because if so, Sony "copied" Nintendo with the PSP Go in 2009. Here it is in action.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=by82mKVEeBw&ytbChannel=Game%20Tech%20Reviews

Sony just didn't stick them all in one box.