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Forums - Movies & TV - George Lucas Was Right About the Star Wars Fanbase

Goodnightmoon said:

If you overanalize the old movies to death you will find tons of plot holes and little things that doesn't make sense, but why would anyone do that to beggin with? They are great movies anyways. Of course nobody does that cause the old trilogy is sacred an untouchable but the new ones, that have no nostalgia attached and are made by Disney, need to be destroyed because reasons. Star wars is a a saga full of fantasy and unexplicable things that puts the enjoyment and the cinematographic experience above the writting, and this has always been like this, from the first one, they were initially made for 12 year old kids, they never pretended to be the fucking Goodfather, why does people now take them as they were the most serious movies ever or some kind of high literature?

Some people will always take things too far. Star Wars is just pop culture, a film that Lucas wasn't too confident about it's success, it's not high art. At least stuff like Red Letter Media's reviews are funny so I don't mind when people start over analyzing for that.



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Goodnightmoon said:

If you overanalize the old movies to death you will find tons of plot holes and little things that doesn't make sense, but why would anyone do that to beggin with? They are great movies anyways. Of course nobody does that cause the old trilogy is sacred an untouchable but the new ones, that have no nostalgia attached and are made by Disney, need to be destroyed because reasons. Star wars is a a saga full of fantasy and unexplicable things that puts the enjoyment and the cinematographic experience above the writting, and this has always been like this, from the first one, they were initially made for 12 year old kids, they never pretended to be the fucking Goodfather, why does people now take them as they were the most serious movies ever or some kind of high literature?

The key word being overanalyze.  Any movie can be overanalyzed to find some plot holes that aren't the most obvious.  However, TLJ's faults are all right there in front of you.  It doesn't take much thought to realize not only the many holes, but also the countless letdowns.  This is how the most famous scene in ESB would have played out in this film.

Darth Vader: Obi Wan never told you the truth about your father.
Luke: He told me you killed him.
Darth Vader: (close up reaction shot) Oh, I guess he did then.  

Hope audience laughs.  Next shot is a close up of a Porg.

And it's true that Star Wars isn't the most thought provoking series.  But, and this is a freaking HUGE but, it is also not a Micheal Bay Transformer film where you should turn your brain off and just enjoy all the pretty images and big booms, with it's messages written so poorly, on the nose, and dumbed down to appeal to kids.  If that's what you want from your SW movies, then I guess continue enjoying this film.  For the fans that demand a little more from our SW movies, we'll just stay away and watch the box office drop dramatically.



thismeintiel said:
Goodnightmoon said:

If you overanalize the old movies to death you will find tons of plot holes and little things that doesn't make sense, but why would anyone do that to beggin with? They are great movies anyways. Of course nobody does that cause the old trilogy is sacred an untouchable but the new ones, that have no nostalgia attached and are made by Disney, need to be destroyed because reasons. Star wars is a a saga full of fantasy and unexplicable things that puts the enjoyment and the cinematographic experience above the writting, and this has always been like this, from the first one, they were initially made for 12 year old kids, they never pretended to be the fucking Goodfather, why does people now take them as they were the most serious movies ever or some kind of high literature?

The key word being overanalyze.  Any movie can be overanalyzed to find some plot holes that aren't the most obvious.  However, TLJ's faults are all right there in front of you.  It doesn't take much thought to realize not only the many holes, but also the countless letdowns.  This is how the most famous scene in ESB would have played out in this film.

Darth Vader: Obi Wan never told you the truth about your father.
Luke: He told me you killed him.
Darth Vader: (close up reaction shot) Oh, I guess he did then.  

Hope audience laughs.  Next shot is a close up of a Porg.

And it's true that Star Wars isn't the most thought provoking series.  But, and this is a freaking HUGE but, it is also not a Micheal Bay Transformer film where you should turn your brain off and just enjoy all the pretty images and big booms, with it's messages written so poorly, on the nose, and dumbed down to appeal to kids.  If that's what you want from your SW movies, then I guess continue enjoying this film.  For the fans that demand a little more from our SW movies, we'll just stay away and watch the box office drop dramatically.

Except Michael Bay transformer movies are horribly directed, you don't need to analyze them to see that, it's evident enough, the last 2 SW movies on the other side are brilliant in that department, and no, those plot holes are not that big for the kind of movie we are talking about, many of them have an explanations that many so called "real fans" seem unable to see for some reason I don't get and the rest are not big enough to ruin the movie, you are making a huge hyperbole and I insist, we are talking about a saga where in one of its most praised films the galaxy is saved cause a completely random tribe of teddy bears think C3PO is God and kill the imperial enemies with sticks and rocks.

Last edited by Goodnightmoon - on 24 December 2017

Goodnightmoon said:

If you overanalize the old movies to death you will find tons of plot holes and little things that doesn't make sense, but why would anyone do that to beggin with? They are great movies anyways. Of course nobody does that cause the old trilogy is sacred an untouchable but the new ones, that have no nostalgia attached and are made by Disney, need to be destroyed because reasons. Star wars is a a saga full of fantasy and unexplicable things that puts the enjoyment and the cinematographic experience above the writting, and this has always been like this, from the first one, they were initially made for 12 year old kids, they never pretended to be the fucking Goodfather, why does people now take them as they were the most serious movies ever or some kind of high literature?

"Some kind of high literature?"

This applies to comic books, tv shows, movies, manga, graphic novels and regular books. It's what makes the stories within them make sense. What happens if you just give batman superpowers and suddenly hates Gotham? You'll end up with pissed off fans. It's why the fans of Alien don't like the new movies. it's why alot of trekkies don't really like the new star trek show but they'll watch it anyway because of the name. You don't realize how big the star wars universe is. There's a lot of books that used to be a part of star wars but when disney bought the IP, they removed the books from the univierse. It was a slap to the face....

Just imagine if sony bought mario from nintendo then made mario look like nathan drake and all of the games were now "cinematic".   



Aeolus451 said:

Just imagine if sony bought mario from nintendo then made mario look like nathan drake and all of the games were now "cinematic".   

Couldn't you think in a comparison that made even less sense than that? So Luke is not an inmaculated saint that can't do no wrong cause now is old and has new life experiences, does that makes the whole movie totally inconsistent with the rest of SW? No it doesn't.



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Goodnightmoon said:

If you overanalize the old movies to death you will find tons of plot holes and little things that doesn't make sense, but why would anyone do that to beggin with? They are great movies anyways. Of course nobody does that cause the old trilogy is sacred an untouchable but the new ones, that have no nostalgia attached and are made by Disney, need to be destroyed because reasons. Star wars is a a saga full of fantasy and unexplicable things that puts the enjoyment and the cinematographic experience above the writting, and this has always been like this, from the first one, they were initially made for 12 year old kids, they never pretended to be the fucking Goodfather, why does people now take them as they were the most serious movies ever or some kind of high literature?

 Cinemasins overanalyzed them and I laughed through the whole thing. Still enjoyed them afterwards and forgot the complaints. Mostly because they don't jump out at you and Force you to notice them.



Goodnightmoon said:
Aeolus451 said:

Just imagine if sony bought mario from nintendo then made mario look like nathan drake and all of the games were now "cinematic".   

Couldn't you think in a comparison that made even less sense than that? So Luke is not an inmaculated saint that can't do no wrong cause now is old and has new life experiences, does that makes the whole movie totally inconsistent with the rest of SW? No it doesn't.

Actually, the actor who played the par t of Luke even said that's not Luke Skywalker. Luke wouldn't have done any of that. So you're the one not making any sense. Try to be open minded and see it from the other side instead of defending SW incoherently. 



Goodnightmoon said:
thismeintiel said:

The key word being overanalyze.  Any movie can be overanalyzed to find some plot holes that aren't the most obvious.  However, TLJ's faults are all right there in front of you.  It doesn't take much thought to realize not only the many holes, but also the countless letdowns.  This is how the most famous scene in ESB would have played out in this film.

Darth Vader: Obi Wan never told you the truth about your father.
Luke: He told me you killed him.
Darth Vader: (close up reaction shot) Oh, I guess he did then.  

Hope audience laughs.  Next shot is a close up of a Porg.

And it's true that Star Wars isn't the most thought provoking series.  But, and this is a freaking HUGE but, it is also not a Micheal Bay Transformer film where you should turn your brain off and just enjoy all the pretty images and big booms, with it's messages written so poorly, on the nose, and dumbed down to appeal to kids.  If that's what you want from your SW movies, then I guess continue enjoying this film.  For the fans that demand a little more from our SW movies, we'll just stay away and watch the box office drop dramatically.

Except Michael Bay transformer movies are horribly directed, you don't need to analyze them to see that, it's evident enough, the last 2 SW movies on the other side are brilliant in that department, and no, those plot holes are not that big for the kind of movie we are talking about, many of them have an explanations that many "fans" seem unable to see for some reason (maybe they aren't the brigthest bulbs in the room?) and the rest are not big enough to ruin the movie, you are making a huge hyperbole and I insist, we are talking about a saga where in one of its most praised films the galaxy is saved cause a tribe of teddy bears think C3PO is God and kill the imperial enemies with sticks and rocks.

Again, I have to laugh at the fans in quotations.  As if true fans should just except anything that is shit out and labeled SW.  Sorry, that's a fanboy.  We are fans, not fanboys.  And when you have a movie this poorly written AND directed, with so many plot points that lead to absolutely nothing interesting and with a main plot that, at best, was the plot of a 1/2 hr show stretched into 2 hrs, just labeling it SW does not appease us.  And yes, I said directed.  While some shots are nicely done, the director did a horrible job of piecing them together to give a cohesive film.  And those reaction shots/scenes done for cheap laughs were incredibly jarring.  Hmm, sounds a lot like Micheal Bay.

And yes, ROTJ is highly praised.  It was a great conclusion to the trilogy.  If you only focus on one aspect of it to downgrade it to the likes of this film, that's the real nitpick, as the rest of it was great.  Still, you may notice, it isn't quite as highly praised as the first two.  And the main reason people do give is the Ewoks.  Of course, some give them a pass because even though they were cute, they were viscous little critters who killed a lot of Stormtroopers without remorse.  They are FAR above the like of the creatures here that only served the purpose of looking cute to sell some toys.



Aeolus451 said:
Goodnightmoon said:

Couldn't you think in a comparison that made even less sense than that? So Luke is not an inmaculated saint that can't do no wrong cause now is old and has new life experiences, does that makes the whole movie totally inconsistent with the rest of SW? No it doesn't.

Actually, the actor who played the par t of Luke even said that's not Luke Skywalker. Luke wouldn't have done any of that. So you're the one not making any sense. Try to be open minded and see it from the other side instead of defending SW incoherently. 

The actor is just that, an actor, and he didn't said that at all, read the whole sentence:

"I got into trouble because I was quoted as saying to Rian that ‘I fundamentally disagree with everything you decided about Luke,’ and it was inartfully phrased. What I was, was surprised at how he saw Luke. And it took me a while to get around to his way of thinking, but once I was there it was a thrilling experience. I hope it will be for the audience, too"



A few things about me.
-I'm a huge DC fan. I've enjoyed every movie they have made except Suicide Squad which made me want my money back.

-I'm a Marvel fan but I couldn't stomach Thor: The Dark World at all. I even liked Ben Affleck as Daredevil despite it being universally panned.

,-I love Star Wars but I find the Disney movies are getting worse and worse. I want to like them! I can't. I watch 1-6 a few times a year. I carry 1-7 on my tablet everywhere I go. When I watch the Disney films, they just aren't Star Wars.

It pained me to see what happened to Terminator and Aliens. At some point I had to accept that the movies had gotten bad to me by my own standards. I quit watching them in theaters if at all. To me, that's what Star Wars has become and this movie is the one that pushed me over the edge.