By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Nintendo Discussion - DigitalFoundry: Skyrim for Switch

Hynad on 25 November 2017
curl-6 said:
bonzobanana said:

By chance this video came up this morning.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ljTX9R5QhA

Again it shows the Switch have limited draw distance with lots of popping compared to ps3. From what I understand there is a CPU component to animated objects in the distance and both portable and docked Switch cpu performance is the same and have the same issue. So in this one regard it does look like the Switch's limited cpu performance is having some effect. GPU can't be a factor because surely docked is comfortably stronger than ps3 by some margin. Memory bandwidth is another possible cause but I'd go with cpu myself although it could be a factor. On paper though the Switch cpu performance always looked a bit weak and was much reduced compared to the Tegra's maximum mhz. However as that video states there are few games of that era that required such high CPU resources.

It doesn't detract from the great overall package the Switch is becoming and I still feel there is a possibility of unlocking some cpu performance with a later firmware as later Switch revisions are using improved fabrication. I use PSP as an example of this. They improved the mhz in a later firmware that had a knock on effect to the earlier PSP's battery life in some games but by that time developers were needing a bit more performance to handle more ambitious games. I think originally locked at 222mhz but went to a 333mhz speed for some games with a later firmware revision. It would be nice to see a docked cpu speed increase anyway.

It's likely a later Switch will have a dedicated customised Tegra chip unlike the current off the shelf chip and will see many background improvements I'm sure. One likely improvement is wifi that doesn't tax the console as much to allow improvements in multiplayer frame rates. 

I honestly feel some of these games like Skyrim and LA Noire could be improved with time as Nintendo improves the firmware to unlock some more performance.

Yeah I saw that one. DF do point out that the game was tailored to the PS3's Cell CPU; if I recall correctly, the Xbox 360 version struggled too as a result. Going from tasks divided among the PS3's 6 specialized SPUs and single central core to the 3 standardized cores available on Switch and 360 is naturally not going to be the best fit. I imagine Switch would fare a bit better with a game that was more suited to the 360 given they share a straightforward tri-core configuration. 

The way the industry has been going, I would be surprised if we don't see a Switch revision down the line that allows for improved performance, similar to New 3DS and PS4 Pro.

EDIT: Misread the game you were both referring to (Thought it was about Skyrim).

Move along.

Last edited by Hynad - on 25 November 2017

Around the Network
bonzobanana on 25 November 2017
Miyamotoo said:
bonzobanana said:

By chance this video came up this morning.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ljTX9R5QhA

Again it shows the Switch have limited draw distance with lots of popping compared to ps3. From what I understand there is a CPU component to animated objects in the distance and both portable and docked Switch cpu performance is the same and have the same issue. So in this one regard it does look like the Switch's limited cpu performance is having some effect. GPU can't be a factor because surely docked is comfortably stronger than ps3 by some margin. Memory bandwidth is another possible cause but I'd go with cpu myself although it could be a factor. On paper though the Switch cpu performance always looked a bit weak and was much reduced compared to the Tegra's maximum mhz. However as that video states there are few games of that era that required such high CPU resources.

It doesn't detract from the great overall package the Switch is becoming and I still feel there is a possibility of unlocking some cpu performance with a later firmware as later Switch revisions are using improved fabrication. I use PSP as an example of this. They improved the mhz in a later firmware that had a knock on effect to the earlier PSP's battery life in some games but by that time developers were needing a bit more performance to handle more ambitious games. I think originally locked at 222mhz but went to a 333mhz speed for some games with a later firmware revision. It would be nice to see a docked cpu speed increase anyway.

It's likely a later Switch will have a dedicated customised Tegra chip unlike the current off the shelf chip and will see many background improvements I'm sure. One likely improvement is wifi that doesn't tax the console as much to allow improvements in multiplayer frame rates. 

I honestly feel some of these games like Skyrim and LA Noire could be improved with time as Nintendo improves the firmware to unlock some more performance.

Talking about LA Noire port, DF stated that LA Noire was built specifically with PS3 Cell CPU on mind, so basically LA Noire engine and hole game was built to take most of PS3 Cell CPU, and only around 8 months later game was ported to Xbox 360, and that's actually one of only few multiplatform games that runs better on PS3 compared to Xbox360 from same reason. So when you port game that's specifically made just for one type of hardware on mind, you will hardly use most of that other hardware. I mean this is only Switch multiplatform game that has some drawbacks compared to PS3 version of same game, and that because reason I mentioned.

Also keep on mind that this Switch version will probably have further patches and optimisations while PS3 version was with all patches, and of course we still talking about 1st year ports, future ports will be better and more optimised in any case.

Saying that, Switch CPU is bottleneck but is not big problem (CPU is bottleneck also for PS4/ XB1),  but things would be even better if CPU is for instance 1.5GHz instead of 1GHz, but that would definatly effect battery life in curent Switch model.

They could tweak it for docked mode though. Going from 1ghz to 1.5ghz is a huge increase that would remove many of the issues seen in docked Switch performance in theory.  For Skyrim I think the draw distance is worse on Switch compared to Xbox 360 at times from what I can see, on the open plains close to the central castle I forget the name of. I personally don't think the Switch has comparable CPU performance to PS4/XB1 but accept those consoles didn't push the envelope when it came to CPU performance. 

Surprised to see it is passable on humble budget windows tablets with intel atom processors. Such windows tablets may have greater cpu performance than Switch but much weaker graphics hardware.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EHtLrLfDrdk

Looking at the draw distance on Xbox 360 looks pretty good but animated objects i.e. other cars looks cut back significantly to me. Which again would indicate CPU more than memory bottleneck I think.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NPoiykMH5o

It gives an idea of overall performance of Switch and as you say things may improve with developers getting more familar with the Switch hardware and the development software and Switch firmware both improving and becoming more optimised.

I'd love to see Fallout 4 come to Switch. It's seems quite possible now. I'd prefer they dial back the graphic quality in order to try to improve draw distance though.



Miyamotoo on 25 November 2017
bonzobanana said:
Miyamotoo said:

Talking about LA Noire port, DF stated that LA Noire was built specifically with PS3 Cell CPU on mind, so basically LA Noire engine and hole game was built to take most of PS3 Cell CPU, and only around 8 months later game was ported to Xbox 360, and that's actually one of only few multiplatform games that runs better on PS3 compared to Xbox360 from same reason. So when you port game that's specifically made just for one type of hardware on mind, you will hardly use most of that other hardware. I mean this is only Switch multiplatform game that has some drawbacks compared to PS3 version of same game, and that because reason I mentioned.

Also keep on mind that this Switch version will probably have further patches and optimisations while PS3 version was with all patches, and of course we still talking about 1st year ports, future ports will be better and more optimised in any case.

Saying that, Switch CPU is bottleneck but is not big problem (CPU is bottleneck also for PS4/ XB1),  but things would be even better if CPU is for instance 1.5GHz instead of 1GHz, but that would definatly effect battery life in curent Switch model.

They could tweak it for docked mode though. Going from 1ghz to 1.5ghz is a huge increase that would remove many of the issues seen in docked Switch performance in theory.  For Skyrim I think the draw distance is worse on Switch compared to Xbox 360 at times from what I can see, on the open plains close to the central castle I forget the name of. I personally don't think the Switch has comparable CPU performance to PS4/XB1 but accept those consoles didn't push the envelope when it came to CPU performance. 

Surprised to see it is passable on humble budget windows tablets with intel atom processors. Such windows tablets may have greater cpu performance than Switch but much weaker graphics hardware.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EHtLrLfDrdk

Looking at the draw distance on Xbox 360 looks pretty good but animated objects i.e. other cars looks cut back significantly to me. Which again would indicate CPU more than memory bottleneck I think.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NPoiykMH5o

It gives an idea of overall performance of Switch and as you say things may improve with developers getting more familar with the Switch hardware and the development software and Switch firmware both improving and becoming more optimised.

I'd love to see Fallout 4 come to Switch. It's seems quite possible now. I'd prefer they dial back the graphic quality in order to try to improve draw distance though.

We already talked about that, that would quite complicate things, because with just higher GPU clocks they can just use that for higher resolution, but with higher CPU clocks also, that would mean even bigger differences between portable and handheld mode and more work for developers. Also we don't know how much more Switch would heat with higher CPU clocks.

Skyrim for Switch is better in any case, going from almost locked frame rate, higher resolution and better visuals. Maybe PS3/360 have better draw distance but that don't really change nothing because it's very obvious how much better Switch version is. But again, same point that I made in previous post,  Switch version will probably have further patches and optimisations, and of course we still talking about 1st year ports, future ports will be better and more optimised in any case.

Personally, I would love more that they port Fallout 3 instead Fallout 4, but everything is possible. In any case, it will be very interesting to see what next AAA game will be ported.

Last edited by Miyamotoo - on 26 November 2017

curl-6 on 25 November 2017
Podings said:
Considering how Doom, L.A. Noir, and this game are all from the first slew of "quick and dirty" ports, this all bodes very well for how games could look on the system a couple years from now.

For me it's Mario Odyssey that makes me think that if a first wave title looks this nice, Switch titles in 2019 and beyond should be very pretty indeed.



flakiwoleju on 25 November 2017

Switch> PS4 fake 30fps 4K HAHAHA



Around the Network
Miyamotoo on 26 November 2017
curl-6 said:
Podings said:
Considering how Doom, L.A. Noir, and this game are all from the first slew of "quick and dirty" ports, this all bodes very well for how games could look on the system a couple years from now.

For me it's Mario Odyssey that makes me think that if a first wave title looks this nice, Switch titles in 2019 and beyond should be very pretty indeed.

Agree, even in 2018. games will be probably be first games from studios, and AAA ports like Doom, La Noire and Skyrim are basically first AAA ports on Switch, so of course in following years next AAA ports will more optimised and will push Switch hardware much stronger.

Last edited by Miyamotoo - on 26 November 2017

curl-6 on 26 November 2017
Miyamotoo said:
curl-6 said:

For me it's Mario Odyssey that makes me think that if a first wave title looks this nice, Switch titles in 2019 and beyond should be very pretty indeed.

Agree, even in 2018. games will be probably be first games from studios, and AAA ports like Doom, La Noire and Skyrim are basically first AAA ports on Switch, so of course in following years next AAA ports will more optimised and will push Switch hardware much stronger.

Yeah it's the second generation of Switch games from studios like EAD and Shin'en that I can't wait to see; once these studios have more experience with the hardware and learn how to squeeze the most out of it, the results should outstrip anything we've seen so far.



Wyrdness on 27 November 2017

Didn't run into any issues this weekend on the business trip, loading times are around 8-10 seconds as well.