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Forums - Movies & TV - Top 5 Things I Disliked About SW:TLJ

Nymeria said:
thismeintiel said: 

2. Girl Power, again.  It is more evident than before Rey is just a Mary Sue.  Some people tried to explain away her being so in tuned with the Force, without a single bit of training, because it would be revealed later that her father or mother, or both, were great Jedis.  Welp, surprise, she's a big nobody.  Sold into slavery for some cash.  Now, don't get me wrong, anyone can be a Jedi if they practice enough.  But, the fact is, some are more keyed into the Force than others.  It has already been established that the Skywalker line is very Force sensitive, but training is still needed.  So, what's with Rey?  In the FA, she takes on a Jedi, Kylo, that has been trained for probably 15+ years in the force, and on both sides of it.  She can resist him reading her mind.  She could control troops with her mind.  She took on Kylo in a one on one battle.  And was able to beat him by willing a light saber to her, even though he was bringing it to him, as well.  Again, not a single second of training.

Now, for the LJ.  And keep in mind that she gets ONE lesson from Luke, period.  She can stare in the Dark Side, instantly, without being tempted by it at all.  She takes on Snoke's elite guards, with not a single bit of light saber training.  And no, her flailing it around all by herself for a minute does not count.  Is once again shown to be Kylo's equal by having the same pull on a light saber, only this time it rips in half.  In what was probably the most ridiculous display, she lifts a ton of boulders out of the way with barely any concentration or stress.  Now, just remember how tough it was for Luke to do 3 smaller ones.  Or how hard Yoda had to concentrate to lift the X-Wing out of the swamp on Degobah.  I guess they both didn't have the right part between their legs.  It's really such a shame, because Daisy Ridley is a great actress and I just know she, and her character, deserve so much more than to just be lowered to the status of a Mary Sue.

 

I wanted to respond to this point as a female and someone who tends to like "girl power" when handled well.  I was a Rey apologist for two years. I had a bit of bias of liking her personality scavenging and thought the actress was good. I excused the abilities as teasing at something and a reveal as to why she could do things others cannot.

I was hoping to see her struggle, to have a glimpse at her capacity and then work to control it.  She spends maybe a week on the island, half of which she is denied training, gets one lesson, and suddenly she can just do anything.  This is insulting and cheap to actual character development and story progression.  When I should have been cheering Rey, I felt exactly like some did two years ago of her being a audience insert power fantasy.

How would I have done it? Nothing special maybe, but I'd show her train, fail, learn, improve. For example, she'd want to swing the light sabre around and Luke would say "Start simple, just moving rocks". Rey would struggle, move a rock, get excited, then be given a larger rock she cannot move failing.  Then at the end when she has to move rocks she struggles, but for her friends connects to the force and pulls off the feat.  Emotional catharsis with clear set up and pay off. Instead, she just does it with no strain or tension.

A character I should adore I now care nothing for. If she dies in IX, I'll shrug, if she succeeds, I'll shrug. 

I think we forget that Rey was effective in hand-to-hand combat before VII; that was likely the intent of the bazaar fight scene with Finn.

If you recall, she beat up Finn (a trained stormtrooper) and others with a staff: desert life is rough.



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Arminillo said:
thismeintiel said:

Not sure if this is the one you are talking about, but it does have a few.

Boy, that look he gives the director says it all.

The video was edited to display a bias, but is still pretty convincing. All this does is reaffirm my belief that

Lucas Canon > Disney Canon & Disney Direction > Lucas Direction

Fixed.



Soundwave said:
TruckOSaurus said:

Because you just got exploded and frozen in cold cold space.

In a universe where you can astral project yourself after death, managing to stay alive in a space vacuum for about 20 seconds is where we draw the line of believability? To be honest based on what the Star Wars movies have shown there's nothing there that would theoretically be out of the realm of normal for a Jedi.

Sorry but some laws apply across both the fiction and the real world. For example, a Jedi cannot regrow a severed limb and is not immortal. And force sensitive people do not suddenly become god-like.

Anyway:

https://www.cosmicbooknews.com/mark-hamill-star-wars-last-jedi-hes-not-my-luke-skywalker



TruckOSaurus said:
Soundwave said:
Rey is basically Anakin, except she's not an asshole. Snoke says it clearly in TFA, Rey is the response to Kylo/Snoke from the Force.

Born on a desert planet to a nobody parent(s)? Check.

Chosen specifically by the Force to counter a growing darkness? Check.

Force ability without training? Check. Anakin at 9 years old we're told is able to be the only human capable of flying pods and has Jedi reflexes already. He builds a protocol droid. His power by age 24/25 even without training would've been immense.

Rey and Anakin are not normal Force sensitives.

As for the Leia thing, even though it's not exactly the context I would've liked, I'm glad we got to see Leia use the Force on screen before her character is obviously gone. Being able to move your body through space should be a given for Force sensitive people ... if you can move a rocks or even a freaking X-Wing through the air, why would you not be able to move your body as well?

Because you just got exploded and frozen in cold cold space.

It takes a LONG time to freeze to death in space.



I think it was a brilliant subversion and kind of connected Luke-Anakin-Ben together. The curse of the Skywalker lineage is Hubris. Anakin's pride and hubris lead him to being overconfident in his abilities which lead to his downfall. Ben's Hubris was regarding his place in the universe and thinks that his bloodline is enough to get him anything he wants.

Luke's Hubris is believing that he can do anything he wants because he's a skywalker.



Black Women Are The Most Beautiful Women On The Planet.

"In video game terms, RPGs are games that involve a form of separate battles taking place with a specialized battle system and the use of a system that increases your power through a form of points.

Sure, what you say is the definition, but the connotation of RPGs is what they are in video games." - dtewi

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Lawlight said:
StarOcean said:

Dude, you hate every movie. Like literally, you hate every movie ever made. I don't even know why you're here

Not true. I liked Justice League and Murder on the Orient Express recently. But you're shying away from the fact that you're disregarding actual plot issues brought up by TC.

Well that makes sense, since those 2 were pretty bad.



Goodnightmoon said:
Lawlight said:

Not true. I liked Justice League and Murder on the Orient Express recently. But you're shying away from the fact that you're disregarding actual plot issues brought up by TC.

Well that makes sense, since those 2 were pretty bad.

The general audience loves them both better than TLJ it seems.



Lawlight said:
Goodnightmoon said:

Well that makes sense, since those 2 were pretty bad.

The general audience loves them both better than TLJ it seems.

They really don't, despite how much the general audience overrates them TLJ is still way better rated on IMDB than those 2 movies.



Goodnightmoon said:
Lawlight said:

The general audience loves them both better than TLJ it seems.

They really don't, despite how much the general audience overrates them TLJ is still way better rated on IMDB than those 2 movies.

TLJ has stopped falling yet - 7.8 vs. JL's 7.2 despite SW massive number of fanboys is not "way better". And the percentage of people who liked TLJ is lower than those 2 movies.



Lawlight said:
Goodnightmoon said:

They really don't, despite how much the general audience overrates them TLJ is still way better rated on IMDB than those 2 movies.

TLJ has stopped falling yet - 7.8 vs. JL's 7.2 despite SW massive number of fanboys is not "way better". And the percentage of people who liked TLJ is lower than those 2 movies.

A 7.8 is quite higher than a 7.2 and a 6.8 no matter how you want to spin it, in any case half of those fanboys giving the movie extremelly low scores as a consequence of a kiddy overreaction are the cause this movie is not above 8 as it should, thankfully critics paint a way more accurate picture here:

Murder on the Orient Express - Metascore: 52
Justice League - Metascore: 45 
The Last Jedi - Metascore: 86

Last edited by Goodnightmoon - on 21 December 2017