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Forums - Politics Discussion - Donald Trump: How Do You Feel about Him Now? (Poll)

 

Last November,

I supported him and I still do - Americas 91 15.77%
 
I supported him and I now don't - Americas 16 2.77%
 
I supported him and I still do - Europe 37 6.41%
 
I supported him and I now don't - Europe 7 1.21%
 
I supported him and I still do - Asia 6 1.04%
 
I supported him and I now don't - Asia 1 0.17%
 
I supported him and I still do - RoW 15 2.60%
 
I supported him and I now don't - RoW 2 0.35%
 
I didn't support him and still don't. 373 64.64%
 
I didn't support him and now do. 29 5.03%
 
Total:577
numberwang said:

I loved the Womens march coming out with an email minutes after his pick with the pick's name being left as "XX" meaning they had it pre-typed and were just going to replace that with the name. Guessing they did a replace XXX with "name", but didn't have 3 x's there, as later in the email it does show his name.

They also spelt the persons name wrong in the later part of the email they did have the replace function work.

Another publication used female pronouns when describing the pick, meaning they also assumed that he was going to pick the girl and had pre-wrote their article as well.

 

Edit: and people wonder why we don't give any protestors the light of day. Majority I doubt could tell you one fact about the person who was picked. Hell, put their sign down and they probably couldn't even tell you the persons name. Toss onto that the amount of times these 'peaceful' protests have been anything but peaceful.



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massimus said:

Our constitution is not limitations on the people, it’s limitations on our government and of course it’s necessary. State and federal. Federal regulation is not the same, not even close. Regulations are penalties on the people.

He resigned because people made a stink about his spending abuse. It’s not new, that’s all I’m
saying. He should have been fired like everyone else in that agency should have when nobody gave a shit. “Sloppy” lmao. Yea ok.. You praise the other frauds for covering their tracks? They didn’t, you just didn’t care then because you didn’t have a deep seeded hatred for the president.

Ok we’ll be specific then, I did lol. Would you like me to go through more? Pick one and I will tell you how it helps the economy. I’m free market , I can always find a reason.





Pruitt isn't the first or last person in Trump administration abusing their use of government money.  What makes him special.  As with any dirty dealings when you follow the money you find out all kind of good stuff.  The carrot on the stick is the abuse of government funds.  The meat to it all is him getting paid by the same lobby firms for basically giving them what they want. 

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/21/us/politics/scott-pruitt-oklahoma-epa.html

When people want others to stop digging into the more meaty issues they resign before those allegations and other stuff can rise to the surface.  I will leave it at that.  There is way more to Scott playing with government funds for vacations that's on the table but I am sure the Trump administration would love for it to stop right there.

Not sure where you get that I am praising anyone for being corrupt.  I am just saying that as someone who is corrupt in government, he was about as sloppy as they come.  If you are going to play the game, you probably should know how to play it, because he sure did make it easy for his opponents to bury him quick.

I believe I said this before but I do not either hate or love Trump, I neither hated or loved Obama or even Bush.  Hell I voted for Bush and did not vote for Obama.  My opinion concerning Trump is because I did my research on him and I found him to be just as dirty, corrupt, amoral and dishonest.  Currently I see him in the same light as Pruitt.  Just another sloppy politician making money deals and playing a game with little experience or concept of what he is doing.  Hell, I am not even sure if I care if he runs another term.  If this is what America want, we will see how much good or bad he does in the years to come.  

Regulations are penalties on businesses.  They are put in place because businesses do not police themselves.  If business are left unchecked as we have seen they will do whatever it takes for profit no matter the cost.  We only have to look at the recent financial crisis to see how many people saw how the housing system was going to collapse and it was open season to make as much money as quickly as possible no matter the damage.

Anyway, I doubt we will budge on our ideals on this subject.  I am not against removing regulations and the ones you presented I we can go on for days arguing the pros and cons.  I am not so concerned about a balls to the wall effort to improve the economy over my drinking water so I doubt we will see eye to eye on any of those points.



Take these results with a grain of salt. The opposition to Trump is really unhinged in the U.S., and I'm sure some went to great lengths to create multiple sock puppet accounts just to say they never supported him over and over again.



SpokenTruth said:
massimus said:

You couldn’t afford your economics on a state budget, you need endless federal debt and control to sustain your vision. It’s why Cali hasn’t gone single payer yet. They have the power to do so but the cost would collapse them.

Sorry but single payer is actually cheaper than our current system. 

The reason Cali, and any state, is having a difficult time going single payer is multi-faceted.  First, the state would need to consolidate any Medicaid, Medicare and SS into the plan and that requires the president to sign off on (which he won't do).  Even if they just wanted to retain the already taxed money for those entitlements within the state they would still need federal approval.  The other problem is that it would take a massive chunk out of the insurance industry which, as to be expected, is fighting like hell to prevent single payer because of that (they already paid millions to Cali politicians to vote against previous bills).  A lot of people would lose their insurance based jobs - which is one of the bigger deterrents to going single payer for most people.

Back to the costs.  Why are costs high to start with?  Insurance.  Insurance always drives up the cost of the very product or service it insures.  I'll give a brief example to illustrate.  Torrence Memorial Medical Center in LA charges insurance companies $135 per blood test but they only charge $16 to a patient if they pay out of pocket and that's still a profit.  This is common for all hospitals, doctors, pharmacies, etc...in the US because they know insurance will pay it.  And sometimes, by law, the insurance companies have no means to bargain for lower costs. Single payer would very much be cheaper.  We just lack the political will and long term planning to make it happen.

 

Or do you really think prescription medications in the US actually cost 100x more here than in Canada, Europe, Asia, etc....?

LOL Cheaper for who? If you sacrificed the state budget maybe lol. Most politicians these days don't even know what the term "spending cut" means. It's going to be 400 billion annually forever? That will never change or go higher? Cali is pulling in about 2 and half trillion a year, you just have to find a way to steal it. What's 400 billion of it, right? It's for a good cause. Cali's entire state budget is like 200 billion. Time to siphon those gas tanks.

That's a very large chunk of the California economy and that's just the attempt at a new policy. Based on what, CBO guesses? I  just read something about the millionaires in California fleeing because the taxes are crazy. If the rich aren't paying the tax then who will? Businesses? They will move too. California is lucky that it's such a beautiful place. It's probably the only thing keeping people there.

So do it, tack it on the bill and use it as a tax credit until they are officially exempt from the federal tax. I want to be exempt from federal taxes like social security and I don't want single payer. They are going bankrupt anyways, something needs to be done with those regardless. They were supposed to be in an untouchable lock box but they blew the lid off of that shit years ago to pay for failing, stupid policy. It's going to be broke by the time it's my turn to collect. I shouldn't be forced into that shit deal.

Who is currently stopping Cali on a federal level? The insurance companies don't have any authority over a state. The whole paid for politicians thing is a joke. I don't buy into that simple protestor bullshit lol. They did the same thing with the NRA. I hate politicians as much as anyone else but "insurance companies bribing politicians" is highly illegal and needs evidence. Singling out one lobby proves nothing and there are limits to what they can do. Literally everything is lobbied, even foreign countries lmao. Oh no collusion! Maybe the the lobbies like them because they actually agreed on things before hand. I know that's crazy... Can you name one vote that flipped because of a lobby? "He was going to vote this until X bribed him with illegal favors". I can't think of any lol. Marco Rubio was against gun rights until the NRA donated like 10k to his campaign lmao. MURDERER!

Also the federal government took over the insurance companies so that kinda falls on its face from the get go. The health insurance lobby is the federal government and it's a disaster. It's the cost dude, it's crazy. California isn't some little Scandinavian country run on oil, it's the 5th largest economy in the world lol. I say go for it, I just don't want to bail them out on a federal level... Annually. I'm not saying we don't need better insurance in general, I'm saying single payer isn't something I want. I don't want some utility worker that doesn't give a shit, I want a doctor. I don't want DMV healthcare lol.

There is nothing wrong with cheaper generic pills and insurance. I'm not saying we can't be better but that particular route is stupid in my view. Those aren't the only 2 options lol.  I'm not against states trying all kinds of different things out but leave the federal level alone. It's not built for that. ACA is a massive failure and made shit worse. Let's states handle their own shit.



Machiavellian said:
massimus said:

Our constitution is not limitations on the people, it’s limitations on our government and of course it’s necessary. State and federal. Federal regulation is not the same, not even close. Regulations are penalties on the people.

He resigned because people made a stink about his spending abuse. It’s not new, that’s all I’m
saying. He should have been fired like everyone else in that agency should have when nobody gave a shit. “Sloppy” lmao. Yea ok.. You praise the other frauds for covering their tracks? They didn’t, you just didn’t care then because you didn’t have a deep seeded hatred for the president.

Ok we’ll be specific then, I did lol. Would you like me to go through more? Pick one and I will tell you how it helps the economy. I’m free market , I can always find a reason.





Pruitt isn't the first or last person in Trump administration abusing their use of government money.  What makes him special.  As with any dirty dealings when you follow the money you find out all kind of good stuff.  The carrot on the stick is the abuse of government funds.  The meat to it all is him getting paid by the same lobby firms for basically giving them what they want. 

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/21/us/politics/scott-pruitt-oklahoma-epa.html

When people want others to stop digging into the more meaty issues they resign before those allegations and other stuff can rise to the surface.  I will leave it at that.  There is way more to Scott playing with government funds for vacations that's on the table but I am sure the Trump administration would love for it to stop right there.

Not sure where you get that I am praising anyone for being corrupt.  I am just saying that as someone who is corrupt in government, he was about as sloppy as they come.  If you are going to play the game, you probably should know how to play it, because he sure did make it easy for his opponents to bury him quick.

I believe I said this before but I do not either hate or love Trump, I neither hated or loved Obama or even Bush.  Hell I voted for Bush and did not vote for Obama.  My opinion concerning Trump is because I did my research on him and I found him to be just as dirty, corrupt, amoral and dishonest.  Currently I see him in the same light as Pruitt.  Just another sloppy politician making money deals and playing a game with little experience or concept of what he is doing.  Hell, I am not even sure if I care if he runs another term.  If this is what America want, we will see how much good or bad he does in the years to come.  

Regulations are penalties on businesses.  They are put in place because businesses do not police themselves.  If business are left unchecked as we have seen they will do whatever it takes for profit no matter the cost.  We only have to look at the recent financial crisis to see how many people saw how the housing system was going to collapse and it was open season to make as much money as quickly as possible no matter the damage.

Anyway, I doubt we will budge on our ideals on this subject.  I am not against removing regulations and the ones you presented I we can go on for days arguing the pros and cons.  I am not so concerned about a balls to the wall effort to improve the economy over my drinking water so I doubt we will see eye to eye on any of those points.

He isn't the first or the last person in the government lol. They were angelic and the moral compass before Trump took office? No politicians are scumbags, you just hate Trump so much you can't see passed it. I can read your deflection bro lol, remember i'm the king of that shit ;).  What is it with you guys and the lobbying lol? Wasting our fucking money is enough reason to get fired in my book, the lobby conspiracy is unnecessary. I don't see anything wrong with the EPA regulations that got lifted and I wasn't lobbied. We disagree, it's cool.

You said he's sloppy, that's his offense. Obama made his fraud and abuse look good, that's what it sounded like you were implying. Get mad about nationalizing and militarizing the police forces but say nothing about the EPA buying millions in guns and ammunition. WTF does the EPA need an armed task force for, that's what i want to know lol.

You hate him bro, or you're like the democrats and using him to stir up the stupid in their base for voter turnout. He's not politically correct but he's not dumb, I don't care what anyone says. He is running circles around these people. And the anger bro, it's insane lol. I don't think you are on that level but Trump as person definitely clouds your judgement. Bush was a terrible president and so was Obama. Trump policy for the most part aside from a few big things, I'm digging it. Scotus picks, I'm digging it. The constant shit talk is unorthodox, he doesn't just roll over and take it like Bush did. It can be both amusing and irritating to me but it's not really important. Results matter.

Not always. The epa doesn't just go after businesses. I'm not against basic and broad law, shit like Anti-trust laws and monopolies. They aren't left unchecked, in a free market the market decides. Choice is the answer, not government. The housing crisis blew up when the federal government decided that everyone deserved a house and would pay banks to support sub prime mortgage loans. Banks were forced to take those mortgages. It's not some evil conspiracy lmao. That's what happens when the feds try to be generous, idiot bubbles that are subsidized by the American tax dollar.

You should be more focused on the economy if you want single payer lol. Yeah it's cool dude, nice convo.

 

 

 



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massimus said:

You should be more focused on the economy if you want single payer lol. Yeah it's cool dude, nice convo.

Lol, thats never going to happen in the US.  Way to much lobby money against it and way to many Republicans in Congress to ever let it pass.  I would personally open a thread saying I was wrong if Trump even attempted to something like this.  



SpokenTruth said:
Ladies and gentlemen, the president of the United States:

“I have broken more Elton John records, he seems to have a lot of records. And I, by the way, I don’t have a musical instrument. I don’t have a guitar or an organ. No organ. Elton has an organ. And lots of other people helping. No we’ve broken a lot of records. We’ve broken virtually every record. Because you know, look I only need this space. They need much more room. For basketball, for hockey and all of the sports, they need a lot of room. We don’t need it. We have people in that space. So we break all of these records. Really we do it without like, the musical instruments. This is the only musical: the mouth. And hopefully the brain attached to the mouth. Right? The brain, more important than the mouth, is the brain. The brain is much more important.”

https://www.mediaite.com/tv/trump-goes-on-nonsensical-rant-about-elton-john-organs-and-the-brain/

The thing is I watched the original video that statement was taken from and even with context it's still confusing



massimus said:

He isn't the first or the last person in the government lol. They were angelic and the moral compass before Trump took office? No politicians are scumbags, you just hate Trump so much you can't see passed it. I can read your deflection bro lol, remember i'm the king of that shit ;).  What is it with you guys and the lobbying lol? Wasting our fucking money is enough reason to get fired in my book, the lobby conspiracy is unnecessary. I don't see anything wrong with the EPA regulations that got lifted and I wasn't lobbied. We disagree, it's cool.

You said he's sloppy, that's his offense. Obama made his fraud and abuse look good, that's what it sounded like you were implying. Get mad about nationalizing and militarizing the police forces but say nothing about the EPA buying millions in guns and ammunition. WTF does the EPA need an armed task force for, that's what i want to know lol.

You hate him bro, or you're like the democrats and using him to stir up the stupid in their base for voter turnout. He's not politically correct but he's not dumb, I don't care what anyone says. He is running circles around these people. And the anger bro, it's insane lol. I don't think you are on that level but Trump as person definitely clouds your judgement. Bush was a terrible president and so was Obama. Trump policy for the most part aside from a few big things, I'm digging it. Scotus picks, I'm digging it. The constant shit talk is unorthodox, he doesn't just roll over and take it like Bush did. It can be both amusing and irritating to me but it's not really important. Results matter.

Not always. The epa doesn't just go after businesses. I'm not against basic and broad law, shit like Anti-trust laws and monopolies. They aren't left unchecked, in a free market the market decides. Choice is the answer, not government. The housing crisis blew up when the federal government decided that everyone deserved a house and would pay banks to support sub prime mortgage loans. Banks were forced to take those mortgages. It's not some evil conspiracy lmao. That's what happens when the feds try to be generous, idiot bubbles that are subsidized by the American tax dollar.

You should be more focused on the economy if you want single payer lol. Yeah it's cool dude, nice convo.

This is what I would call projection.  For some reason you believe I have to hate Trump to dislike how he does things.  This is like Trump saying, a Mexican heritage Judge cannot try a case against Trump University because he is Mexican.  You are basically trying to make it appear anyone who does not support your Opinion of Trump must hate him. I see this alot from people who support Trump. 

You say that Trump isn't dumb and that is your opinion.  I believe he is just dumb.  He says dumb stuff all the time.  He do dumb shit all the time.  He speaks like he is 12 years old.  His administration and how he manage people about as sloppy and dishevel as any other president I have seen, He is Hemorrhaging people left and right.  The majority of the time he does not seem prepared when he meets world leaders.  I believe he is a complete and utter idiot.  Just like you do not care what other people say when it comes to Trump, that's your opinion but because I do not share it, I must be a hater in your eyes.  You say he is running circles around people but the idiot keeps getting in his own way.  He barely can get anything done with a Republican majority.  He cannot get his wall funded.  He said he would fix healthcare but basically did nothing.  Besides the US Ban, his success rate as a negotiator is crap.

No the housing crisis did not blow up because the federal government decided that everyone needed a house.  Subprime loans being sold on the market then the market betting they would default then banks buying and selling and betting against those loans cause the crash.  Once the market saw the flaw, they went into overdrive selling, buying, betting against those loans and everyone making a killing knowing this crap was going to go nuclear.  Banks were not forced to take those mortgages, they played the game and made billions.  You need to read more into it because your knowledge is just surface material.



Machiavellian said:
massimus said:

You should be more focused on the economy if you want single payer lol. Yeah it's cool dude, nice convo.

Lol, thats never going to happen in the US.  Way to much lobby money against it and way to many Republicans in Congress to ever let it pass.  I would personally open a thread saying I was wrong if Trump even attempted to something like this.  

Not any time soon on a federal level (thankfully) but I’m talking about a state level which is well within their right. The lobbying excuse again lol, it’s like the go to when people don’t have an answer apparently. Money in politics is bullshit, some communist just won in New York being outspent 10 to 1. Lobbying isn’t running the streets.



Machiavellian said:
massimus said:

He isn't the first or the last person in the government lol. They were angelic and the moral compass before Trump took office? No politicians are scumbags, you just hate Trump so much you can't see passed it. I can read your deflection bro lol, remember i'm the king of that shit ;).  What is it with you guys and the lobbying lol? Wasting our fucking money is enough reason to get fired in my book, the lobby conspiracy is unnecessary. I don't see anything wrong with the EPA regulations that got lifted and I wasn't lobbied. We disagree, it's cool.

You said he's sloppy, that's his offense. Obama made his fraud and abuse look good, that's what it sounded like you were implying. Get mad about nationalizing and militarizing the police forces but say nothing about the EPA buying millions in guns and ammunition. WTF does the EPA need an armed task force for, that's what i want to know lol.

You hate him bro, or you're like the democrats and using him to stir up the stupid in their base for voter turnout. He's not politically correct but he's not dumb, I don't care what anyone says. He is running circles around these people. And the anger bro, it's insane lol. I don't think you are on that level but Trump as person definitely clouds your judgement. Bush was a terrible president and so was Obama. Trump policy for the most part aside from a few big things, I'm digging it. Scotus picks, I'm digging it. The constant shit talk is unorthodox, he doesn't just roll over and take it like Bush did. It can be both amusing and irritating to me but it's not really important. Results matter.

Not always. The epa doesn't just go after businesses. I'm not against basic and broad law, shit like Anti-trust laws and monopolies. They aren't left unchecked, in a free market the market decides. Choice is the answer, not government. The housing crisis blew up when the federal government decided that everyone deserved a house and would pay banks to support sub prime mortgage loans. Banks were forced to take those mortgages. It's not some evil conspiracy lmao. That's what happens when the feds try to be generous, idiot bubbles that are subsidized by the American tax dollar.

You should be more focused on the economy if you want single payer lol. Yeah it's cool dude, nice convo.

This is what I would call projection.  For some reason you believe I have to hate Trump to dislike how he does things.  This is like Trump saying, a Mexican heritage Judge cannot try a case against Trump University because he is Mexican.  You are basically trying to make it appear anyone who does not support your Opinion of Trump must hate him. I see this alot from people who support Trump. 

You say that Trump isn't dumb and that is your opinion.  I believe he is just dumb.  He says dumb stuff all the time.  He do dumb shit all the time.  He speaks like he is 12 years old.  His administration and how he manage people about as sloppy and dishevel as any other president I have seen, He is Hemorrhaging people left and right.  The majority of the time he does not seem prepared when he meets world leaders.  I believe he is a complete and utter idiot.  Just like you do not care what other people say when it comes to Trump, that's your opinion but because I do not share it, I must be a hater in your eyes.  You say he is running circles around people but the idiot keeps getting in his own way.  He barely can get anything done with a Republican majority.  He cannot get his wall funded.  He said he would fix healthcare but basically did nothing.  Besides the US Ban, his success rate as a negotiator is crap.

No the housing crisis did not blow up because the federal government decided that everyone needed a house.  Subprime loans being sold on the market then the market betting they would default then banks buying and selling and betting against those loans cause the crash.  Once the market saw the flaw, they went into overdrive selling, buying, betting against those loans and everyone making a killing knowing this crap was going to go nuclear.  Banks were not forced to take those mortgages, they played the game and made billions.  You need to read more into it because your knowledge is just surface material.

Projection would be me saying you hate Trump when in reality I hate trump. There is no projection here lol. You are free to dislike him, I’m just pointing out your single focus. You said he wouldn’t be the first or last in the trump administration like it’s something new in government lol. I’m saying the government has always been like that, it’s why trump was elected. “The swamp” etc. I’m not against the guy getting the boot. That’s the difference, people are actually getting fired for abuse. You mention all of these people resigning, good. In previous administrations they weren’t fired, they were free to abuse our systems freely and you didn’t give a shit. That’s all I’m pointing out.

 

Well you support people like Pelosi who still thinks Bush is president so that’s not saying much lol. I can count on 2 hands the people in congress that aren’t dumber than shit, complete fucking morons. Trump is a genius compared to these people. Trump signs law, he doesn’t make law. Obama tried to make law through executive orders and Trump dismantled most of it. It’s much harder to get shit done through congress the right way, especially when both parties hate you. He has done outstanding considering but he isn’t without his flaws, I agree.

 

You seem to be operating under the premise that the federal government isn’t in almost complete control of the housing and financial sectors lol. The “banks are evil” bullshit holds no water. No real bank would support subprime mortgages, there is no faster way to ruin your business. They were backed and bailed out. What good is owning a bunch of foreclosed houses if the market is compete shit? They’re giving away houses now, they made money on the feds.

Last edited by massimus - on 11 July 2018